The Myth Of Mike Tyson

[Yogi]

The Tyson who beat Spinks was ripped, fast, DID use headmovement but the point is, the fight only lasted 91 seconds!! What kind of moron could be able to see all of Tyson's ability's if he's going for the early ko and he ends it in 1 and a half minute. Man you are so biased. And he was motivated that night, even after Lewis tried to **** him up mentally when he came in his lockerroom. He was ready and Rooney pumped him up like usual. See, he LISTENED to his corner when he was with Rooney, when he was with Don King, he didn't give a **** about all the things that he thought because he thought he was superman and couldn't get hurt.

And like i said one time in another thread, sometimes things that happen before a fight can have positive effects on a fighter. You'd think that Buster Douglass' mother dying would be the worst thing that could happen to him before a fight right YOGI? No. The things that happened before the Spinks fight made Tyson more angry and gave him more determination, and it ended up in a 91 seconds destruction of a great fighter.

I know you never watch the Spinks, Douglass or any other Tyson fight, unlike me(I watch them nearly every day) but keep talking, you make no sence and it ends up with me owning you.

Oh yeah, dont worry about the bad karma, i'll give you more as soon as i can you sack of ****.

Yeah, and the Tyson who beat Seldon was even more ripped, just as fast, and used a hell of a LOT more head movement than the one who faced Spinks (for the first minute and a half of the Lewis fight I also see a hell of a lot more head movement out of that Tyson than the one who faced Spinks, as I do with MANY different fights of Tyson's)...didn't throw as many punches versus Seldon (the use of his left jab was quite a bit more prevailant in that fight, though), but it's a comparable fight because both lasted about a minute and a half. And contrary to what this other guy with the foot fetish says, there ain't no impressive side-to-side movement or impressive punching angles shown by Tyson in that fight...He came straight at Spinks from the front (with very little head movement, side-to-side movement or punching angles, I add yet again) and loaded up on his powershots which were mostly singular in their deliverance.

"What kind of moron could be able to see all of Tyson's abilities if he's going for the early KO and he ends it in one and a half minutes?"

I don't know, but why don't you ask all of your fellow fanboys who have the opinion that the version of Tyson who defeated Spinks was the best & most complete Tyson there ever was, and also have the opinion that he beats or destroys any other heavyweight in history...You've read that plenty of times from your fellow fanboys, I'm sure, as have I.

And Tyson should have been somewhat motivated for the Spinks fight because he was fighting for the REAL heavyweight championship on that night, although unfortuntely for him, on that night he missed out on breaking Patterson's "youngest heavyweight champion ever" record by only a matter of a few weeks...

He also should have been somewhat motivated for the fight with Douglas because he was defending the title, and contary to popular belief amongst Tyson fanboys like yourself, he did in fact train for the Douglas fight, as there is in fact both video evidence and contemporary reports stating as such...Three weeks before the fight "Tyson has been sparring five or six rounds a day while preparing for his second title defense in Japan in two years" according to an AP report from eyewitnesses. A week and a half before the fight he was involved in some "three rounds of furious exchanges of heavy punches" with his sparring partners like Page. Heck, going by the prefight reports of their respective training camps, it was Douglas who was less impressive in training as evident by some of the "Douglas looked sluggish in abbreviated public workout" like comments made in the days leading up to the fight. Douglas was also reportedly "taking pain-killing penicillin shots from a nagging infection" in the days leading up to the fight, as well...

Oh, and I don't know about you see, but out of the two fighters in the ring that night, it certainly wasn't Tyson's man boobs that were bouncing up and down all throughout the fight.

And how do you know I never watch Tyson's fights?

Is video of him supposed to be some kind of great secret only made viewable by you Tyson fanboys or something?

Well, judging by the fact that I have a whole ****load of his fights, and also judging by the fact that the guy is on television just about every week up here in Canada...apparently not.

You are more than welcome to give me bad karma every chance you get, Yaman, and that's perfectly OK with me...As is the name calling.

P.S. Whether they said those comments or not...The last comments I've heard from Leonard was that he invented things similiar the bolo punch and the Ali-like shuffle, and the last words I can remember hearing out of Atlas' mouth was his opinion that Judah was going to beat Mayweather (Foreman says dumb **** all the time, so...)...Don't mind if I don't take those "experts" words as gospel or something like that, especially when the information is out there in ABUNDANCE when it comes to Tyson, and thus gives one plenty of material to enable them to have their own opinions.

[Yogi]

Oh wait, Yaman...what's with this "great fighter" comment in reference to Spinks?

