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Old 05-07-2019, 12:13 AM #91
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Originally Posted by mikehdaddy View Post
I agree with you on Ali. He was great, but not the greatest of all time. We’ll never know how great he was, as in my opinion he benefited significantly from at least a couple of fixed fights (likely both Liston fights, and possibly the Norton fights), and extremely generous judging late in his career. I heard an interview with the authors of “Ali By the Numbers” and they said in some of Ali’s later fights there were rounds that Ali won, or drew, in which he literally did not land a single punch.

I suspect Ezra Charles’ defensive style would make him a very strong fighter today.

I think Mike Tyson is overrated. He looked spectacular in his early career because his handlers put him against substandard talent. The moment he ran up against tall lanky fighters with a strong jab and no fear, he had problems and lost fights.
I’ll back u up on Ali and Tyson being overrated. But being overrated shows how much fans loved you and is actually a great compliment. It’s still prize fighting. It’s what u can generate. My dad said Tyson would eventually lose to a Evander Holyfield back in ‘88. He bet on it when it happened too. Also thought Norton could have got both those wins. Still I think Ali could potentially beat anyone. But so could Vitali.
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Old 05-07-2019, 03:20 AM #92
ShoulderRoll ShoulderRoll is offline
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Originally Posted by Morandis View Post
Pains me a great deal to say this, but in Mexico we grossly overrate Julio César Chávez.

Besides him, it's gotta be Pipino Cuevas. Nice career, but quite probably the worst boxer ever to be inducted into the Hall Of Fame.
Chavez was a great fighter and arguably the most accomplished to ever come out of Mexico. I don't think he's overrated at all.
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Old 05-07-2019, 09:45 AM #93
Morandis Morandis is offline
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Chavez was a great fighter and arguably the most accomplished to ever come out of Mexico. I don't think he's overrated at all.
Oh in Mexico he is. Popular belief here is that he's the greatest boxer who's ever lived; we also believe that he'd beat basically every current and past fighter; that he DID NOT lose to Sweet Pea; that he only fought the best of the best; and so on.

I think he's one of the top 4 or 5 boxers of the last 50 years. But here everything about him is romanticized.
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Old 05-07-2019, 01:32 PM #94
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- -Salvador Sanchez-

Better career and title record than SRLeonard and all accomplished by age 23.

And like the very greatest of heroes, he died tragically.

R.I.P...
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Old 05-08-2019, 07:24 PM #95
billeau2 billeau2 is offline
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Originally Posted by Morandis View Post
Pains me a great deal to say this, but in Mexico we grossly overrate Julio César Chávez.

Besides him, it's gotta be Pipino Cuevas. Nice career, but quite probably the worst boxer ever to be inducted into the Hall Of Fame.
HA!!! Glad someone else said it for a change...Every one of these threads I "apologetically" say that Chavez was imo overrated.


Sweet Pea outclassed him for one thing.
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Old 05-08-2019, 07:38 PM #96
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Originally Posted by billeau2 View Post
HA!!! Glad someone else said it for a change...Every one of these threads I "apologetically" say that Chavez was imo overrated.


Sweet Pea outclassed him for one thing.
- -undefeated in his 90th fight, Chav proved to be mortal, but pea chose to clown when he shoulda been fighting.

No matter, Lou Duva kept pea swaddled until it was obvious that Chav was slipping.
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Old 05-09-2019, 12:34 AM #97
billeau2 billeau2 is offline
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Originally Posted by QueensburyRules View Post
- -undefeated in his 90th fight, Chav proved to be mortal, but pea chose to clown when he shoulda been fighting.

No matter, Lou Duva kept pea swaddled until it was obvious that Chav was slipping.
Pea didn't just beat Chavez he outclassed him and showed what a great boxer could do.

Yeah of course its a conspiracy...
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Old 05-09-2019, 02:26 PM #98
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Pea didn't just beat Chavez he outclassed him and showed what a great boxer could do.

Yeah of course its a conspiracy...
- Lou fed Chavez Meldrick as a feeler, the results being disasterous.

And pray tell us the level Pea was operating at in his 90th fight?

We wanna know the truth!!!
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Old 05-09-2019, 04:04 PM #99
billeau2 billeau2 is offline
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Originally Posted by QueensburyRules View Post
- Lou fed Chavez Meldrick as a feeler, the results being disasterous.

And pray tell us the level Pea was operating at in his 90th fight?

We wanna know the truth!!!
YOu wouldn't know the truth if it came and womped you as hard as a Houdini starched shirt!

There are conspiracies...It took me many years to realize that and come more down on the side of Shoulder Roll for example, but old pugs in gyms are not exactly the planning types.

Sweet Pea was really good and showed that a really good boxer could be a problem for Chavez. Duran did not get outclassed by leonard the same way...though that second fight ending was a shame.

Truth is I couldn't even tell you why entirely...just think he was overrated compared to other great Messican fighters. Sanchez was so much better, could do more things in the ring.

Last edited by billeau2; 05-09-2019 at 04:09 PM.
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Old 05-10-2019, 10:24 AM #100
ShoulderRoll ShoulderRoll is offline
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There's no shame in losing to Pernell Whitaker (even though the fight was dubiously ruled a draw officially.) Sweet Pea is one of the best lightweights of all time.

Regardless, Chavez was a terrific fighting machine and can make a legitimate claim to being Mexico's best. I watch Golovkin attempt to cut off the ring and apply pressure like he used to do and it's only a pale imitation of the real thing.
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