Abadger, I challenge you to a debate on Jones/Calzaghe

[abadger]

Theres one fundemental flaw in your argument... your assuming this is a prime roy jones... a roy jones who could throw off 5-6-7 jabs in a roy, and triple left hooks... that roy is gone, he is no more, he is not coming back...

Ok so Roy is patient... and you think being patient is a good idea with someone whose going to throw 150 punches around? what happens when round 9 rolls around and roy has won 2 rounds? Listen, Im sick of the people around here who think that Roy is going to give Joe problems... did you NOT see the anthony hanshaw fight? the fight was almost dead even until roy knocked him down on the canvas, Hanshaw was outworking him on the ropes the entire fight... and THAT WAS ANTHONY HANSHAW.... are you insinuationg that Joe Calzaghe cannot do what Anthony did only better?

Sure he still has quick hands, but his lateral movement is basically gone and he cannot float around like used to... joe still has his legs 100% and roy is going to be playing catch upp all fight long

Forget Prime Roy, I agree with you, he is gone. The problem for Calzaghe is that Roy doesn't need to be prime, or even close to it to beat him, its all about the clash of styles.

You say that Calzaghe has his mobility? Maybe he does and maybe he doesn't, but it it didn't look like it to me against Hopkins. His legs are better than Roy's for sure, but it isn't going to matter.

What type of boxers has Joe Calzaghe overwhelmingly fought in his career? Attacking ones, who come forward in straight lines. He struggles every time he faces a counterpuncher, look at his Reid and Hopkins fights. He even looked bad against David Starie, who befuddled Joe with a tiny bit of movement! You think Roy hasn't noticed this?

Here is what Roy is going to do. He's going to eliminate Calzaghe's mobility advantage simply by not pressing the action, he'll lay on the ropes and wait for Calzaghe to come to him, arms whirling. ****! A fast right hand, maybe a combo, right on the money, every time. Its called clean effective punching and Calzaghe doesn't know much about it. It also happens to be the primary criteria by which fights are judged.

So you say to me that Calzaghe is going to win rounds. He isn't. The judges are going to see a whole lot of nothing from him, and a whole lot of something from Roy. Hopkins took Joe to a split decision throwing less than one punch a round, Roy is going to win nearly every round throwing a lot more. Not as many as Calzaghe, not as many as in his prime, but enough. Bank on it.

[THE REED]

no need for it, we all now Tarver owns Roy



Roy is afraid Tarver will put him to sleep again, Joe just wants the easy way out by picking on a guy that Tarver finished

i completely agree with you

[T-97]

im awaiting a response abadger....

and is that a i see from u t

Yes it is, reed.

[THE REED]

Forget Prime Roy, I agree with you, he is gone. The problem for Calzaghe is that Roy doesn't need to be prime, or even close to it to beat him, its all about the clash of styles.

You say that Calzaghe has his mobility? Maybe he does and maybe he doesn't, but it it didn't look like it to me against Hopkins. His legs are better than Roy's for sure, but it isn't going to matter.

What type of boxers has Joe Calzaghe overwhelmingly fought in his career? Attacking ones, who come forward in straight lines. He struggles every time he faces a counterpuncher, look at his Reid and Hopkins fights. He even looked bad against David Starie, who befuddled Joe with a tiny bit of movement! You think Roy hasn't noticed this?

Here is what Roy is going to do. He's going to eliminate Calzaghe's mobility advantage simply by not pressing the action, he'll lay on the ropes and wait for Calzaghe to come to him, arms whirling. ****! A fast right hand, maybe a combo, right on the money, every time. Its called clean effective punching and Calzaghe doesn't know much about it. It also happens to be the primary criteria by which fights are judged.

So you say to me that Calzaghe is going to win rounds. He isn't. The judges are going to see a whole lot of nothing from him, and a whole lot of something from Roy. Hopkins took Joe to a split decision throwing less than one punch a round, Roy is going to win nearly every round throwing a lot more. Not as many as Calzaghe, not as many as in his prime, but enough. Bank on it.

And what exactly makes you think Roy is going to hit Joe so easily? Because he was able to hit Trinidad? really? Joe has the ability to adapt and overcome any style that is presented to him... He is 45-0 and not just by some coincidence, not by some chance... because he's smart. He understands the game. If someone is doing something to negate Joe's actions, Joe is able to change up his gameplan to overcome, and hes shown this MULTIPLE times.

By you insinuating that Roy is not prime anymore, then you agree by not being prime anymore that you do lose your reflexes to a degree... So while your argument of Roy being the effective counterpuncher may hold water, your forgetting one underlying thing... REFLEXES... Roys reflexes are shot, he will not be countering Joe as effectively as you think he will, hes almost 40, your not going to be able to hit the target like you did 10 years ago...

And what about Stamina? Am I to believe this "tremendous" athlete is going to go 12 hard rounds? at 40 years old? really? Because I honestly can't see it... After he knocked down Hanshaw, he didnt have the stamina to finish him, he bounced around for an entire minute and did nothing... and what about Trinidad?! He couldnt even put trinidad away....

Do you think Roy will be able to effectively play catch up all fight? Lets be honest here, Roy lost the first 4 rounds against Tito Trinidad... are you hearing me?

Am I to believe that Joe will not be able to do even more than Felix? If Roy was behind in the first four rounds against Trinidad, what will he do against Joe exactly? Roy won the fight because Trinidad got tired from being inactive for 3 years... Joe will not...

