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Fighters Who Were Never The Same After Their First Loss

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Scott9945 View Post
    Wmute beat me to Davey Moore. But Jeff Lacy hasn't been mentioned yet.
    I mentioned jeff lacy first on pg 1, then someone else did on pg 2 or 3.
    Last edited by JAB5239; 04-15-2012, 11:56 AM.

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    • #32
      Alfonso Zamora

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      • #33
        Originally posted by JK1700 View Post
        Watch his fight with Juan Lazcano. Where he was nearly knocked out again by the same kind of "check hook" that Mayweather stopped him with. He looked absolutley terrible in that fight. He didn't look anything like the man who made Kostya Tszyu quit and the man who absolutley destroyed Jose Luis Castillo in 4 one sided rounds less than a year earlier. Hatton said himself that the Floyd fight really hurt him mentally and that it impacted him a lot more than the Pacquiao fight did. That first loss just killed his confidence and the damage that he took also had a major impact, he took a lot of clean, hard punches in the Mayweather fight. He didn't just lose, he got almost completely dominated and brutally knocked out in front of thousands of his adoring fans and millions who were watching at home. I think that fight just wrecked him, mentally and physically.

        Zab Judah did look pretty good in the early rounds against Floyd, but Floyd was on the verge of stopping him late in that fight and Judah literally low blowed his way out of trouble in a desperate attempt to avoid it, which to me was his way of looking for a way out and something that could easily be considered quitting. I think Floyd dominates any version of Judah, but I think that Tszyu fight just hurt Judah's confidence alot. He loses focus very easily now and when things aren't going his way he looks for a way out. His confidence in himself is very limited.

        Naseem Hamed and Jeff Lacy are definitely good examples though.

        Castillo was shot and the perfect style for Hatton. That was a joke fight and Hatton was supposed to KTFO of Castillo, anything else would have been a shocker.

        Lacey actually looked very good in his fight after calzaghe with Vitali and beat a good opponent and continued to fight after he tore is rotator cuff. He has looked **** since that fight. I dont believe he has been "mentally damaged" from the calzaghe fight to where he is afraid of the likes of Otis Griffin and Daffar Smith. I think his arm is ruined. Its not that he isnt trying to land or that hes ever quit a fight, its that he cant get it to land.
        Last edited by elfag; 04-15-2012, 06:46 AM.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Scott9945 View Post
          Actually Hatton's problems started after the Pacquiao fight, not the Mayweather fight. At least according to Ricky...

          Uh ricky said he was depressed and Crying BEFORE the Pac fight. BEFORE from his own words. Nice try poochiao fan.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by el*** View Post
            Uh ricky said he was depressed and Crying BEFORE the Pac fight. BEFORE from his own words. Nice try poochiao fan.

            He wasn't binging on drugs before then. Sorry if the facts don't match your agenda.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by Mastrangelo
              I don't buy that Hatton "ruined" thing. He would never,ever beat Pacquiao with his style anyway and he didn't look like "ruined" fighter against Malignaggi. Zab Judah also isn't best example to me, he looked as good as ever against Floyd after not even one loss.
              Jeff Lacy comes to my mind, he was never nothing special, but when he additionally lost that confidence that he previously had, he was finished.
              Naseem Hamed, I guess his world fall apart with that lost. He fought only one more time, but I think you could see that. Before he didn't seem to believe that loss is an option.

              Ricky was still pretty good technically after Floyd. But his punch resistance was much reduced. He looked pretty shaky in the chin department in the Lascano fight, despite putting on a good display of boxing. A few years earlier he walked through some monster punches from Tszyu without flinching.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by SCtrojansbaby View Post
                Griffin took a knee, the ref didn't even really notice Griffin was on a knee one and didn't DQ Roy until Griffin faked the delayed reaction KO

                Also Donald Curry has no buisness being in this thread.
                I thought Griffin milked that punch too. Some refs wouldn't have disqualified Roy for that infringement.

                Mike Tyson and Marciano avoided being disqualified when hitting opponents who were already down. When Marciano Suzi Q'd Walcott he didn't need to hit him with a left hook as well when he was down. I seem to recall Tyson hitting Bruno in the first round of their first fight when Bruno was down too. There are dozens of other examples.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by el*** View Post
                  Castillo was shot and the perfect style for Hatton. That was a joke fight and Hatton was supposed to KTFO of Castillo, anything else would have been a shocker.

                  Lacey actually looked very good in his fight after calzaghe with Vitali and beat a good opponent and continued to fight after he tore is rotator cuff. He has looked **** since that fight. I dont believe he has been "mentally damaged" from the calzaghe fight to where he is afraid of the likes of Otis Griffin and Daffar Smith. I think his arm is ruined. Its not that he isnt trying to land or that hes ever quit a fight, its that he cant get it to land.
                  Castillo was past it no doubt, but how exactly could he have the perfect style for Hatton? Hatton likes to go on top of ppl maul them and wrestle them, and JLC was the best inside fighter below of the lower weights.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Mastrangelo
                    Nah, man. That was just terrible style match-up for Hatton, he would never, EVER beat Pacquiao. You can't just go at Pac with you face in front and push him around. Honestly I don't even think Pryor could be effective against Pacquiao with that kind of style. Floyd was catching Ricky on the way in all night long and Pacquiao was doing the same thing, just the night wasn't that long because you can't take Mannys punches like that, at least Hatton can't.


