How Close Did Mike Tyson Come To Achieving Ali Status?

[Willie Pep 229]

Gus D'Amota was as much an exploiter as anyone who used Tyson; it just came in a manner that is not readily evident. Tyson's nurturing (spoiled) in the Catskills guaranteed his arrested development.

Tyson may very well be an intelligent man, certainly street smart and a survivor, but that's irrelevant; he was a profoundly ignorant, immature man and it was D'Amota who insured that that's the man Tyson would remain.

They kept him out of the public school system, constantly separating him form the real world, insuring he would never achieve the necessary socialization skills he would need to face the world. They dismissed anyone who threatened to burst the illusion they created around him.

He was treated like a prize race horse.

Then again, other than the two "Sugars" are there really any fighters who weren't exploited; robbed; used?

[QueensburyRules]

- -Was he even eligible for the public school system designed for even more unregulated fights and suspension?

Sorry, but clearly private schooling with clear discipline much like Babe Ruth and Satchel Paige got was their ticket to fame and fortune.

Homicidal Teddy dismissed for illegal, dangerous behavior, not Mike. He's still a loose screw waiting to fly off.

[Willie Pep 229]

Na! -- I can't speak to Page but Ruth was raised in an orphanage with other children and had a structured education. No comparison. --- They say the old lady up in the Catskills use to do Tyson's homework (home school) for him, so they say.

Atlas' dismissal? I'm sure there's a technicality, but I am also sure that you know he was rocking the boat.

But what can you do . . . I suspect life in Brownsville was considerably worst.

[Tatabanya]

Mike Tyson was still a fearsome fighter under Richie Giachetti, in fact? His form and win against Alex Stewart was exceptional.

I would back Mike Tyson in the early 1990's to possibly beat Evander Holyfield and Rid**** Bowe 'Bowe would be a easier fight than Holyfield'.

I even thought Tyson looked great vs Holyfield in their second fight for as long as it lasted 'Both guys weighing in at 218 pounds, that fight should of been one of the greatest heavyweight fights in history'

Excellent points. Giachetti was the lone trainer who made the post-prison Tyson still look a force in the division. And I, too, am convinced that Tyson would have won the second fight had he not lost control of his mind.

Incidentally, Stewart had given hell to Holyfield a while before meeting Tyson, who just wiped the floor with him.

[Tatabanya]

Gus D'Amota was as much an exploiter as anyone who used Tyson; it just came in a manner that is not readily evident. Tyson's nurturing (spoiled) in the Catskills guaranteed his arrested development.

Tyson may very well be an intelligent man, certainly street smart and a survivor, but that's irrelevant; he was a profoundly ignorant, immature man and it was D'Amota who insured that that's the man Tyson would remain.

They kept him out of the public school system, constantly separating him form the real world, insuring he would never achieve the necessary socialization skills he would need to face the world. They dismissed anyone who threatened to burst the illusion they created around him.

He was treated like a prize race horse.

Then again, other than the two "Sugars" are there really any fighters who weren't exploited; robbed; used?

It's actually "Cus D'Amato".

[QueensburyRules]

Na! -- I can't speak to Page but Ruth was raised in an orphanage with other children and had a structured education. No comparison. --- They say the old lady up in the Catskills use to do Tyson's homework (home school) for him, so they say.

Atlas' dismissal? I'm sure there's a technicality, but I am also sure that you know he was rocking the boat.

But what can you do . . . I suspect life in Brownsville was considerably worst.

Why would anyone need to Tyson's work in their own private schooling? Like I say, age 19-20 and Tyson considerably more well spoken in adult company than Clay.

[PRINCEKOOL]

Excellent points. Giachetti was the lone trainer who made the post-prison Tyson still look a force in the division. And I, too, am convinced that Tyson would have won the second fight had he not lost control of his mind.

Incidentally, Stewart had given hell to Holyfield a while before meeting Tyson, who just wiped the floor with him.

I like the way he looked and performed under Giachetti 'His run just before prison was really impressive'. Who knows why Mike Tyson was so good under Giachetti? It would of been interesting to see what system Giachetti hand etc

Those opening rounds of Tyson vs Holyfield 2, both of them just looked like coiled springs. That fight would of really been something 'That was the last fight where Tyson, purely on competitive spirit? Wanted to just beat Holyfield' The competition between those two was always real.

[Willie Pep 229]

Why would anyone need to Tyson's work in their own private schooling? Like I say, age 19-20 and Tyson considerably more well spoken in adult company than Clay.

Good point - like I said, it was just one of the things you hear. -- Tyson was enrolled up there for a very short time but removed for some reason. -- Home school kids have to show some achievement so that the State doesn't step in, but again, maybe it was just someone looking to make it all look/sound bad.

There are all these other STORIES of him eating other people's diner and when they complain D'Amato would tell them to back off . . . ETC.

He wasn't being disciplined.

Yea, but being better spoken than Ali isn't a great achievement, but again I am not saying he isn't intelligent or even bright, the issue isn't his intelligence, it is his impetuous unchecked behavior. That's where they failed him.

Tell me about Page's background, where did he come from?

[Willie Pep 229]

It's actually "Cus D'Amato".

Thanks! . . . .

[Tatabanya]

I like the way he looked and performed under Giachetti 'His run just before prison was really impressive'. Who knows why Mike Tyson was so good under Giachetti? It would of been interesting to see what system Giachetti hand etc

Those opening rounds of Tyson vs Holyfield 2, both of them just looked like coiled springs. That fight would of really been something 'That was the last fight where Tyson, purely on competitive spirit? Wanted to just beat Holyfield' The competition between those two was always real.

What I find peculiar is the difference of Tyson's style according to the fights. Against Stewart, and in the second Holyfield fight, he seemed to have regained a composure that, instead, I saw missing in the first Holyfield fight and - in spurts - also in the Ruddock fights. Proof to me that Mike's focus was starting to waver, depending on what was going on in his private life.

Watch again Tyson's ring walk in the second Holyfield fight. He looks like he's about to explode right then and there. He already knew that Don King had screwed him, and was continuing to do so. The look of Tyson's face in that moment is scary, and - in hindsight - it's obvious now to realize that the bite was the logical consequence of that state of mind. When he saw himself wounded, Tyson became a beast. The very Giachetti looks stunned during the 3rd round chaos, if you look at him attentively...