P4P Who Was The Better Puncher Razor Ruddock or Ali

[Die Antwoord]

Taking into account all aspects of punching. Accuracy, ability to throw combos, using angles, timing, different punches, power, speed etc...

I have been told by poet that all of those things were factored into this list. That doesnt rank Ali, but ranks Razor Ruddock.

In 2003, the writers of Ring Magazine published a ranking of the 100 greatest punchers of all-time. Not unlike an all-time pound-for-pound ranking, this list compares fighters across different weight categories and different eras. As such, it's entirely open for debate ...

1. Joe Louis
2. Sam Langford
3. Jimmy Wilde
4. Archie Moore
5. Sandy Saddler
6. Stanley Ketchell
7. Jack Dempsey
8. Bob Fitzsimmons
9. George Foreman
10. Earnie Shavers
11. Sugar Ray Robinson
12. Ruben Olivares
13. Wilfredo Gomez
14. Rocky Marciano
15. Sonny Liston
16. Mike Tyson
17. Bob Foster
18. Thomas Hearns
19. Khaosai Galaxy
20. Alexis Arguello
21. Carlos Zarate
22. Max Baer
23. Rocky Graziano
24. Matthew Saad Muhammad
25. Julian Jackson
26. Danny Lopez
27. Gerald McClellan
28. Roberto Duran
29. Rodrigo Valdez
30. Felix Trinidad
31. Pipino Cuevas
32. Jim Jefferies
33. Lennox Lewis
34. Bennie Briscoe
35. Marvin Hagler
36. Edwin Rosario
37. Tommy Ryan
38. John Mugabi
39. Joe Frazier
40. Carlos Monzon
41. Tony Zale
42. Michael Spinks
43. Joe Gans
44. Elmer Ray
45. George Godfrey
46. Naseem Hamed
47. Alfonso Zamora
48. David Tua
49. Cleveland Williams
50. Julio Cesar Chavez
51. Tiger Jack Fox
52. Joe Walcott
53. Gerry Cooney
54. Al (Bummy) Davis
55. Max Schmeling
56. Florentino Fernandez
57. Henry Armstrong
58. Bob Satterfield
59. Al Hostak
60. Jesus Pimentel
61. Eugene (Cyclone) Hart
62. Lew Jenkins
63. Harry Wills
64. Tom Sharkey
65. Terry McGovern
66. Jersey Joe Walcott
67. Kostya Tszyu
68. Leotis Martin
69. Buddy Baer
70. Donovan (Razor) Ruddock
71. Jose Luis Ramirez
72. Tommy Gomez
73. Jose Napoles
74. Kid McCoy
75. Antonio Esparragoza
76. Ricardo Moreno
77. Evander Holyfield
78. Ike Williams
79. Luis Firpo
80. Ricardo Lopez
81. Humberto Gonzalez
82. Bobby Chacon
83. Jock McAvoy
84. Eduardo Lausse
85. Eder Jofre
86. Charley Burley
87. Mike McCallum
88. Salvador Sanchez
89. Roy Jones Jr.
90. Rodolfo Gonzalez
91. Nigel Benn
92. (Irish) Bob Murphy
93. Paul Berlenbach
94. Battling Torres
95. Chalky Wright
96. George (K.O.) Chaney
97. Andy Ganigan
98. Fred Fulton
99. Ingemar Johansson
100. Charley White


So who you got. Donovan Razor Ruddock or Muhammad Ali as the better puncher. I assume this list also means prime as RJJ is on it and he couldnt knock out my grandma right now. OH and remember its p4p, so Ruddock weighed abotu 20 lbs heavier prime against prime.

[Die Antwoord]

oh and by the way, im going with Ali. That list is abotu power, and poet's argument is absurd and idiotic. Ali is by far the better all around puncher.

[NChristo]

Ali by far, the only thing Ruddock has over him is power.

As for the list I'd change a lot of the names around, for starts Charley Burley, Ike Williams, Ricardo Lopez, Roy Jones Jr and a few other names need to be much higher.

[SBleeder]

oh and by the way, im going with Ali. That list is abotu power, and poet's argument is absurd and idiotic. Ali is by far the better all around puncher.