A great light heavyweight when he was younger and much more active, yes, but I sincerely hope you are not referring to him as a great heavyweight because he was anything but that at that weight and when he faced Tyson.

[BKM-]

AGAIN, the tyson who fought Spinks was trained by Rooney and was the same as he was in 86/87. He was just a lot more aggressive and pissed off by the things that happened before the fight. Michael Spink froze before the bell rang and couldn't defend himself. If it was Berbick, no way would he have been able to walk trough him in 1 round. It was the same prime Tyson who fought Berbick. He didn't need to move his head(Even though he did move his head in the 91 seconds, but thats what he was trained for, i bob and weave my head even when i dont need to sometimes. Its just something you're used to) How many times did Spinks throw and land his jab? Never, he froze like i told you, so i dont see why he would have to move his head like he did against Jesse Ferguson.

I'll point it out again, he was simply allowed to blow Spinks away because he COULD. Berbick, Tucker, Thomas etc, were too strong. And what the **** were you talking about..his body not ripped? Im sure you've seen the replay of the ko, Yogi, when he flexed and looked as ripped as ever. I do not see anything diffirent about tyson's body.

But in the Douglass fight he wasn't ripped at all. Rooney said it(On several docu's like ''Legendrary Nights: Douglass vs Tyson) and this was the man who trained Tyson for years and years. Did you know Tyson starved himself to death to get to his weight for that fight? And Rooney was right, Tyson didn't look like he trained like a freak. He did it in the 80s with Rooney. With Don Kings team he became lazy and thought he was unbeatable, therefor, why need to train like crazy when you're gonna KO him in 1 round right? Well that was his downfall. Teddy Atlas hates Tyson, and he also said the same. Thats the diffirence between you and Atlas, you are biased. Im sure Atlas think Tysons a ''piece of **** in and sometimes out of the ring'' but atleast he's not blinded by hate. Im not blinded by love, you are blinded by hate.

[BKM-]

Im not one of those biased ''Tyson fanboys''. I do not think he was unbeatable. I do not think the Tyson who fought Berbick or Spinks would have beaten anyone. In fact, i think fighters like Ali, Holmes, Foreman, Louis, Holyfield and some others could have beaten Mike. I see it like that.

But i'll never say Tyson was in his skillfull prime when he fought Douglass. I see it like this, if Tyson came in prepared bla bla bla, he would have a very tough fight and might have lost. I think it would have either been a decision win for Douglass or KO for Tyson. Douglass had a glass chin. Tyson could have cracked trough it at any round if he landed something cleanly. But i cant see Douglass KO a prime Tyson like that. He was a sitting duck the whole fight and it gave Douglass an open look and miracle 'right uppercut, left hook, right hook, left hook' that KO'd Tyson. So prime Tyson vs Douglass may have gone to Douglass for sure.

And dont take the ''red karma'' and name calling serious. Its all bull****.

[Mike Tyson77]

Tyson against the greats.

W Ali TKO 4
W Johnson MD 12
W Marciano TKO 9
W Frazier UD 12
W Foreman TKO 7
W Louis KO 5
W Liston KO 2
W Dempsey MD 12
W Tunny KO 3

I strongly belive a motivated prime Tyson could have destroyed anyone.

[RockyMarcianofan00]

Tyson against the greats.

W Ali TKO 4
W Johnson MD 12
W Marciano TKO 9
W Frazier UD 12
W Foreman TKO 7
W Louis KO 5
W Liston KO 2
W Dempsey MD 12
W Tunny KO 3

I strongly belive a motivated prime Tyson could have destroyed anyone.

No way Tyson would last 9 rounds with prime Marciano, thats not to say that tyson couldn't win, i'm just saying he'd do it in 5 because after that stamina issues would get to him and Marciano always wore opponents down.

Against Frazier I can't see him UD'ing Frazier. This is because once again against a fighter with Power and Stamina like Frazier (granted Tyson in his prime would only most likely have a solid 5-6 rounds with a fighter like Frazier) He's have to do it within those rounds. Though Frazier and Tyson fought similar I'd still give Frazier an edge.

Against Foreman, I think it would be similar to Foreman v Frazier, Tyson may not go down as much as Frazier because I think Tyson's chin was alittle better and his head movement would allow him to evade easier. Although the fact of the matter is no way Tyson would get up as many times as Frazier, Tyson just didn't have Fraziers heart. Also Tyson was afraid of Foreman so he'd be mentally shaken going into the fight.

Thats all i'm going to do because i don't feel like typing anymore

Granted though Prime Tyson did have a fighting chance with most greats.

