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Why do some people pretend anyone at HW could beat Wilder?

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  • #71
    Originally posted by -Kev- View Post
    Tyson Fury KO’ed Wilder and now fans are pretending that the loss means everyone else can do that to Wilder.

    Fury can KO Wilder in round 1 of their trilogy, it still won’t mean AJ, Whyte, Ruiz, Ortiz, or Usyk would automatically beat him.

    Wilder looked real silly with his excuses and he has pretty much become a laughing stock. This has also led to fans giving Wilder a bunch of fantasy losses. Fury would whoop almost any HW in history. With his size, skills and movement. He’s a problem to any HW in history.
    Skills? Power or speed maybe.

    Wilder's issue was always his resume and he was no doubt protected somewhat, Ortiz obviously shouldn't be on that list.

    I do understand your point and you may be right, but I also understand the counter point, the first time he really fought some top opposition he was saved by dodgy cards and demolished in the rematch. He had plenty of opportunities to step up his competition prior and didn't, Ortiz is ok but not really enough to show too much, who is Ortiz's best win?

    So some fans are pretending ayone beats him, others think no one beats him, including Fury gypsy magic not withstanding.

    Fury has definitely laid out a blueprint thought, and thats usually not a great sign.

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    • #72
      Originally posted by andocom View Post

      Skills? Power or speed maybe.

      Wilder's issue was always his resume and he was no doubt protected somewhat, Ortiz obviously shouldn't be on that list.

      I do understand your point and you may be right, but I also understand the counter point, the first time he really fought some top opposition he was saved by dodgy cards and demolished in the rematch. He had plenty of opportunities to step up his competition prior and didn't, Ortiz is ok but not really enough to show too much, who is Ortiz's best win?

      So some fans are pretending ayone beats him, others think no one beats him, including Fury gypsy magic not withstanding.

      Fury has definitely laid out a blueprint thought, and thats usually not a great sign.
      What is the blueprint Fury laid out? Be taller and have a 40lb weight advantage?

      And yes skills. Fury is clearly a talented boxer.

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      • #73
        Originally posted by billeau2 View Post

        You know... a long time ago, in a galaxy far far away... Someone said "Ortiz is old. He is a wash!! A bum." And like a misguided greek chorus the recriminations were repeated, ad naseum.....
        Ortiz was a pretty decent amateur in the Cuban system but I don't recall him doing much as far as international competitions. In the professional ranks he hangs his hat on wins against Bryant Jennings and Tony Thompson and the two losses to Wilder. That Jennings win was 6+ years ago.

        I remember watching Ortiz labor around the ring trying to chase Malik Scott and blast out guys like Alexander Flores who were just looking for a soft spot on the canvas. Ortiz IS old, there's no question about that. The real question is how good is he? I don't think anyone really knows.

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        • #74
          Originally posted by billeau2 View Post

          You know... a long time ago, in a galaxy far far away... Someone said "Ortiz is old. He is a wash!! A bum." And like a misguided greek chorus the recriminations were repeated, ad naseum. How many people who say this believe this? And how many who believe this watched his second fight with Wilder? Ortiz may be old but he fought very well that fight. he was active, and he was winning. He was doing what many boxers in the prime of their career do: working off his jab, pressuring Wilder, etc.

          You can see when a fighter is out of shape, washed up, etc... Ortiz did not actually look such in his fights with Wilder, especially the second.
          What we're you watching, Ortiz looked like what he is in the second fight, an OLD MAN.

          Yes he was outboxing Wilder, guess what, Eric Molina outboxed Wilder.

          Ortiz is a bum who's only good win in his entire career was Bryant Jennings.

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          • #75
            Originally posted by -Kev- View Post
            Tyson Fury KO’ed Wilder and now fans are pretending that the loss means everyone else can do that to Wilder.

            Fury can KO Wilder in round 1 of their trilogy, it still won’t mean AJ, Whyte, Ruiz, Ortiz, or Usyk would automatically beat him.

            Wilder looked real silly with his excuses and he has pretty much become a laughing stock. This has also led to fans giving Wilder a bunch of fantasy losses. Fury would whoop almost any HW in history. With his size, skills and movement. He’s a problem to any HW in history.
            Ortiz schooled wilder and people write him off like he was dog****

            Fury would get beaten to a pulp by prime ali, tyson,Lewis and Larry Holmes but that's not to say he isn't great

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            • #76
              Originally posted by Earl-Hickey View Post

              What we're you watching, Ortiz looked like what he is in the second fight, an OLD MAN.

              Yes he was outboxing Wilder, guess what, Eric Molina outboxed Wilder.

              Ortiz is a bum who's only good win in his entire career was Bryant Jennings.
              And what about Andy ruiz and John mcdermott I guess they're both better than ortiz in your opinion

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              • #77
                Originally posted by hugh grant View Post
                This is why fury don't need wilder. Everyone thinks they got blueprint to best wilder now. So I'd like to see wilder v Joyce, Whyte, flip, Ruiz, usyk, Josh, once wilder fought all these and wins he can go down as GOAT of his era
                Unlikely you'd get one of those fights and unlikely Wilder would ever be the goat even had a beat Fury and all the fighters you named. He wasn't good, a late starter and Bryant Jennings was twice as marketable as Wilder. Wilder doesn't have the personality that says I'm going to give you excitement in and out of the ring and certainly isn't a salesman of the products outside of it. On Oct 9 he gets the opportunity to prove that the night in February wasn't him. Doesn't mean he will win but he has his final opportunity to correct what he feels is wrong.

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                • #78
                  Originally posted by Stuntman Mike View Post

                  And what about Andy ruiz and John mcdermott I guess they're both better than ortiz in your opinion
                  Ruiz yes, mcdermott not sure apart from John is younger than ortiz so if he could get himself in some sort of shape maybe he could outlast Ortiz.

                  Ortiz is trash btw he's most known for being odlanier solis whipping boy in the amateurs.

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                  • #79
                    Originally posted by Nash out View Post

                    This is the best era of HW's ever. The 90s was garbage, if you said that, I'd agree. Mike Tyson wouldn't be top 20 in today's brilliant era. Kronk is the GOAT. Nash out.
                    I disagree. Either young Klitz or Lewis would be a problem for ANY of today’s CURRENT heavyweight boxers.

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                    • #80
                      As mediocre as Wilder is at the top tier of HW in boxing skills but the dude can still throw like very few in the history of the game and he's got a bronze medal.

                      His power bail him out most of the time but he's not that bad or he would have lost before. He only lost to the best.

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