Comments Thread For: Daily Bread Mailbag: Spence-Garcia, Mayweather, Usyk, More

[djb914]

LOL, Berbick and Holmes whipped Ali like they were his daddy, and Angelo Dundee said before the Holmes fight, he never saw Ali look as good in the gym before a fight, Ali pulled off 2 great upsets Sonny Liston twice and Foreman and Ali was the most recognizable and liked person in the World, But Frazier beat him once and gave him hell all 3 times, a case could be made that Norton won all 3 fights and Jimmy Young was clearly robbed, and Ali's trainer Angelo Dundee said he never saw Ali look so good in Training before a fight and that he was doing 15-20 rounds on his toes several times a week, Ali was in his late 30's (38-39) in his final fight versus Berbick, which is NOT old for a Heavyweight, especially one that never had alcohol or drugs in his life, always got plenty of sleep and was an absolute fanatic about his conditioning. Well Liked NO QUESTION, Charismatic ABSOLUTELY, A great Fighter UNQUESTIONED, but THEE Best who ever lived NO.

[Citizen Koba]

Speaking of that fight how come the WBC hasnt said for the fight to go to purse bid???

GGG vs Charlo? Because there's no belt on the line. That ish is completely optional. Why on earth would it go to a purse bid when it looks like one of the fighters simply doesn't have any interest in the fight?

What they've done is basically say that if Golovkin wants another shot at Canelo he's got to go through Jermall, but neither fighter is under any obligation to make that fight. Problem is the entire world knows that if Canelo chooses to fight GGG (or Jermall for that matter) then he will regardless of whether they've fought each other, and if conversely if Canelo chooses to go another direction then neither of them will get the fight regardless who wins.

[Shadoww702]

GGG vs Charlo? Because there's no belt on the line. That ish is completely optional. Why on earth would it go to a purse bid when it looks like one of the fighters simply doesn't have any interest in the fight?

What they've done is basically say that if Golovkin wants another shot at Canelo he's got to go through Jermall, but neither fighter is under any obligation to make that fight. Problem is the entire world knows that if Canelo chooses to fight GGG (or Jermall for that matter) then he will regardless of whether they've fought each other, and if conversely if Canelo chooses to go another direction then neither of them will get the fight regardless who wins.

It would be a VERY bad look if Canelo chose GGG over Charlo if Charlo did beat ggg. Now who ever Canelo fights the other ones will say Canelo ducked him. Canelo is the champ and noone really knows who is #1 after that. I guess Canelo will just have to fight them both at sometime???

[TheCell8]

Breadman is a real boxing fan, great Q&A.

However, I disagree with having Inoue top 5 P4P. I think that's stretching it a bit. He's certainly top 10, and he certainly passes the eye test (which is important). But I reserve the top 5 for those special fighters who can adapt and are multi dimensional. So far, we haven't seen Inoue in any real trouble or any stiff test. We haven't seen him tested, and maybe he's just so good he doesn't give his opponents a chance. But for me, Mikey has to be top 5 over him. Canelo as well.

[Citizen Koba]

It would be a VERY bad look if Canelo chose GGG over Charlo if Charlo did beat ggg. Now who ever Canelo fights the other ones will say Canelo ducked him. Canelo is the champ and noone really knows who is #1 after that. I guess Canelo will just have to fight them both at sometime???

We got a situation here where maybe neither Charlo nor GGG are actually going to be in any particular rush to fight I think... a loss for either puts the Canelo pay day out of reach, but NOT fighting kinda leaves the door open for both of 'em. Furthermore as long as Charlo can hold out for 50% purse I think it'd be an option of last resort for GGG - that would almost certainly be a sizable pay cut for him, though I'm not sure how it'd square up for Jermall compared to a regular purse.

As for Canelo - dude can fight pretty much who he wants... the move to fight Fielding for a 168 'title' was a smart one I think. Multiplies his options vastly.

[The D3vil]

i dont see the logic having canelo so high and ggg not on your p4p list, i know ggg is fading but he arguably won both fights vs canelo, shows he is still at very top level of the sport

but great Q and A as always

I can't answer for Bread, but as someone who thought GGG won both fight (just like 80% of the known universe), I'm a believer that you have to respect the official outcome.

It's just like Ward/Kovalev, where most people thought Kov won, but officially Ward won both fights, thus he was the new no.1

Results have to matter at some point

LOL, Berbick and Holmes whipped Ali like they were his daddy, and Angelo Dundee said before the Holmes fight, he never saw Ali look as good in the gym before a fight, Ali pulled off 2 great upsets Sonny Liston twice and Foreman and Ali was the most recognizable and liked person in the World, But Frazier beat him once and gave him hell all 3 times, a case could be made that Norton won all 3 fights and Jimmy Young was clearly robbed, and Ali's trainer Angelo Dundee said he never saw Ali look so good in Training before a fight and that he was doing 15-20 rounds on his toes several times a week, Ali was in his late 30's (38-39) in his final fight versus Berbick, which is NOT old for a Heavyweight, especially one that never had alcohol or drugs in his life, always got plenty of sleep and was an absolute fanatic about his conditioning. Well Liked NO QUESTION, Charismatic ABSOLUTELY, A great Fighter UNQUESTIONED, but THEE Best who ever lived NO.

Dude, you don't know ***** about boxing.

1. Trevor Berbick & Larry Holmes beat an old Ali long after he had 3 years robbed from him for not going to Vietnam. Hell, Berbick beat him 7 years after an aging Ali beat Foreman and Holmes beat him 6 years after the Foreman fight.