Roys last fight was in January, that will be 11 months ago come fight time... Joe hasnt had 3 years off, He just fought in April-May, that will be 6 months come fight time... hes more active, hes fresh, and he just got done fighting a slick counter puncher, which will only help him prepare for another one.

[rizkybizness]

Just stop.

Please.

[THE REED]

Just stop.

Please.

If what we were saying wasnt true, then I could see your point...

but everything were saying is factual.

[TheManchine]

Just stop.

Please.

i agree with this, stop now

[THE REED]

just move on then

[abadger]

Let me break it down for you....

And what exactly makes you think Roy is going to hit Joe so easily? Because he was able to hit Trinidad? really? Joe has the ability to adapt and overcome any style that is presented to him... He is 45-0 and not just by some coincidence, not by some chance... because he's smart. He understands the game. If someone is doing something to negate Joe's actions, Joe is able to change up his gameplan to overcome, and hes shown this MULTIPLE times.

Calzaghe's 'adaptability' is hugely overrated. Lets take a look at his signature wins:

Against Eubank he outworked a past prime fighter who almost lost on multiple occasions because of his low output. Hardly smart, more inevitable.

Against Lacy he beat up a fighter with no-skill, no energy, no speed and overrated power. What else could have happened?

Against Kessler he outboxed a supposedly 'gifted technical boxer' right? Wrong! Kessler is fast and powerful, but gifted he isn't. He has a fixed style he cannot change, hardly surprising then that he should struggle with an unothodox lefty.

Against Hopkins, well ****, see Eubank. One punch a round doesn't win fights, it would be a miracle if Joe had lost!

And tell me what smarts Calzaghe showed when struggling to scrappy wins over Charles Brewer, Sakio Bika, Kabary Salem, Darren Littlewood...really the list is endless. Calzaghe didn't work anyone out, he fought fighters with gaping holes in their game you'd have to be an idiot not to exploit!

By you insinuating that Roy is not prime anymore, then you agree by not being prime anymore that you do lose your reflexes to a degree... So while your argument of Roy being the effective counterpuncher may hold water, your forgetting one underlying thing... REFLEXES... Roys reflexes are shot, he will not be countering Joe as effectively as you think he will, hes almost 40, your not going to be able to hit the target like you did 10 years ago...

You don't need reflexes to hit Calzaghe, he's not a crisp in and out boxer, he's a lunger. He comes forward with his arms so wide he looks like he hasn't seen his opponent in years, and with his chin hanging out to dry. Even better, hit him once and he tries to brawl with you, this was fine in his younger days, but now he's slower and has less power it makes him an accident waiting to happen.

And what about Stamina? Am I to believe this "tremendous" athlete is going to go 12 hard rounds? at 40 years old? really? Because I honestly can't see it... After he knocked down Hanshaw, he didnt have the stamina to finish him, he bounced around for an entire minute and did nothing... and what about Trinidad?! He couldnt even put trinidad away....

You expose your ludicrously low levels of boxing knowledge here, let me guess, you only ever saw his fights with Trinidad and Hanshaw right? If you were a real boxing fan you'd know that Jones was just doing what he always did, boxing safety first, taking no risks that he doesn't need to. This is a worthless point by you anyway, Calzaghe has a good chin and it'll be almost pointless trying to stop him. Roy is smart enough to know that and adjust his plan accordingly. Shame you aren't.

Do you think Roy will be able to effectively play catch up all fight? Lets be honest here, Roy lost the first 4 rounds against Tito Trinidad... are you hearing me?

Roy won't be playing catchup. He's going to win most of the rounds, if not alll, exactly like back in the day. It doesn't take much to sway the judges, and especially not when they watch Calzaghe throwing his super-double windmill slaps and missing nearly every time, with the only moments of genuine excitement coming when Roy lands clean, hard effective combos. Roy can do this three or four times a round easily, and that'll be enough. Calzaghe won't land any clean shots at all, and even if he does it won't look like it, his style is garbage.

Am I to believe that Joe will not be able to do even more than Felix? If Roy was behind in the first four rounds against Trinidad, what will he do against Joe exactly? Roy won the fight because Trinidad got tired from being inactive for 3 years... Joe will not...

I agree its doubtful that Calzaghe will tire, but it won't matter. As I've described Joe could throw six million of his slaps a round and what he lands still won't make the impact both literally and in the judges minds of what Roy throws. Its a shame Calzaghe never learned to box, if he had, he'd be pretty good.

Roys last fight was in January, that will be 11 months ago come fight time... Joe hasnt had 3 years off, He just fought in April-May, that will be 6 months come fight time... hes more active, hes fresh, and he just got done fighting a slick counter puncher, which will only help him prepare for another one.

You think Roy Jones needs to fight every six months to stay in shape and sharp. That's just the way he is. 11 months isn't a particularly long lay off for a boxer of Roy's experience, what, you think he's going to be too distracted making awesome rap records that he's going to forget how to fight? Please! If anything Calzaghe is coming back too quickly. He showed serious signs of deterioration against Hopkins and he's rushing back to prove he's still got it. Big mistake, a smarter move would have been to retire.

[JAB5239]

Its pretty ironic that an RJJ fan is arguing with a Calzaghe fan that the guy they don't like will win.

That's the idea Drew

I actually like the idea of that. If you are honest with yourself, objective, it forces you to open up to things you may not want to consider by just cheering your man on. Good stuff in my opinion!