Bernstein:Roy Jones is a great athlete; he’s not a great fighter

[Stickman]

I said the same thing back a couple of years ago, though in my opinion he is a great athlete and fighter, just not a great boxer. His technical skills were never as tremendous as his natural athletic abilities, but they were adequate. Now, with his endurance, speed and reflexes faded slightly, he's forced to depend much more on his actual learned boxing skills, which were never what the probably should've been considering the level at which he competed.

[Truth]

I said the same thing back a couple of years ago, though in my opinion he is a great athlete and fighter, just not a great boxer. His technical skills were never as tremendous as his natural athletic abilities, but they were adequate. Now, with his endurance, speed and reflexes faded slightly, he's forced to depend much more on his actual learned boxing skills, which were never what the probably should've been considering the level at which he competed.

I say thats accurate. He was a great fighter because that what used his athletic ability to do. And he was great at it. But I think his actual boxing skills were tailored made for a young fighter, not for an old one. See Roy has/had boxing skills, but unorthodox ones that were made for fast/athletic fighters...

[Dynamite Kid]

Al Bernstein

[DLT]

I dont even remember this thread but it seems like it was popping. I will say that when people say that Floyd will fall off some like Roy did, I always respond by saying that the difference is that Floyd is a much better fundementaly sound fighter then RJ so even if he did get old, he would still be able to give people a ton of problems because his fundementals are so good. Its like MJ still doing good things when he was old even though he couldnt jump or run anymore. Floyd will always have great defense, he will always be accurate, and will always have great balance. RJ was actually based alot on atheleticism. He wasnt a great pure boxer like Floyd is but he still was the best of my generation along with Floyd. He's the only guy that I may put over Floyd in his prime

[hugh grant]

I think Bernstein could say he wasnt a great tecnician as much as he wants, but its about who you are capable of beating at the end of the day, without getting into all the ins and outs of things, which is all subjective.
He beat John Ruiz so deserves credit for being a great fighter and that is the bottom line. So BH is a great fighter because he is a great tecnician but a rubbish athlete then? The bottom line is if he retired after Ruiz this wouldnt even be discussed. All we would be discussing is if he was as good as SRR.

RJJ was a great fighter, with an enviable resume. He might have lacked something but who has it all?

[BennyST]

Yeah I have read that comment before and I don't agree with it. Sure Roy's athletic ability has masked some of his minor technical defficiencies over the years but to watch him and say he is not a great fighter is a bit ridiculous in my mind.

yeah that is a little strange to say the least i can understand the criticism about him not having the fundementals to fall back on but come on not a great fighter

i respect AL Bernstein's opinion he is very knowledgeable but he does tend to favour technical fighters in an overlybiased way IMO you can tell this by the way he creams over James Toney's defensive skill and counter punching ability and defence

No, I think you guys are missing the point he's trying to make. He's absolutely thinks Jones is a great fighter, but less than that at the same time because his fighting skills were hampered by his physical skills.

Bernstein rates Jones very highly, he is simply making an obvious point that Jones' true fighting skills, when everything else is stripped back, are actually not that good at all.

That's the point he's trying to make.

See, a little guy like Duran at the same age as Jones was when he got knocked out, fought what most consider the greatest middleweight of all time in Hagler, after moving up from 120 (SBW) pounds and after nearly a twenty year career, and got damn close to being the only guy to beat him over fifteen. Why? Because his true fighting talent and fighting skill allowed that even after everything, such as his youth, prime, proper weight, speed, ferocity stamina etc etc, had left him.

That's what he means. Hopkins' skill as a fighter is staggering, hence the reason he's doing what he's still doing. Same with Toney.

[Dynamite Kid]

Bernstein rates Jones very highly, he is simply making an obvious point that Jones' true fighting skills, when everything else is stripped back, are actually not that good at all.

Yeah agree.

I think we saw that in the Calzaghe fight to. Now Jones athletic ability has diminished you are left with a technically flawed fighter.

Not to say he was ever a technical fighter, but you get my point.

[DLT]

I think Bernstein could say he wasnt a great tecnician as much as he wants, but its about who you are capable of beating at the end of the day, without getting into all the ins and outs of things, which is all subjective.
He beat John Ruiz so deserves credit for being a great fighter and that is the bottom line. So BH is a great fighter because he is a great tecnician but a rubbish athlete then? The bottom line is if he retired after Ruiz this wouldnt even be discussed. All we would be discussing is if he was as good as SRR.

RJJ was a great fighter, with an enviable resume. He might have lacked something but who has it all?

I agree and I for one always talk about how people forget how good you were when your injuried, when you get hurt, when youre older, or when you retire. I wont hold anything against him after the Ruiz fight. I like Tarver alot but it makes me sick how people think that he wouldve always given RJ problems. No way. A prime RJ smokes him badly

[Haglerwins]

Its a fair comment by Bernstein its only when you look at it as a knock on Jones it goes pear shaped , Jones is a natural fighter hands down relying on reflexes and speed much like Leonard Ali Robinson and recently Mayweather , these guys are not conventional all squared up taught fighters they are naturally gifted athletes with power and speed to burn when their speed and reflex goes so does the largest part of their game there mongoose like ability to not get caught , I think Jones was a great fighter and a great athlete .

I know this is an old post but to lump Floyd in there is way off. Mayweather would age in the ring just like Hopkins has. If his ability was all flash, he would've been beat soundly by Judah, who had him out sped and out gunned. Defense is what saves you when your youthful attributes erode, and Floyd's got the best D behind Wright and Hopkins.

[BetterCallSaul]

Roy Jones was great...he won't retire great. His record has been tarnished.

Now, Manny Pacquaio was great, is great, and will hopefully retire great. I can't see him losing to a welterweight version of Tarver or Johnson.