ATG's List by McGoorty - A Hall of Fame

[McGoorty]

I am saying that many said he was without peer among those who saw him and for some reason Benny Leonard said Griffo was the finest boxer ever and many have said that about Benny himself and for good reason I might add. Yes Gans did win the THIRD fight but by then Griffo had become fat and had been a hopeless alcoholic and so far past his prime only pride and need of cash got him into the ring against Gans, but i have read reports of an earlier fight where Gans was totally outclassed and could not hit Griffo yet Griffo hit him all night long and Gans was much bigger than Griffo. All I can add to this is that I am not making any of this up... I never do, I honestly tell it how I see it........ yes, film would be helpful and there was film of him, in fact the very first ever boxing film of an outdoor exhibition in history but I cannot find it on youtube, it does exist in an Australian library somewhere but I think the film to decayed to actually watch now, a damn shame, he sure must have been an incredible fighter.......

I am sorry but film does not necessarily make a fighter better than one with no existing film, it's like saying Tyson is better than so and so cos so and so fought in black and white

[McGoorty]

I have seen plenty of benitez and sure great defense but fact is every film shows he could be hit yet so many claim they couldn't even land a single solid blow on Griffo and not just to his head but to the BODY.... so lets just all agree to say Griffo was way way above ordinary and his amazing record should be proof enough,,,,,, he never lost once in his first 167 fights and he eventually had way over 200 fights, the exact amount is still debated as he also had some exhibitions and a few uncredited bare knuckle fights as a little kid. Where you rank fighters i say is your business

[Bundana]

I do not even remotely agree with your opinion that Benitez was top 3 in defence of all time or did I read you wrong there ?.... My top 3 greatest defensive fighters of all time are in no particular order as I cannot separate guys of that level.............. Benny leonard, Young Griffo and Willie Pep..... and Archie Moore but not quite at the level of those three.

So you believe Griffo was a better defensive fighter than Pernell Whitaker?

[billeau2]

How this list doesn't include Wilfred Benitez?????? i dont care who else is not here but Wilfred Benitez??? the youngest champion on history EVER and his defense is probably top 3 and is 1 of the fantastic 5 lol... Duran, Hearn, Leonard, Hagler and Benitez should be in every1 top 200 ATG.



Forgot to mention Hector Macho Camacho Sr.

Good call on Camacho.

[NChristo]

I am sorry but film does not necessarily make a fighter better than one with no existing film, it's like saying Tyson is better than so and so cos so and so fought in black and white

Right but as I said the only way too compare a boxers traits are by footage, you can only imagine how good Griffo was, that is it, and imagination is no good at all when we have footage of one guy who was unbelievable, as I said if newspaper articles were written today as they were back then Benitez would be labeled as unhittable in the same way Griffo was, newspapers if you didn't know would play up a fight and the boxers because there is only so much you can do in writing to create excitement and back then was the only way the majority knew about a fight, and god knows how you have him over Whitaker, only just noticed when Bun pointed it out.

It's fair too say Griffo was a better defensive boxer then say Barbados Joe and boxers from back then whom we have no footage on and only newspaper articles too go by and he had a better defense then some not so defensive boxers today but too just label him as a better defensive boxer then El Radar is ridiculous, we need something more solid then articles which purposefully will exagerate a boxers capabilities.

[joseph5620]

]I am saying that many said he was without peer among those who saw him and for some reason Benny Leonard said Griffo was the finest boxer ever [/B]and many have said that about Benny himself and for good reason I might add. Yes Gans did win the THIRD fight but by then Griffo had become fat and had been a hopeless alcoholic and so far past his prime only pride and need of cash got him into the ring against Gans, but i have read reports of an earlier fight where Gans was totally outclassed and could not hit Griffo yet Griffo hit him all night long and Gans was much bigger than Griffo. All I can add to this is that I am not making any of this up... I never do, I honestly tell it how I see it........ yes, film would be helpful and there was film of him, in fact the very first ever boxing film of an outdoor exhibition in history but I cannot find it on youtube, it does exist in an Australian library somewhere but I think the film to decayed to actually watch now, a damn shame, he sure must have been an incredible fighter.......

All of those people have been dead for decades and didn't see many of the great defensive fighters post 1904. Time doesn't stand still and for anybody in this era to take those words as gospel without their own knowledge is being ridiculous.

[NChristo]

Something worth pointing out is that although Benny supposedly has said that Griffo was the finest boxer ever he was 8 years old when Griffo had his last bout according to Boxrec.

McGoorty we are not saying that Griffo was not great it just does not make any sense at all to compare him to todays greats because of his era and lack of footage, especially when we are focusing on one part of him which we will never be able to see.

[soul_survivor]

Why is it that USA fighters never had home ground favouritism ?? LOL and ROFL

It's not American favouritism but as I already explained, look at some of the guys he defended against, if a fighter did that now, he'd be laughed out of the ring. Not to mention, the US, for the better part of the 20th century was home to a wide range of international fighters, if you wanted to fight the best, you had to go there. It's as simple as that.

[McGoorty]

It's not American favouritism but as I already explained, look at some of the guys he defended against, if a fighter did that now, he'd be laughed out of the ring. Not to mention, the US, for the better part of the 20th century was home to a wide range of international fighters, if you wanted to fight the best, you had to go there. It's as simple as that.

Sure but at the time of Darcy it was Australia where you had to be.... it was the Mecca, all fights were 20 rounds and no ND crap, all had judges and the money was better, nearly every decent American fighter went there.... several times in fact. Also you seem to think an underage youngster could just get on a boat and there were no airliners. In Australia from 1908 to 1916 there was no better place for a fighter

[McGoorty]

Right but as I said the only way too compare a boxers traits are by footage, you can only imagine how good Griffo was, that is it, and imagination is no good at all when we have footage of one guy who was unbelievable, as I said if newspaper articles were written today as they were back then Benitez would be labeled as unhittable in the same way Griffo was, newspapers if you didn't know would play up a fight and the boxers because there is only so much you can do in writing to create excitement and back then was the only way the majority knew about a fight, and god knows how you have him over Whitaker, only just noticed when Bun pointed it out.

It's fair too say Griffo was a better defensive boxer then say Barbados Joe and boxers from back then whom we have no footage on and only newspaper articles too go by and he had a better defense then some not so defensive boxers today but too just label him as a better defensive boxer then El Radar is ridiculous, we need something more solid then articles which purposefully will exagerate a boxers capabilities.

OK even if what you say is true, (I actually cannot know for sure and won't pretend to).. take Griffo out of the picture along with all his contemporaries I still wouldn't have Benitex in top 3, thats going from the fighters I have seen. Sure Wilfred deserves mention he is one of the best of his time and really what else is there ?