No, of course not. That's why I just said pretty good, since he didn't spend near as much time there. Like Michael Spinks, another guy on people's ATG light heavy lists, who only had a few fights at HW, so is considered pretty good there. Ward definitely doesn't rank anywhere on an all time light heavyweight list, but is considered pretty good among the ones during his own time in the short time he competed there.
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No announcement yet.
If Andre Ward is genuinely retired...
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Originally posted by chrisJS View PostWard was in litigation. Moot point. He couldn't legally fight. Ward also said he can make 160 for Floyd but not 164 for GGG. There's a double standard there.
Once Ward was legally able to fight he embarked on the 175 division.
Regardless, had Ward been given the opportunity before moving up to 175 I think he would have been able to put two impressive notches in his belt in Golovkin and Kovalev. And to me it's a shame he didn't get that chance even though he wanted it and asked for it.
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Originally posted by ShoulderRoll View PostThere was a window where the fight could have been made, when GGG was having trouble getting big names to face him. This is another rehash of an NSB debate that has been done to death.
Regardless, had Ward been given the opportunity before moving up to 175 I think he would have been able to put two impressive notches in his belt in Golovkin and Kovalev. And to me it's a shame he didn't get that chance even though he wanted it and asked for it.
Ward says a lot. 3-4 weeks before he retired he claimed he dreamed of the heavyweight division and was negotiating a fight with Bellew when in reality his HBO contract was expired and he was asking Hearn to let him fight a nobody from England. He then retires.
That's not a guy that speak with conviction.
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Originally posted by Mooshashi View PostIMO he didn't have enough fights at LHW to be considered at all at that weight. The usual list of top ten LHW's including guys like Ezzard Charles, Foster, Moore etc had dozens of fights at 175. Beating Kovalev and a couple other guys simply doesn't compare favorably.
The older divisions in boxing were such that fighters could be in a category for most of their career and fight the best competition... You will always have guys like Moore who could fight up and down and defy categorisation.
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When rating top contenders and champions I don not consider "junior" & "super" division as true weight classes. A fellow like Ward fought light heavy in the amateurs with a cut line of 178lbs. He was a young man who wasn't a tall fellow 6' and was not a large framed body either. Like so many with his structure they were able to cut their weight to 168 using the 2 day weigh in time and had an advantage over fellows who were on their way to 175 or simply could not make 160 anymore.
When it comes to champions I do NOT rate fighters in these
"in between" weight classes that were established to first promote more money opportunities for federations and management companies.
If these junior/senior weight classes were in vogue years ago Armstrong in his prime would have been champion from 130 to 154!!!!!
Ward to me is a light heavy, come bell time he was far above 175 in either weight class.
With that in mind I would rank him in the top thirty because of his style and adaptability. The only thing that keeps him down in the ranks is his lack of power in the right hand.
Other than that obvious fault he was a good boxer, decent enough fighter and a methodical competitor. Always in top condition and more than willing.
I get a kick out the people who think he was a dirty fighter, that's ridiculous! He was never DQ and until the ref halt's a "technique" your ok performing it!
He is not an ATG rated performer, a HoF boxer, Yes! His era's top performer, Yes!
night all;
RayLast edited by Ray Corso; 10-27-2017, 05:30 PM.
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Originally posted by Ray Corso View PostWhen rating top contenders and champions I don not consider "junior" & "super" division as true weight classes. A fellow like Ward fought light heavy in the amateurs with a cut line of 178lbs. He was a young man who wasn't a tall fellow 6' and was not a large framed body either. Like so many with his structure they were able to cut their weight to 168 using the 2 day weigh in time and had an advantage over fellows who were on their way to 175 or simply could not make 160 anymore.
When it comes to champions I do NOT rate fighters in these
"in between" weight classes that were established to first promote more money opportunities for federations and management companies.
If these junior/senior weight classes were in vogue years ago Armstrong in his prime would have been champion from 130 to 154!!!!!
Ward to me is a light heavy, come bell time he was far above 175 in either weight class.
With that in mind I would rank him in the top thirty because of his style and adaptability. The only thing that keeps him down in the ranks is his lack of power in the right hand.
Other than that obvious fault he was a good boxer, decent enough fighter and a methodical competitor. Always in top condition and more than willing.
I get a kick out the people who think he was a dirty fighter, that's ridiculous! He was never DQ and until the ref halt's a "technique" your ok performing it!
He is not an ATG rated performer, a HoF boxer, Yes! His era's top performer, Yes!
night all;
Ray
Well said my man!!! Thank you.
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Originally posted by ShoulderRoll View PostWell, if you look back at the history...for the longest time Golovkin's camp said he would fight anyone from 154 to 168.
But then when Ward raised his hand and said he was interested suddenly it became "164 or no fight."
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Ward may not be dirty overall, but those were some low blows that lead up to the stoppage in his last fight, although some clean shots were landed at the time of the stoppage.
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Originally posted by Anthony342 View PostWard may not be dirty overall, but those were some low blows that lead up to the stoppage in his last fight, although some clean shots were landed at the time of the stoppage.
The punch that won it to me was Ward's counter right...that was a beautifully accurate punch and Kovalev looked very bad from its effects. I don't think he ever recovered from that punch frankly.
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