Where do you rank Ray Leonard?

[young_robbed]

^^You used your opinion, I used facts to back up my argument.

dude it's not an opinion when it's clear as day that Hagler was not at his best. I've already conceded that Leonard was rusty & past prime. No one is denying that. They both were.

[Japanese Boxing]

Just read through this thread and got confused when Ray Corso knew Ray when he was 12. I was like That's 1933 or some ****, no ****ing way. Then I realized he meant Leonard. #Mind****ed

[Verbal_Jab]

Great fighter. Beat the best around. Avenged his first loss, though Duran was so outta shape for that one he forced those famous words: "No Mas". Pretty solid, overall. Not terribly active - though how you chose to weigh that in your opinion is up to you.

I rank other fighters higher on my list, but that's personal preference. I can't deny his skill - it was sublime when he was at his best.

[Anthony342]

dude it's not an opinion when it's clear as day that Hagler was not at his best. I've already conceded that Leonard was rusty & past prime. No one is denying that. They both were.

Exactly, I admit that as well. Leonard could've also been more active but he decided to retire again after the Kevin Howard fight in 1984 because his ego couldn't handle an early knockdown, even though he went on to TKO him. They both were rusty and past prime. And I said it was still a good win, just not a great win, which it would've been up to 1984 or 1985.

[Ham Porter]

It's just my opinion I'm NOT selling it!

Your own ******ity and ignorance sells itself. Anyone can spout off some ridiculously ****** and illogical statement/argument under the guise of it being an 'opinion' - doesn't make it any less ****** and laughable.


I really can't give any credence to the opinion of someone who thinks Antonio Cervantes was "well passed his prime" when he was given a comprehensive boxing lesson (it always helps to actually watch fights if they're available, creepy Ray; simply browsing boxrec doesn't paint the full picture) by Wilfred Benitez.

[soul_survivor]

Exactly, I admit that as well. Leonard could've also been more active but he decided to retire again after the Kevin Howard fight in 1984 because his ego couldn't handle an early knockdown, even though he went on to TKO him. They both were rusty and past prime. And I said it was still a good win, just not a great win, which it would've been up to 1984 or 1985.

how can it not be a great win? a guy who started his career and spent the majority of his fights at 147 was fighting one of the greatest middleweights eve, not only that, that middleweight had been consistently active and fought and beat legitimate threats while Leonard was injured/retired/high.

SRL went into that fight an underdog and came out with an iconic victory and the only reason the fight was even close was because Leonard wasn't active enough, other than that he made Hagler swing and miss as if Hagler was a 2-0 novice.

It was brilliant.

[Anthony342]

By playing games and waiting until he knew Hagler was shot, rather than fighting him at his best, that's how. Leonard himself has even admitted to this.

[BKM-2010]

By playing games and waiting until he knew Hagler was shot, rather than fighting him at his best, that's how. Leonard himself has even admitted to this.

I don't know why you are ignoring the things mentioned about Leonard's state as a boxer at the time. You can't possibly think that Leonard wasting half a decade of his prime years with inactivity and even drug use to wait out Hagler's momentum was a smart thing to do. If anything he would have had a lot more going for him if he went for that fight a few years earlier when Hagler was a bit more fresh, as he himself would not be as rusty and far gone. It's not like the discrepancy between them would have been that much different.

[Ray Corso]

R. Stokes referring to me as ****** and ignorant sums up who you are! You insult someone over a keyboard and in the safety of your home, not much of a man sonny.
Tony was passed his prime when Wilfred met him and it wasn't a wash it was fairly competitive considering Tony's situation.
You are conversing with someone who knows many of these individuals personally and has worked in the business for the majority of my adult life!
As I said I'm not selling you a damn thing but your opinion would have more credence if you had some credentials in the sport.
Did you box?
Do you own a gym?
What promotion have you worked with?
What states were/are you licensed in?

I could go on & on and your answers would be NONE!
So sonny shut the lights and mop the floor and use the pine sol because the gym is closed tomorrow, REASON! Everyone is tired of hearing your bull ****!!!

When you want to insult a man try it in person it has more validity and you'll come across a bit more genuine instead of looking like a lil kid! nite junior, Ray.

[soul_survivor]

I don't know why you are ignoring the things mentioned about Leonard's state as a boxer at the time. You can't possibly think that Leonard wasting half a decade of his prime years with inactivity and even drug use to wait out Hagler's momentum was a smart thing to do. If anything he would have had a lot more going for him if he went for that fight a few years earlier when Hagler was a bit more fresh, as he himself would not be as rusty and far gone. It's not like the discrepancy between them would have been that much different.

lol people think SRL retired, went on a massive drugs binge, had huge marital problems which affected him both personally and professionally was a way to psyche out Hagler and win some mind games