Does AJ deserve credit for beating Povetkin if Lomachenko didn't for beating Rigo?

[4truth]

I've seen a lot of people say his body has changed over the years but see I evidence of it at all. When exactly did this transformation happen?

Right after the Huck near disaster. He dumped Atlas and after that he improved, a lot.

[No punch power]

I'm aware that neither of the products that Povetkin actually tested positive for are steroids. Povetkins body has changed as has his performance and power.

Then why did you mention them when I asked you what steroids Povetkin used?

Is Povetkin 'roid-less' now?

If you claim Povetkin's body has changed, then how exactly is his body different right now (or in his last 2 fights), compared to how his body was when he was supposedly on 'roids'?

And how exactly has his performance in his last fight, different to his performance during when he was supposedly 'roiding'?

[Mr Objecitivity]

Right after the Huck near disaster. He dumped Atlas and after that he improved, a lot.

Povetkin changed trainers and had a poor training camp when he fought Eddie Chambers. He looked in better shape in prior fights and fights after.

Not a big enough sample size to prove your point!

[Johnston]

Right after the Huck near disaster. He dumped Atlas and after that he improved, a lot.

After huc k

[No punch power]

After huc k

IF Povetkin were to beat Joshua, I would consider him an all time great. At least top 10, if not top 5.

[4truth]

I'm not going to waste a lot more time this but It is difficult for me to imagine the same Povetkin that knocked out a whole string of pretty good heavyweights from 09/2012 through 12/2016 would not be able to dispatch Nicolai Firtha.
That he tested positive for a muscle building PED Ostarine, tells me that he was willing to take whatever was available to improve performance. I do not see how you could argue differently.

[Johnston]

IF Povetkin were to beat Joshua, I would consider him an all time great. At least top 10, if not top 5.

Truth is Povetkin could beat Joshua and wilder and most probably wouldn't give him any credit because of the ped situation

[No punch power]

Truth is Povetkin could beat Joshua and wilder and most probably wouldn't give him any credit because of the ped situation

I do actually like Povetkin as a boxer. I enjoy the way he boxes. However, the truth is, he is too small for the heavyweight division against the current crop of super heavyweights. And the irony to me is that his lack of success is actually more likely down to a lack of PEDs, rather than due to it. Because if he was genuinely on PEDs that were very effective, then he would have become much bigger in size, heavier and more muscular, rather than remaining this chubby looking dude. Sort of like how Ike Ibeabuchi looked when he was boxing and how Joshua looks right now.

There's no doubt in my mind that Povetkin is more skilled than Joshua from a purely boxing standpoint. However, Joshua is most likely on some kind of PEDs that has made him grow artificially to an unnatural looking size. If Povetkin took similar PEDs and reached a similar size whilst maintaining his current skills, I would favor Povetkin to beat Joshua 8 out of 10 times. However, Joshua's significant size and physical strength advantages overcomes his inferior boxing skills.

I'm not going to waste a lot more time this but It is difficult for me to imagine the same Povetkin that knocked out a whole string of pretty good heavyweights from 09/2012 through 12/2016 would not be able to dispatch Nicolai Firtha.
That he tested positive for a muscle building PED Ostarine, tells me that he was willing to take whatever was available to improve performance. I do not see how you could argue differently.

Povetkin had an arm injury and literally fought with one arm against Nicolai Firtha. You need to do deeper research and actually watch fights, rather than make uninformed and uneducated statements. Roids had nothing to do with him being unable to stop Firtha.

Did you know that Povetkin also had knock out streaks spanning 3 or more fights, even before 2012? Was he also 'roiding' then, according to you?

[Johnston]

I do actually like Povetkin as a boxer. I enjoy the way he boxes. However, the truth is, he is too small for the heavyweight division against the current crop of super heavyweights. And the irony to me is that his lack of success is actually more likely down to a lack of PEDs, rather than due to it. Because if he was genuinely on PEDs that were very effective, then he would have become much bigger in size, heavier and more muscular, rather than remaining this chubby looking dude. Sort of like how Ike Ibeabuchi looked when he was boxing and how Joshua looks right now.

