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Old 07-19-2018, 10:40 AM #61
Dempsey-Louis Dempsey-Louis is offline
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At one point, 1922, while Doc Kerans was trying to free himself from Tex Rickard's hooks, he (Kearns) toyed with a possible Jack Johnson - Dempsey Mexico City fight; using it as negotiating leverage. He made some newspaper announcements, but they don't read like he was serious, just working the press; like he was floating a trial balloon. I think at one point he claimed he would travel to Mexico to check out the venue, but he never got south of San Francisco. -- Of course Johnson was all in.

Kearns was desperately trying to find a western based fight (like Shelby) so he could get Dempsey away from Rickard. In 1922 he (Kearns) was filling up the newspapers with all kinds of possible fights, all not in the New York area (Rickard's backyard). -- At one point Kearns claimed he was negotiating a Harry Greb fight in Phily (which he really wasn't) just as the NYSAC threatened to to strip Dempsey of his title if he didn't fight Harry Wills, Kearns pulled Harry Greb out of his ass and had the newspapers distracted for a week; Muldoon (NYSAC) had to back off on his threat to strip Dempsey.

At one point Kearns even sought to make a Harry Wills fight, so long as the fight was in Montreal and not New York (Rickard's backyard). Tammny Hall blocked that fight; it seems impossible to tell when Kearns was lying and when he wasn't.

I never heard anything about a 'private fight' I don't even understand what that means.
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Old 07-19-2018, 11:50 AM #62
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--- The saga of Kearns trying to ditch Rickard that resulted in Dempsey trying to ditch Kearns that left Wills and Dempsey willing to fight but with no credible promoter or financial backing has been elucidated extensively in previous threads.

I posted evidence that there was some big interest in a JJ/Dempsey fight, but again, usual suspects in denial.

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As I mentioned, I have the article of their fight as presented as the writer remembered it being told to him by Dempsey before he passed away. There was a single attribution to the defunct Brooklyn Eagle.

We know JJ turned down a basement bareknucks fight for a thousand bucks against Jeffries when he when in the bar Jeff frequented to harass him, but this fight would have been high stakes gold rush money that JJ could've made a fortune on.

I never stated the fight as a fact, only that the report of the fight exists and there was big money available for a fight between the two. That seems to set off an uproar in the bowels of the usual ninnies to put them in a dangerous state of apoplexy...911ALERT***
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Old 07-19-2018, 01:46 PM #63
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Originally Posted by QueensburyRules View Post
--- The saga of Kearns trying to ditch Rickard that resulted in Dempsey trying to ditch Kearns that left Wills and Dempsey willing to fight but with no credible promoter or financial backing has been elucidated extensively in previous threads.

I never stated the fight as a fact, only that the report of the fight exists and there was big money available for a fight between the two. That seems to set off an uproar in the bowels of the usual ninnies to put them in a dangerous state of apoplexy...911ALERT***
Does that mean I am not allowed to state it again?

Why do you think I disagree with you? I read the same article and I agree the fight was there, I only differently believe that Kearns saw it more as leverage than an actual fight to pursue, but we agree the fight was there.
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Old 07-19-2018, 01:53 PM #64
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P.S. Dempsey-Johnson in '22 ?

I think it looks much like Tyson-Holmes; too much power and youth going against diminished skills.

Dempsey by KO in four rounds.
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Old 07-19-2018, 01:58 PM #65
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Originally Posted by QueensburyRules View Post
--- The saga of Kearns trying to ditch Rickard that resulted in Dempsey trying to ditch Kearns that left Wills and Dempsey willing to fight but with no credible promoter or financial backing has been elucidated extensively in previous threads.

I posted evidence that there was some big interest in a JJ/Dempsey fight, but again, usual suspects in denial.

Image View Removed. Please Click Here.


As I mentioned, I have the article of their fight as presented as the writer remembered it being told to him by Dempsey before he passed away. There was a single attribution to the defunct Brooklyn Eagle.

We know JJ turned down a basement bareknucks fight for a thousand bucks against Jeffries when he when in the bar Jeff frequented to harass him, but this fight would have been high stakes gold rush money that JJ could've made a fortune on.

I never stated the fight as a fact, only that the report of the fight exists and there was big money available for a fight between the two. That seems to set off an uproar in the bowels of the usual ninnies to put them in a dangerous state of apoplexy...911ALERT***
Sounds just like when Shannon Briggs was pining for a fight with Klitschko, yet the entire public knew it was a sham.
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Old 07-19-2018, 02:00 PM #66
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For your boxing knowledge and insightful threads. - Barnburner For being a noble gent and for top posts! - Sugarj To one of the nicest members on this forum. Knows boxing also! - Terry A For all the Boxing knowledge shared - BulgariasFinest For a great guy - jazluvr 
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Originally Posted by Dempsey-Louis View Post
Does that mean I am not allowed to state it again?

Why do you think I disagree with you? I read the same article and I agree the fight was there, I only differently believe that Kearns saw it more as leverage than an actual fight to pursue, but we agree the fight was there.
ANY fight can be "there". That doesn't make it a viable sporting event.
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Old 07-19-2018, 02:39 PM #67
Dempsey-Louis Dempsey-Louis is offline
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Originally Posted by JAB5239 View Post
ANY fight can be "there". That doesn't make it a viable sporting event.
Agreed! -- not surprisingly Mexico was the only venue anyone could put together; the NYSAC was trying to stop Willard from fighting claiming he was a 'shot fighter.' I doubt New York would have sanctioned a Dempsey-Johnson fight.

Johnson started calling for the fight even before he was released from prison but few took him seriously; even before Johnson's release Doc Kearns was already poo-pooing the fight [article below]

P.S. The article suggests that Johnson was trying to get a Wills fight as well, but that New Jersey would refuse to sanctioned the fight.


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Old 07-19-2018, 02:53 PM #68
QueensburyRules QueensburyRules is offline
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Originally Posted by Dempsey-Louis View Post
Does that mean I am not allowed to state it again?

Why do you think I disagree with you? I read the same article and I agree the fight was there, I only differently believe that Kearns saw it more as leverage than an actual fight to pursue, but we agree the fight was there.
--- I was supplementing you, not in disagreement.

The fight was there like thousands of others never coming to fruition as happens in every era.
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Old 07-19-2018, 06:36 PM #69
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Big difference between newspaper articles concerning a potential fight vs the fight actually occurring. You inferred Dempsey and Johnson actually fought. They did not. Again just like every night on aol boxing YOU LIED.
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Old 07-19-2018, 07:21 PM #70
Dempsey-Louis Dempsey-Louis is offline
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--- I was supplementing you, not in disagreement.

The fight was there like thousands of others never coming to fruition as happens in every era.
Cool -- sorry I misunderstood. -- I thought the Jeffries 'in the basement' challenge was an interesting one - I had never heard that before - was the fight to be 'bare knuckle' ?

Tyson had made the same noise once but of course no one today would ever walk away from a 20 million dollar payday so everyone knew it was PR; back then such a thing could have happened, the money would have been made off the side bets.
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