Sorry, one random post pretending to give credit to Ali is insufficient to convince me that you're not MagicMan or Wlad Klitschko.

[Toney616]

Ali by far, the only thing Ruddock has over him is power.

I agree with this. Also the only punches that Ruddock ever threw with any conviction was the left hook and left uppercut.

[StarshipTrooper]

Ali by far, the only thing Ruddock has over him is power.

As for the list I'd change a lot of the names around, for starts Charley Burley, Ike Williams, Ricardo Lopez, Roy Jones Jr and a few other names need to be much higher.

The problem is that good 'Ol MagicM.....I mean Die hasn't actually read the this particular issue of Ring where they make it QUITE clear that power was only one of a number of factors used to determine the greatest puncher ratings. That's why there are a number of fighters who made the list who didn't have one-punch power even in a p4p sense. Yet Die keeps insisting that the fighters on the list are being rated on their power and not other factors as well.

The backstory here is that Die cited an article in another thread that porported to be a rating of the hardest Heavyweight punchers but, when you get into the meat of the article, it becomes pretty clear that other factors are being used to determine the rankings as well, not simply who punched harder. The article would be more appropriately titled "The Greaterst Heavyweight Punchers" instead of "The Hardest Heavyweight Punchers". I gave The Ring's list of greatest punchers as an example of ranking "greatest punchers" as opposed to mearly "hardest punchers".

PS. For the record Ali has never been considered a puncher by any means so it shouldn't be overly shocking he didn't make the list.

Poet

[NChristo]

The problem is that good 'Ol MagicM.....I mean Die hasn't actually read the this particular issue of Ring where they make it QUITE clear that power was only one of a number of factors used to determine the greatest puncher ratings. That's why there are a number of fighters who made the list who didn't have one-punch power even in a p4p sense. Yet Die keeps insisting that the fighters on the list are being rated on their power and not other factors as well.

The backstory here is that Die cited an article in another thread that porported to be a rating of the hardest Heavyweight punchers but, when you get into the meat of the article, it becomes pretty clear that other factors are being used to determine the rankings as well, not simply who punched harder. The article would be more appropriately titled "The Greaterst Heavyweight Punchers" instead of "The Hardest Heavyweight Punchers". I gave The Ring's list of greatest punchers as an example of ranking "greatest punchers" as opposed to mearly "hardest punchers".

Poet

Ah k, thanks for clearing that up, was wondering wtf this was about lol.

PS. For the record Ali has never been considered a puncher by any means so it shouldn't be overly shocking he didn't make the list.

I know Ali shouldn't be classed as a puncher but Die said

Taking into account all aspects of punching. Accuracy, ability to throw combos, using angles, timing, different punches, power, speed etc...

Then it is clear that Ali takes it and he isn't judging by who is the better puncher just who threw the better punches, better combos etc.
Thread title was misleading I suppose.

[StarshipTrooper]

Ah k, thanks for clearing that up, was wondering wtf this was about lol.

I know Ali shouldn't be classed as a puncher but Die said

Then it is clear that Ali takes it and he isn't judging by who is the better puncher just who threw the better punches, better combos etc.
Thread title was misleading I suppose.

Unfortunately there are always going to be some people who require having things "**** N' Janed" in order for them to understand it. While I would agree that using the same criteria they used to determine their rankings Ali would surely be ranked higher than a number of those listed even in a p4p sense, I also understand their reasoning in leaving off Ali and other non-punchers.

Poet

[Die Antwoord]

Unfortunately there are always going to be some people who require having things "**** N' Janed" in order for them to understand it. While I would agree that using the same criteria they used to determine their rankings Ali would surely be ranked higher than a number of those listed even in a p4p sense, I also understand their reasoning in leaving off Ali and other non-punchers.

Poet

YOu dont make any sense. So Ali wasnt a puncher? What the hell did he knock Liston and Foreman out with? His head? Ali wasnt a puncher? The list was based solely on power, i found the article in my collection, cite otherwise you lying piece of ****.

[mrboxer]

taking into account all aspects of punching,razor is not even close to ali,comparing razor to ali is like comparing apples and oranges,if ali fought razor,razor would be razzled from the get go,and be knockout cold within 1 round