There's no doubt in my mind that Povetkin is more skilled than Joshua from a purely boxing standpoint. However, Joshua is most likely on some kind of PEDs that has made him grow artificially to an unnatural looking size. If Povetkin took similar PEDs and reached a similar size whilst maintaining his current skills, I would favor Povetkin to beat Joshua 8 out of 10 times. However, Joshua's significant size and physical strength advantages overcomes his inferior boxing skills.



Povetkin had an arm injury and literally fought with one arm against Nicolai Firtha. You need to do deeper research and actually watch fights, rather than make uninformed and uneducated statements. PEDs had nothing to do with him being unable to stop Firtha.

Did you know that Povetkin also had knock out streaks spanning 3 or more fights, even before 2012? Was he also 'roiding' then, according to you?

It's hard for me to argue anything you're saying. Only thing I disagree with is if he put on more muscle and became bigger he would probably lose a good amount of speed and ability to move around. But then again maybe not, guys like ike and tyson prove that's not always the case.

He's easily the most skilled heavyweight in my eyes but like you said he's fighting men who are much bigger then him.It would be really interesting to see what would happen if he tried to bulk up and get a bit leaner or just drop 15-20 pounds and fight at cruiserweight.

Always thought he could take better care of his body and try and get in better condition.

[Zaroku]

Does Anthony Joshua deserve credit for beating Alexander Povetkin if Vasyl Lomachenko doesn't for beating Guillermo Rigondeaux? If yes, why?

On fight night, Lomachenko weighed 137 pounds whilst Rigondeaux weighed 130 pounds. That's merely a 7 pound weight difference. That's also only a 5.38% weight difference in terms of percentage. Not to mention, both Lomachenko and Rigondeaux have roughly the same amount of functional weight (both have relatively a similar amount of body fat percentage).

Meanwhile, Povetkin's average weight is 227 pounds (also consisting of non-functional weight such as greater fat percentage than Joshua) whilst Joshua's average weight is 249 pounds. That's a 22 pound weight difference. That's also a 9.69% weight difference in terms of percentage.

So the size difference between Joshua and Povetkin is significantly / astronomically greater than the size difference between Lomachenko and Rigondeaux.

Also, Joshua is about 5 inches taller than Povetkin whilst Lomachenko was only 2 or 3 inches taller than Rigondeaux. And Joshua has a 7 inch reach advantage over Povetkin (82 > 75) whilst Lomachenko had the shorter reach than Rigondeaux.

So in every which way in terms of size. Whether it's based on weight difference in terms of pounds, weight difference in terms of percentage, height difference and reach difference. The size difference between Joshua and Povetkin is astronomically / significantly greater than the size difference that was between Lomachenko and Rigondeaux. In other words, Joshua has a SIGNIFICANTLY / ASTRONOMICALLY greater size advantage over Povetkin than Lomachenko had over Rigondeaux. Lomachenko and Rigondeaux are closer in size than Joshua and Povetkin are.

So all things considered in terms of size differences. Does Joshua deserve as much credit, less credit or more credit for beating Povetkin than Lomachenko does for beating Rigondeaux?

Even when it comes to age, the age difference between Joshua and Povetkin is far greater than the age difference between Lomachenko and Rigondeaux. Joshua is 10 years younger than Povetkin whilst Lomachenko is only 7 years younger than Rigondeaux. So even there, Joshua has the greater age advantage over Povetkin than Lomachenko had over Rigondeaux.

I ask this question because many people decided to take away credit from Lomachenko for beating Rigondeaux due to his size advantage. However, doesn't that mean we should also apply this very same standard to every other boxer for their wins? If we do, then how much credit do we give Joshua for beating Povetkin?


It may not seem like a foregone conclusion to some, but it's obviously INEVITABLE and a GUARANTEED outcome that Joshua beats Povetkin if Joshua comes in ideal condition. Povetkin would have 0% chance of winning if that's the case. Since he is too feather fisted and light hitting in terms of punching power to hurt, never mind KO the much bigger, stronger and more durable Anthony Joshua. And he is also too small to win on points because of Joshua's insane size, strength and punching power advantages. And he is also too small, weak, feather fisted and lacks durability to even survive the distance against a relatively monstrous creature like Joshua.

Hmmm... I kinda think you are mixing apples and oranges here.... I’m not a smart guy, but I theink it is more better to compare guys in the same weight division to each other...