                    And that's what I mean when I say that all what Tszyu ruined was hype around Judah. He was even better after that loss because he wasn't that good when he faced Tszyu. Did he strugled with Corley? Yeah, but Corley was also best win for Judah at the time. I don't think that young inexperienced Zab from 2001 beats Spinks, who was pretty damn good.
                    From what I have seen, I think Hatton took just as hard if not harder punches from Collazo and Mayweather than he did from Pacquiao. So it's not like the power was the difference. The reason why Pacquiao walked through him the way he did is because Hatton was an accident waiting to happen. He was depressed, damaged physically, weight drained and working with a trainer that didn't suit him. It's not because Pacquiao was 2-3-4 levels above him in skills or power. I'm not stating that Hatton would beat Pacquiao but in his prime when he was undefeated he definitely would have given him a tough fight. Pacquiao and Hatton are both brawlers. It's not a matter of "This guy can't handle this guy's style". They have very similar styles, the only difference is that Manny is a southpaw. Again i'm not stating that Hatton would beat Pacquiao but I find it very hard to imagine him just destroying him in his prime. I think it would have been a competitive fight if they had fought when Hatton was undefeated.

                    You might be right Judah but Judah looked really good in the first round against Tszyu, he was embarrassing him at times and it wasn't because Kostya was letting him. Judah was always very talented. I guess your right though, the fight didn't "ruin" him because he has had quite a bit of success following it, but I think he would have definitely developed into a better fighter and had a better career if he didn't fight Tszyu, that's for sure. After that fight he became very weak mentally. As evidenced in several fights.

                    Originally posted by BostonGuy View Post
                    Jeff Lacy comes to mind. This guy was hyped by the media, fans and pundits as a super star in the smw division. I think at time he undefeated, he was in an ESPN commercial as well. Well, we all know what happened when he faced the more experienced, skilled and determined Joe Calzaghe. Calzaghe schooled Lacy for most of the fight and beat him pillar to post...

                    After the Calzaghe fight, Lacy was never the same fight. His confidence and swagger were gone and his body never properly healed from the beating he took. Lacy was plagued with injuries the rest of his career to the point where he retired several years ago.
                    This is probably as good an example as there is after Hatton. People want to downgrade Calzaghe because of how Lacy turned out and look at him as a bum but the reality is that he was a pretty good fighter, he just got destroyed by a great fighter and was never the same afterwards. He took a hell of a lot of punishment in that fight too. So much so that when he fought Roy Jones he looked like the 40 year old in the ring when he was actually like 31 or 32.

                    Originally posted by Hitman Hodgson View Post
                    I think De La Hoya could come under this category. He still had a decent career after the loss to Trinidad but I don't think he was anywear near a good of a fighter.
                    I disagree with this one. I thought Oscar beat Trinidad pretty clearly in their fight and I don't think it really affected him too much. He still put up two great fights against Mosley (One of which he should have won) and beat Vargas and Mayorga, and performed very well against Mayweather despite losing clearly. I think what really ruined Oscar was his inactivity. He should have fought more often towards the end of his career, and he should never have gone up to Middleweight. That was a big mistake. He was just too small.

                    Originally posted by Cuauhtli. View Post
                    Juan Manuel Lopez
                    Originally posted by Hitman Hodgson View Post
                    Kelly Pavlik
                    Originally posted by Something Jr View Post
                    You can also add Kirkland to that list.
                    I see where they are coming from but I think these ones kind of come under the "were just never really that good to begin with and got exposed" column. People say things like "Well Kirkland wasn't prepared for Ishida and he wasn't the same against Molina as he was against Angulo". I don't buy into that. I just think the guy is very limited and people were hyping him up as being much better than he really is. And as somebody pointed out he had his best win after his first loss. It's the same kind of thing with Pavlik and Lopez. People said Lopez lost to Salido because of his personal problems but he lost the rematch too. Although I think Pavlik's loss to Bernard and the way it happened is bound to have had a negative impact on Pavlik and certainly his confidence. I think he probably would have lost to a guy like Martinez regardless of whether he fought Bernard or not.

                    Originally posted by Sugarj View Post
                    Ricky was still pretty good technically after Floyd. But his punch resistance was much reduced. He looked pretty shaky in the chin department in the Lascano fight, despite putting on a good display of boxing. A few years earlier he walked through some monster punches from Tszyu without flinching.
                    Exactly, and you've gotta realise that for a guy with a pressure style like Hatton, having good punch resistance is very important. I watched his fight with Mayweather again last night and although Floyd didn't put many combinations together, the single shots that he was throwing were very brutal, and a lot of them were landing flush and on the equilibrium too! It's not just his "chin" that will have been hurt by that. His balance and co-ordination will have been hurt too.

                    Taking a lot of clean shots and getting brutally knocked out the way he did changes fighters to a bigger extent than people realise. I remember one of my favorite fighters, Veeraphol Sahaprom. In his prime he was really quick, well balanced and accurate and precise with everything he did. His offence and defensive were both excellent. After he got knocked out by Hozumi Hasegawa in their rematch, he just looked so slow, unnecessarily cautious and sloppy. He was a shell of his former self after that fight and I think it was the same with Hatton after Mayweather. He just wasn't himself anymore, mentally or physically and his chances were hurt even more by working with a trainer who didn't suit him and going down even further in weight when he had already struggled to make 147 against Floyd. Like Floyd said. You can't just keep going up in weight and coming down over and over again and expect everything to be okay. It's wear and tear on the body and it catches up to everybody sooner or later.
                    Last edited by JK1700; 04-15-2012, 12:03 PM.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by wmute View Post
                      Castillo was past it no doubt, but how exactly could he have the perfect style for Hatton? Hatton likes to go on top of ppl maul them and wrestle them, and JLC was the best inside fighter below of the lower weights.
                      Lots of people right here were picking Castillo to beat Hatton in that fight. People's memories can be very convenient. They also forgot all the people who picked Tyson to KO Lewis.

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