[Yogi]

AGAIN, the tyson who fought Spinks was trained by Rooney and was the same as he was in 86/87. He was just a lot more aggressive and pissed off by the things that happened before the fight. Michael Spink froze before the bell rang and couldn't defend himself. If it was Berbick, no way would he have been able to walk trough him in 1 round. It was the same prime Tyson who fought Berbick. He didn't need to move his head(Even though he did move his head in the 91 seconds, but thats what he was trained for, i bob and weave my head even when i dont need to sometimes. Its just something you're used to) How many times did Spinks throw and land his jab? Never, he froze like i told you, so i dont see why he would have to move his head like he did against Jesse Ferguson.

I'll point it out again, he was simply allowed to blow Spinks away because he COULD. Berbick, Tucker, Thomas etc, were too strong. And what the **** were you talking about..his body not ripped? Im sure you've seen the replay of the ko, Yogi, when he flexed and looked as ripped as ever. I do not see anything diffirent about tyson's body.

But in the Douglass fight he wasn't ripped at all. Rooney said it(On several docu's like ''Legendrary Nights: Douglass vs Tyson) and this was the man who trained Tyson for years and years. Did you know Tyson starved himself to death to get to his weight for that fight? And Rooney was right, Tyson didn't look like he trained like a freak. He did it in the 80s with Rooney. With Don Kings team he became lazy and thought he was unbeatable, therefor, why need to train like crazy when you're gonna KO him in 1 round right? Well that was his downfall. Teddy Atlas hates Tyson, and he also said the same. Thats the diffirence between you and Atlas, you are biased. Im sure Atlas think Tysons a ''piece of **** in and sometimes out of the ring'' but atleast he's not blinded by hate. Im not blinded by love, you are blinded by hate.

First off, I'll take back my comments on how Tyson's physical appearance was versus Spinks, as he did look in very good shape. Not as "ripped" as he was say versus Holmes, but yeah, he did look a little bit better than he did versus Douglas...

I'll take that part back, but I won't take back my comments about his lack of head movement and such...I mean, you probably aren't the person to be talking to about this, but I just never understood those "the night he beat Spinks he beats everybody" comments...

"His techniques in the Spinks fight were not high level. If Cus D'Amato had watched the fight he would have commented that there was no slipping, no bobbing, no weaving, the trademarks of the D'Amato system." - Steve Lott

I'm in agreement with Tyson's cornerman for that fight, as I tried to point out earlier. That stuff wasn't really there in that fight against Spinks, and if judging that performance against other all-time greats at heavyweight, then it has to considered not there for those fights, as well. In fact, in that fight Tyson showed a style that many Tyson fanboys have been critical of and as some kind of indicator of what a past his prime Tyson does...A lack of head movement and a guy who's only looking for a quick knockout. A big win for Tyson (probably his biggest) because of the signifcance of him winning the real heavyweight championship. But the performance? Nah...all he did was go out there, go straight forward with very little head movement, and blast some guy that didn't look to have had desire to be in the ring on that night.

Moving on...

Againt Douglas he did have a tiny bit of extra around the trunk line, which was no different than he had for other fights of his earlier in his career (like the Ferguson fight you mentioned). But ****, the guy was still built like a brick ****house in that Douglas fight, and yeah, I'd say that he was ripped...

And you know, I could really care less what Rooney says about Tyson's career after he left him. I've read plenty of interviews from him in over the years, and all it seems he does is criticize Tyson's fighting abilities after he left, and I think that's his own personal way of trying to elevate himself as a trainer (has he done ANYTHING else of great note in boxing besides being Tyson's trainer). It's like he's constantly saying that "Tyson is nothing without me", and even over the last couple of years I've read his words stating that Tyson would be just as good as he ever was if only he returned to Rooney's training ways...Ridiculous!

To me his words on Tyson are all said with an agenda of elevating himself, like what he says nowadays about the first fight that Tyson had without him in his corner, which was against Bruno...Sorry Rooney, but I don't see a fighter in that fight whose skills were "greatly diminished", or "hadn't trained" or "wasn't using Cus' style anymore", and whatver else he said about that version of Tyson. In fact, I'd take that Tyson over the Rooney-trained ones that fought the likes of Nino Ribalta, Bonecrusher Smith, and maybe a couple of other ones (from mememory the performance against Tubbs wasn't overly impressive, besides the final few seconds of the fight).