2. Since when does having a good training camp negate the fact that you're old? Ali was old when he fought Holmes. Too old to be fighting.

3. Frazier beat an Ali just coming back from missing 3 years in his prime. 1966 Ali destroys Frazier 3 times.

4. I'll give you Norton, but once again, Ali was old.

5. Dude, late 30s is not old for heavyweights NOW. 40 years ago, it was ancient. Joe Louis was done by 38, Rocky Marciano was done at 32. Ezzard Charles at 34. Joe Frazier at 33. Floyd Patterson at 37. Guys weren't dominating until 40 regularly back then

It's not like now where in every sport guys are dominating to 40 even in basketball and football.

[Shadoww702]

We got a situation here where maybe neither Charlo nor GGG are actually going to be in any particular rush to fight I think... a loss for either puts the Canelo pay day out of reach, but NOT fighting kinda leaves the door open for both of 'em. Furthermore as long as Charlo can hold out for 50% purse I think it'd be an option of last resort for GGG - that would almost certainly be a sizable pay cut for him, though I'm not sure how it'd square up for Jermall compared to a regular purse.

As for Canelo - dude can fight pretty much who he wants... the move to fight Fielding for a 168 'title' was a smart one I think. Multiplies his options vastly.

I feel you are 100% correct in your assessments. The loser of GGG/Charlo gets no shot at Canelo. Right now both have a 50/50 chance so theyll wait.

And the 168 I understand also. Honestly the weak leak to me is Zurdo?? If Bob would give him up. That would a big fight on Cicno De Mayo or Sept.

I want to root for him soo bad but I just dont see anything special?? He doesnt have much power and hes always going 12 rounds with guys supposedly way below his skill level??? IMO Canelo beat him easily if he can handle this size.

[Citizen Koba]

I feel you are 100% correct in your assessments. The loser of GGG/Charlo gets no shot at Canelo. Right now both have a 50/50 chance so theyll wait.

And the 168 I understand also. Honestly the weak leak to me is Zurdo?? If Bob would give him up. That would a big fight on Cicno De Mayo or Sept.

I want to root for him soo bad but I just dont see anything special?? He doesnt have much power and hes always going 12 rounds with guys supposedly way below his skill level??? IMO Canelo beat him easily if he can handle this size.

Yeah, Zurdo is the obvious one - I was kinda high on the kid a coupla years ago, but he's somehow failed to live up to the early promise - as a result he's also not gained the popularity he could have, though there's no doubt that this would still be a big, big fight on either of the Mexican holidays.

Like you say a big kid, but I can't really see a way for Canelo to lose - there's a reason Zurdo ain't stopping the guys he should be (and I thought he was kinda lucky to get the W against Vlasov a few years back) and it ain't because he ain't powerful but because he can't land his power against anyone half decent. What other chance does he have other than a hail Mary? His length should be a huge advantage for him at 168 but he doesn't seem to know how to use it.

[Shadoww702]

Yeah, Zurdo is the obvious one - I was kinda high on the kid a coupla years ago, but he's somehow failed to live up to the early promise - as a result he's also not gained the popularity he could have, though there's no doubt that this would still be a big, big fight on either of the Mexican holidays.

Like you say a big kid, but I can't really see a way for Canelo to lose - there's a reason Zurdo ain't stopping the guys he should be (and I thought he was kinda lucky to get the W against Vlasov a few years back) and it ain't because he ain't powerful but because he can't land his power against anyone half decent. What other chance does he have other than a hail Mary? His length should be a huge advantage for him at 168 but he doesn't seem to know how to use it.

I was very high on Zurdo as well and the last couple of fights have been kind of boring and he seems to be just going through the motions like its an everyday job. I thought he was going to be a star but not anymore. Bob Arum is probably just saving his 0 to cash out with him. Im sure TR would let him fight Canelo.

[u122564]

I can't answer for Bread, but as someone who thought GGG won both fight (just like 80% of the known universe), I'm a believer that you have to respect the official outcome.

It's just like Ward/Kovalev, where most people thought Kov won, but officially Ward won both fights, thus he was the new no.1

Results have to matter at some point



Dude, you don't know ***** about boxing.

1. Trevor Berbick & Larry Holmes beat an old Ali long after he had 3 years robbed from him for not going to Vietnam. Hell, Berbick beat him 7 years after an aging Ali beat Foreman and Holmes beat him 6 years after the Foreman fight.

2. Since when does having a good training camp negate the fact that you're old? Ali was old when he fought Holmes. Too old to be fighting.

3. Frazier beat an Ali just coming back from missing 3 years in his prime. 1966 Ali destroys Frazier 3 times.

4. I'll give you Norton, but once again, Ali was old.

5. Dude, late 30s is not old for heavyweights NOW. 40 years ago, it was ancient. Joe Louis was done by 38, Rocky Marciano was done at 32. Ezzard Charles at 34. Joe Frazier at 33. Floyd Patterson at 37. Guys weren't dominating until 40 regularly back then

It's not like now where in every sport guys are dominating to 40 even in basketball and football.

Well said re Ali. im not his biggest fan however he is the best heavy ever. v berbick he was showing signs of parkinsons as well as aging.
Ali also gave rematches after his close fights. frazier beat him so he 2 more times and won them both. norton beats him then he gives him 2 more fights (close second fight however the third was convincing). he fights patterson and liston multiple times too.
the guy fought and beat 4 gold medalists (patterson, frazier, foreman, and spinks). he is THE best HW ever.