Was Lennox Lewis set up to lose against Vitali Klitschko?

[W1LL]

Been looking into this again lately.

Personally I always found the narrative put on this fight confusing. An old Lewis struggled with a stand-in opponent (originally due to face Kirk Johnson), before getting the stoppage on damage done. Lewis, the long-reigning Lineal champion, won fair and square.

However, if you listen to the commentary, it is clear from the beginning that Jim Lampley et al were showing an "anti-Lennox" bias. I know this is something that was done regularly, but it seemed even more extreme in this fight.

Honestly, in the UK not a lot was known about Vitali, besides he beat Herbie Hide. In America though they seemed to know all about him, like he'd been waiting in the wings for a prime opportunity to upset the applecart. And it seems that is what was meant to happen against Lewis. From the off the commentators are all over Vitali's nuts. Was this a dislike for Lewis? Seems they really wanted Vitali to win. Were they eager to usher in a new era of Heavyweight boxing? Very strange to me.

Read something recently on how a certain promoter would get a fighter a shot at a title, with another of his fighter's as the back-up. You have the champion training for fighter A, then have him pull out at the last minute, with fighter B stepping in 100% primed and ready to go. The champion has trained for fighter A and does not have enough time to make adjustments in readiness for fighter B. This actually works in the stand-in fighters favour... Interesting. Is that what happened with Vitali?

[BattlingNelson]

Well it's common pratice to have more than one HW fight on a particular card so much so that it's fairly easy to get a replacement in case of injury to one of the main eventers.

If there was indeed a conspiracy in this case, we need some kind of evidence of foul play. Of course if that evidence exists, it will defintely make LL's win look better as the common narrative is that he struggled mightily against a late replacement opponent who had been preparing for an easy undercard fight instead of a fight for the biggest title in sports while LL himself had a full camp under his belt.

[QueensburyRules]

- -OP confused for sure.

First and last time Vit was on HBO he was savaged by Merchant when his team withdrew him while leading wide against Byrd because of a shoulder that required surgery and rehab.

Vit had won 3 lawsuits requiring Lewis to fight him that were ignored. The only monkey biz was when Tyson withdrew from the undercard and Vit his late replacement and then Lewis opponent hurt his delicate bosom and withdrew that upgraded Vit to main event.

In short, Lewis jerked a lot of strings to suddenly satisfy the lawsuit.

Then he ducked his biggest career purse for the rematch to retire days before WBC would be stripping him. Lewis the Lion went out like a lamb that has been grinding his gears ever since.

[Rusty Tromboni]

- -OP confused for sure.

First and last time Vit was on HBO he was savaged by Merchant when his team withdrew him while leading wide against Byrd because of a shoulder that required surgery and rehab.

Vit had won 3 lawsuits requiring Lewis to fight him that were ignored. The only monkey biz was when Tyson withdrew from the undercard and Vit his late replacement and then Lewis opponent hurt his delicate bosom and withdrew that upgraded Vit to main event.

In short, Lewis jerked a lot of strings to suddenly satisfy the lawsuit.

Then he ducked his biggest career purse for the rematch to retire days before WBC would be stripping him. Lewis the Lion went out like a lamb that has been grinding his gears ever since.

This time the chamber was loaded.

Queenie nailed it.

Lewis saw the writing on the wall.

The fact that the fight was stopped was a also a bit suspicious.

Lewis refusing to return for the biggest payday of his life and a chance to set the record straight shows that even he knows who the better man was. His fans still haven't caught on almost 20 years later.

Sad.

[PRINCEKOOL]

Lennox Lewis was out of shape, and still bullied Vitali Kiltschko.

Lewis had nothing left to prove, if Kiltschko could not put him down or beat him 'At his worst' I don't think he done enough to force a rematch 'George Foreman was the only pundit, who pointed out that Lewis was just not in shape physically/technically'.

[billeau2]

Been looking into this again lately.

Personally I always found the narrative put on this fight confusing. An old Lewis struggled with a stand-in opponent (originally due to face Kirk Johnson), before getting the stoppage on damage done. Lewis, the long-reigning Lineal champion, won fair and square.

However, if you listen to the commentary, it is clear from the beginning that Jim Lampley et al were showing an "anti-Lennox" bias. I know this is something that was done regularly, but it seemed even more extreme in this fight.

Honestly, in the UK not a lot was known about Vitali, besides he beat Herbie Hide. In America though they seemed to know all about him, like he'd been waiting in the wings for a prime opportunity to upset the applecart. And it seems that is what was meant to happen against Lewis. From the off the commentators are all over Vitali's nuts. Was this a dislike for Lewis? Seems they really wanted Vitali to win. Were they eager to usher in a new era of Heavyweight boxing? Very strange to me.

Read something recently on how a certain promoter would get a fighter a shot at a title, with another of his fighter's as the back-up. You have the champion training for fighter A, then have him pull out at the last minute, with fighter B stepping in 100% primed and ready to go. The champion has trained for fighter A and does not have enough time to make adjustments in readiness for fighter B. This actually works in the stand-in fighters favour... Interesting. Is that what happened with Vitali?

Will

It sounds like you were picking up on the anti-Lewis sentiments that were part of Lewis' career from the get-go. I don't know about the sheenanigans in this fight to get Vitalie in there, but will say this: Lewis felt that by taking on all commers, even avoiding mandatory defenses that were nonsense like John Ruiz, and fighting guys percieved as a threat like Michael Grant, would show he was the "best heavyweight on the planet" (his words).

