Foreman-Frazier breakdown: Foreman's style analyzed

[BKM-]

I stumbled upon this brilliant video, it perfectly explains what I've always said about Foreman in that he was an old school type of fighter who used the grappling-based boxing style of the 19th/early 20th century.



A lot of boxing fans lack the understanding that posters like billeau2 have about this style of fighting. So they assume Foreman was just clumsy and pushed his opponents around using only brute strength.

But the guy who made the video really nailed it, he explains how Foreman's hands-on approach had a clear purpose to it and worked perfectly especially against opponents like Frazier. They were detailed manouvers that really worked.

I will say though that this style required a hell of a physical specimen to be successful and needed a modern touch(such as the sledgehammer left jab of Foreman, the cutting off the ring skills etc.) so Archie Moore and the Saddler's were geniuses for spotting this. George's immense physical strength, punching power, chin and willpower were a perfect fit.

[Dempsey-Louis]

Interesting, good analysis, it taught me to hold a new respect for Foreman's defense; I wish there had been more information as to which 'old timers' he was emulating. -- Thank you.

[BKM-]

Interesting, good analysis, it taught me to hold a new respect for Foreman's defense; I wish there had been more information as to which 'old timers' he was emulating. -- Thank you.

You're welcome. I too learned new things from this video. Years ago I did study the greco-roman wrestling boxing styles of the 19th century fighters but it's kind of obscure info and it's illustrated through photos like you saw in this video, so you don't really get the full understanding without video demonstrations like we have of modern boxing techniques.

And it was about the clinch mostly, what this video also went into were the defensive and offensive pushing techniques. They're subtle enough to where they're not illegal(refs rarely warned Foreman although he did go too far at times, sometimes he pushed a guy all the way to the other side of the ring like it was nothing) but like I said, when you have a specimen like Foreman doing it even those moves are so effective because the guy was an absolute monster.

[QueensburyRules]

--- See Wlad/Povetkin for textbook turn of the 20th century LPRR rules still in force in the day. Love that fight.

[Dempsey-Louis]

You're welcome. I too learned new things from this video. Years ago I did study the greco-roman wrestling boxing styles of the 19th century fighters but it's kind of obscure info and it's illustrated through photos like you saw in this video, so you don't really get the full understanding without video demonstrations like we have of modern boxing techniques.

And it was about the clinch mostly, what this video also went into were the defensive and offensive pushing techniques. They're subtle enough to where they're not illegal(refs rarely warned Foreman although he did go too far at times, sometimes he pushed a guy all the way to the other side of the ring like it was nothing) but like I said, when you have a specimen like Foreman doing it even those moves are so effective because the guy was an absolute monster.

Yesterday I just happen to read the Nevada State rules; if you take the rule literally then pushing an opponent off you should be OK, but not pushing him around the ring. It seems the refs actually handled Foreman's behavior correctly, except when he pushed the other guy across the ring of course.

NAC 467.675  Acts constituting fouls in boxing.

18.  Pushing an opponent about the ring or into the ropes.

There is no other mention of 'pushing' in the Nevada rules.

There is no mention of the 'pushing' in either the LPRR or the MQB rules.

I was thinking, I need to look at Corbett-Fitzsimmons again, I think maybe Corbett used that 'stiff arm push-off' followed by hooking your opponent's shoulder, turning him and then and stepping around him, move. For some reason I feel like Foreman's technique has shades of Corbett to it. I need to look again at Corbett.

[JAB5239]

Wow, great breakdown. Thanks for posting that.

[HOUDINI563]

Foremans skills are certainly underrated. Ali made two comments regarding Foremans abilities after his KO win over George.....one was his ability to cut the ring....Ali was moving four steps to Foremans two. The other was his speed. When asked if anything surprised him about Foreman Ali stated....speed...he is fast.

George's main weaknesses are well known. One was endurance. Foreman fought with great fury from the very first round. That fury petered out as rounds wore on. But this characteristic made Foreman great as few could stay with him. Secondly his lack of head movement and dropping of the jab made him open for right hands.

Foremans greatness was cemented when after a decade in retirement he was able to rewin the true hwt championship at a very advanced age. The greatest achievement in the history of sport. Of course he was aided by the highly diluted talent pool of the 90's but nevertheless an unprecedented achievement.

[QueensburyRules]

--- 90s considered the second coming of the 70s, a dozen name fighters usually fighting each other...

[BKM-]

I've learned that the more you study Foreman, the more you realize just how good he was technically. It can't be denied considering he was one of the best in possibly the best or second best HW era. It is impossible to be that successful having only Foreman's incorrectly assumed abilities, the thought that he only had a jab, cutting off the ring skills with only physical attributes to carry him. No boxer is gonna be at his level with only that against this level of opposition, impossible. There is more to it and videos like this prove it. Foreman was truly skilled, it's a hidden gem.

[OCPancho]

Great analysis.
Joe's biggest problem was he had no rear hand to speak of.
If you had no right cross, George kills you.