Joe Frazier delivers hellacious beating to Ali.

[Toney616]

What other fighter in history could have handled Ali the way Frazier man handled him?

Ken Norton gave Ali a beating in their first fight and hardly took much punishment in return. Frazier was never the same after the Ali fight

[GF of Boxing]

I have all three of those fights. And yes both fighters put a hurting on each other. Joe Frazier is one of my favorite fighters but please look at all three fights and look at the all the score cards on how the referees judge it, it was close. In the total of three fights Ali won 22 round Frazier won 17 and 2 even. And please look at both fighters after all there fights. There was damage done on both sides.

[StarshipTrooper]

I've talked to professional fighters about this and almost all of them of them said it's mental.

Primarily in regards to body punches where you resistance is largely determined by your pain threshold. If you can stand the pain you can take the body shots.....if you can't you wind up like De La Hoya against B-Hop.

Poet

[joseph5620]

I dont agree with this. physically there are things that make you more durable...like neck and leg endurance...and also there is a certain amount of skill to taking punches, such as turning your head with the punch, bracing yourself for the punch, and always knowing when a punch is going to land("the punch you dont see coming hurts the most")also weight drain can very much affect your punch resistance, but of course that doesnt apply to Ali, being a HW at his natural weight.

Ali specifically went out of his way to get hit in sparring, so he could 'get used to it'.

it wont make you go from having a **** chin to a good chin, but you definitely can make yourself more punch resistant.

however, His 67' version very likely already had developed both of the above, and he was clearly prime pre-exile.

That's defense and it has nothing to do with the ability to withstand a punch when it lands. Either you can take the punch or you can't. If a fighter has a weak chin none of the things you mentioned will matter.


I've talked to professional fighters about this and almost all of them of them said it's mental.

[Steak]

That's defense and it has nothing to do with the ability to withstand a punch when it lands. Either you can take the punch or you can't. If a fighter has a weak chin none of the things you mentioned will matter.


I've talked to professional fighters about this and almost all of them of them said it's mental.

mental=skill.

personally I wouldnt consider it defense any more if youre actualyl getting hit with the punch, since defense is about defending against punches in the first place, but I dont want to get hung up on definitions.

and if none of them mattered, then why do boxers go out of their way to work on them? why do they work out their necks and allow themselves to get hit with punches to get used to them?

[joseph5620]

[QUOTE=blackirish137;10213846]mental=skill.

personally I wouldnt consider it defense any more if youre actualyl getting hit with the punch, since defense is about defending against punches in the first place, but I dont want to get hung up on definitions.

and if none of them mattered, then why do boxers go out of their way to work on them? why do they work out their necks and allow themselves to get hit with punches to get used to them?[/QUOTE]







I understand what you're sayin and you make a good point. But my point is either you have a good chin or you don't. You can't create or develope a "good chin" IMO. I'm sure fighters like Terry Norris did all of those things but it didn't save him from getting knocked out.

[Steak]

I understand what you're sayin and you make a good point. But my point is either you have a good chin or you don't. You can't create or develope a "good chin" IMO. I'm sure fighters like Terry Norris did all of those things but it didn't save him from getting knocked out.

I dont agree with this. physically there are things that make you more durable...like neck and leg endurance...and also there is a certain amount of skill to taking punches, such as turning your head with the punch, bracing yourself for the punch, and always knowing when a punch is going to land("the punch you dont see coming hurts the most")
also weight drain can very much affect your punch resistance, but of course that doesnt apply to Ali, being a HW at his natural weight.

Ali specifically went out of his way to get hit in sparring, so he could 'get used to it'.

it wont make you go from having a **** chin to a good chin, but you definitely can make yourself more punch resistant.

however, His 67' version very likely already had developed both of the above, and he was clearly prime pre-exile.

so basically we agree.

[CarlosG815]

[QUOTE=joseph5620;10213957]

mental=skill.

personally I wouldnt consider it defense any more if youre actualyl getting hit with the punch, since defense is about defending against punches in the first place, but I dont want to get hung up on definitions.

and if none of them mattered, then why do boxers go out of their way to work on them? why do they work out their necks and allow themselves to get hit with punches to get used to them?[/QUOTE]







I understand what you're sayin and you make a good point. But my point is either you have a good chin or you don't. You can't create or develope a "good chin" IMO. I'm sure fighters like Terry Norris did all of those things but it didn't save him from getting knocked out.

Would you agree that Amir Khan's chin was strengthened after moving up? His chin was blamed on struggling to make 135, yet he took some nasty shots since moving to 140, and was getting hammered by Maidana yet did not go down like he did against Prescott.

Thoughts?

[Steak]

Would you agree that Amir Khan's chin was strengthened after moving up? His chin was blamed on struggling to make 135, yet he took some nasty shots since moving to 140, and was getting hammered by Maidana yet did not go down like he did against Prescott.

Thoughts?

definitely.

maybe it was the weight loss, maybe it was conditioning, maybe it was because he was unused to taking punches...likely all the above.

but his ability to take a punch has improved.
it will always be a weakness though.

once upon a time DLHs chin was looked at as shaky too, and now people consider him to have one of the best chins of the last few years.

[joseph5620]

[QUOTE=CarlosG815;10214174]

Would you agree that Amir Khan's chin was strengthened after moving up? His chin was blamed on struggling to make 135, yet he took some nasty shots since moving to 140, and was getting hammered by Maidana yet did not go down like he did against Prescott.

Thoughts?

If he was struggling to make weight then yes I agree it would weaken him. But not just his chin. He would be weakened in general and I'm sure he feels stronger since moving up.