And speaking about the Douglas fight, he had the opinion that Tyson "didn't want to win" that fight. Sorry, but that is also a load of crap, and if you can't see that by the way Tyson was fighting (showing he in fact had some heart by taking the ****kicking he did on that night and still trying to win), at least the post fight actions of Tyson (press conferance) shows that he very much wanted to win that fight. A fighter who "didn't want to win" doesn't show the emotion that Mike did after the fight, when he was very much pissed with what happened in that fight.

And no I didn't know that Tyson "starved himself to death" for the Douglas fight, nor does it look like he did when he was in the ring. But let me guess...more Rooney comments?

If so, how on earth would he know what the hell was going on in Tyson's camp for that fight, because he certainly wasn't speaking with Tyson or anybody else that was directly affiliated with Mike at that time (has he even spoken to Tyson since he was fired and responded by sueing?)?

[K-DOGG]

First off, I'll take back my comments on how Tyson's physical appearance was versus Spinks, as he did look in very good shape. Not as "ripped" as he was say versus Holmes, but yeah, he did look a little bit better than he did versus Douglas...

I'll take that part back, but I won't take back my comments about his lack of head movement and such...I mean, you probably aren't the person to be talking to about this, but I just never understood those "the night he beat Spinks he beats everybody" comments...

"His techniques in the Spinks fight were not high level. If Cus D'Amato had watched the fight he would have commented that there was no slipping, no bobbing, no weaving, the trademarks of the D'Amato system." - Steve Lott

I'm in agreement with Tyson's cornerman for that fight, as I tried to point out earlier. That stuff wasn't really there in that fight against Spinks, and if judging that performance against other all-time greats at heavyweight, then it has to considered not there for those fights, as well. In fact, in that fight Tyson showed a style that many Tyson fanboys have been critical of and as some kind of indicator of what a past his prime Tyson does...A lack of head movement and a guy who's only looking for a quick knockout. A big win for Tyson (probably his biggest) because of the signifcance of him winning the real heavyweight championship. But the performance? Nah...all he did was go out there, go straight forward with very little head movement, and blast some guy that didn't look to have had desire to be in the ring on that night.

Moving on...

Againt Douglas he did have a tiny bit of extra around the trunk line, which was no different than he had for other fights of his earlier in his career (like the Ferguson fight you mentioned). But ****, the guy was still built like a brick ****house in that Douglas fight, and yeah, I'd say that he was ripped...

And you know, I could really care less what Rooney says about Tyson's career after he left him. I've read plenty of interviews from him in over the years, and all it seems he does is criticize Tyson's fighting abilities after he left, and I think that's his own personal way of trying to elevate himself as a trainer (has he done ANYTHING else of great note in boxing besides being Tyson's trainer). It's like he's constantly saying that "Tyson is nothing without me", and even over the last couple of years I've read his words stating that Tyson would be just as good as he ever was if only he returned to Rooney's training ways...Ridiculous!

To me his words on Tyson are all said with an agenda of elevating himself, like what he says nowadays about the first fight that Tyson had without him in his corner, which was against Bruno...Sorry Rooney, but I don't see a fighter in that fight whose skills were "greatly diminished", or "hadn't trained" or "wasn't using Cus' style anymore", and whatver else he said about that version of Tyson. In fact, I'd take that Tyson over the Rooney-trained ones that fought the likes of Nino Ribalta, Bonecrusher Smith, and maybe a couple of other ones (from mememory the performance against Tubbs wasn't overly impressive, besides the final few seconds of the fight).

And speaking about the Douglas fight, he had the opinion that Tyson "didn't want to win" that fight. Sorry, but that is also a load of crap, and if you can't see that by the way Tyson was fighting (showing he in fact had some heart by taking the ****kicking he did on that night and still trying to win), at least the post fight actions of Tyson (press conferance) shows that he very much wanted to win that fight. A fighter who "didn't want to win" doesn't show the emotion that Mike did after the fight, when he was very much pissed with what happened in that fight.

And no I didn't know that Tyson "starved himself to death" for the Douglas fight, nor does it look like he did when he was in the ring. But let me guess...more Rooney comments?

If so, how on earth would he know what the hell was going on in Tyson's camp for that fight, because he certainly wasn't speaking with Tyson or anybody else that was directly affiliated with Mike at that time (has he even spoken to Tyson since he was fired and responded by sueing?)?

Actually, I'd read that Tyson ate too much "pie" going into the Douglas bout.

[Yogi]

Actually, I'd read that Tyson ate too much "pie" going into the Douglas bout.

Yeah, and there has to be at least a little protein taken in when doing that, don't you think?

[K-DOGG]

Yeah, and there has to be at least a little protein taken in when doing that, don't you think?

Among other things!