By the time this fight rolled around Lewis probably felt he had shown his mettle, and had a difficult time, having prepared for a very weak opponent, not being in shape...and pulling out a game situation, taking everything Vitalie threw in the process. Now here is where it gets sad to me...

Lewis was expecting after this fight to have a kind interview, to be shown some respect and compassion by the media. Instead these sentiments came to a head. Lewis learned a valuable lesson, one that Ali had internalized years back: most people in the media are not your friend, not kind, not understanding, they are sycophantic to the interests of a narrative.

When it was Ali the narrative was, those who refused to fight were cowards, and very few toed the line, Cosell (RIP Howard) was one of them, which is why a Muslim convert (Ali) respected Cosell, a jew.

With Lewis he was immediately attacked for his performance. Lewis was taken aback and lost it. If you listen to the interviews that night you can see that something died in Lewis. He seemed to realize the chimera he was faced with and lost his own reticent breeding in the process. He sounded horribly defensive and like a sore winner, but if one really examines why, one can see that Lewis was attacked by the media. This is a man who was given maybe one gift decision (Mercer) and avenged all his defeats in the ring, and fought many young lions coming up, and those percieved as the top fighters of his era.

And no, lewis did not duck Tyson, as some here maintain... and he did not duck Bowe, but it often seems that many ducked him.

[Lomadeaux]

Lennox Lewis was out of shape, and still bullied Vitali Kiltschko.

Lewis had nothing left to prove, if Kiltschko could not put him down or beat him 'At his worst' I don't think he done enough to force a rematch 'George Foreman was the only pundit, who pointed out that Lewis was just not in shape physically/technically'.

Lennox embarrassed himself in that fight. The post fight interview Merchant conducted was brilliant. The first question to Lennox;

"You said that he had no skill level, and that he had no heart. What do you think of him now?"

From there Lennox just looked, sounded, acted foolish. He ran from a Vitali rematch and that is not what the greats do.

[Mario040481]

Preposterous! Lewis didn't run from the rematch!! That's just..ugh..that it is, it is ugh!! The rematch didn't happen, or at least a leading cause for there not being one was, according to Steward, in an interview posted to bleaherreport.com in 2011, Lewis retired/didn't give the rematch to Vitali on direct orders of his wife and that's why he ambled outta the sport, then, very shortly afterwards ambled outta his "Im true Brit" persona, and that was pretty much immediately followed by an amble to Florida, leading destination of many proud, retiree Brit, this was quite some time laters followed by his amble to the PBC commentary table where it appears that, whether right or wrong, his commentary work is derided by what seems to be a large degree of today's English speaking boxing fans, or so it would appear in many, MANY online fan forums, including those here.
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...never-happened

[BKM-]

Will

It sounds like you were picking up on the anti-Lewis sentiments that were part of Lewis' career from the get-go. I don't know about the sheenanigans in this fight to get Vitalie in there, but will say this: Lewis felt that by taking on all commers, even avoiding mandatory defenses that were nonsense like John Ruiz, and fighting guys percieved as a threat like Michael Grant, would show he was the "best heavyweight on the planet" (his words).

By the time this fight rolled around Lewis probably felt he had shown his mettle, and had a difficult time, having prepared for a very weak opponent, not being in shape...and pulling out a game situation, taking everything Vitalie threw in the process. Now here is where it gets sad to me...

Lewis was expecting after this fight to have a kind interview, to be shown some respect and compassion by the media. Instead these sentiments came to a head. Lewis learned a valuable lesson, one that Ali had internalized years back: most people in the media are not your friend, not kind, not understanding, they are sycophantic to the interests of a narrative.

When it was Ali the narrative was, those who refused to fight were cowards, and very few toed the line, Cosell (RIP Howard) was one of them, which is why a Muslim convert (Ali) respected Cosell, a jew.

With Lewis he was immediately attacked for his performance. Lewis was taken aback and lost it. If you listen to the interviews that night you can see that something died in Lewis. He seemed to realize the chimera he was faced with and lost his own reticent breeding in the process. He sounded horribly defensive and like a sore winner, but if one really examines why, one can see that Lewis was attacked by the media. This is a man who was given maybe one gift decision (Mercer) and avenged all his defeats in the ring, and fought many young lions coming up, and those percieved as the top fighters of his era.

And no, lewis did not duck Tyson, as some here maintain... and he did not duck Bowe, but it often seems that many ducked him.

Good observations as usual. I have always looked at the post-fight interview as uncomfortable and odd, it didn't help that Larry Merchant was twice as confrontational as he usually was. Although I still get a good laugh out of Lewis repeating "look at the state of his face" over and over again, it really was a disgrace how this great champion was treated after the fight both by the fallen challenger and the media, yes.

[Mario040481]

WTF is wrong with the state of his face? Nothing to see here, move along!


I dunno about any pre-planned setup narratives, I just know I like the fight. I've no quarrels about the stoppage or anything of the sort. Rules is rules and Lennox was right on about the state of his face, as Klitscho's eyeball was possibly mere moments away from seceding from it's long held union with Vitali's face.
I do think it's lame that Lewis didn't do the rematch, but sometimes I consider it to be understandable. Some dudes just let their ol' ladies wear the pants at home