Joe Frazier ducked who?

[r.burgundy]

Thje point is if you aren't a mandatory and can't force a fight, you can't be ducked. There was no obligation on Fraziers part to make a fight with Lyle when he could fight better fighters. The ONLY fighter from that era that I know of who fought everyone is Ali. why are you not making a stink about Foreman not fighting Quarry or Shavers? Thats right, because it destroys your agenda and proves what Im saying is correct.

what the hell are you talking about lmao???have you not seen the thread title?its called JOE FRAZIER DUCKED not george forman ducked

[JAB5239]

I think we'll stick to this thread rather than continue to bump what is now an old replica of this thread.

Whatever floats your boat.

frazier's style not being "conducive to a long career" has nothing to do with him fighting just twice a year for virtually his entire career as a top heavyweight.He'd take long breaks no matter how long or gruelling a fight was.

And so did many, many other great champions in history. do you deny this?

Are Joe bugner and a faded Jimmy Ellis really better than Ron Lyle?

As I've already stated, Ellis was better preparation for Ali than Lyle could ever be. Bugner was also a top 10 fighter at the time if Im not mistaken, so why not give Frazier his due credit there?

It's easy to argue that Ali and foreman were better than Lyle,but that doesn't change the fact that Lyle was consistently ranked within the top ten and was a dangerous contender who was deemed qualified enough to fight Quarry,Ali and foreman.

I've never argued anything different. But if you can't force a fight by getting into a mandatory position and Frazier is beating the better fighter who beat him, it simply can't be ducking. 99% of all fighters in history have missed fights against other top fighters in their era's, Should we label them all "duckers"?

I don't understand your last question.Who are you talking about,what top ten and what does "op" mean?

what fighter in history, win or lose, fought more fights against all time top 10 heavyweights than Frazier?

I never said foreman was a "nobody".I have criticized foreman for having a padded record and doing as much cherry picking as frazier did.It still doesn't change the fact that foreman is a greater heavyweight than frazier is.

Foreman is greater than Frazier, so what? Does this mean we should just turn a blind eye all his faults as a fighter, to all the faults of ANY other fighters just to put down Frazier? Just admit it my man, you're biased and it clouds your judgment of Frazier.

Jerry Quarry has a better resume than frazier has.I suppose you don't rate him above frazier,do you?

Quarry above Frazier?

Ducking what? Did I not acknowledge foreman's cherry picking and avoiding of others? I've criticized him as much as I have frazier.

No you haven't. You make it a point to admonish what you perceive to be Fraziers faults at EVERY mere mention of his name. Bit of a difference there son.

[JAB5239]

what the hell are you talking about lmao???have you not seen the thread title?its called JOE FRAZIER DUCKED not george forman ducked

You didn't answer the post, you ducked it. It's relevant to the topic at hand.

[r.burgundy]

You didn't answer the post, you ducked it. It's relevant to the topic at hand.

im assuming your simple ass argument is frazier beat quarry who beat lyle,so by your logic he didnt need to fight lyle.so by your logic ellis was more deserving to fight joe than lyle even though lyle had already beat ellis?

give it up man.this is a serious roasting.better get poet to come to the rescue

[JAB5239]

im assuming your simple ass argument is frazier beat quarry who beat lyle,so by your logic he didnt need to fight lyle.so by your logic ellis was more deserving to fight joe than lyle even though lyle had already beat ellis?

give it up man.this is a serious roasting.better get poet to come to the rescue

Thje point is if you aren't a mandatory and can't force a fight, you can't be ducked. There was no obligation on Fraziers part to make a fight with Lyle when he could fight better fighters. The ONLY fighter from that era that I know of who fought everyone is Ali. why are you not making a stink about Foreman not fighting Quarry or Shavers? Thats right, because it destroys your agenda and proves what Im saying is correct.

It seems you're having a problem responding to this post so I took the liberty of reprinting it for you. Let me give you a couple of examples of a fighter "ducking" another. Purposely avoiding when there is clearly no better fighter to fight. Rid**** Bowe purposely trashing his belt to avoid #1 contender Lennox Lewis. Do you see ANY similarities in the two instances? Jack Dempsey purposely avoiding #1 contender Harry Wills for 7 years in order to take on lesser fighters or tour Broadway. Do you see and similarities in these instances?

This is a serious roasting, huh? The same kind of roasting you gave me when you said plenty of people see things your way about Harry Greb? I can pull that poll up and the one from ESB to see who got roasted there if you'd like?

[prinzemanspopa]

And so did many, many other great champions in history. do you deny this?

If they're rated in the same regard that frazier is then they deserve the same criticism that frazier deserves.

As I've already stated, Ellis was better preparation for Ali than Lyle could ever be. Bugner was also a top 10 fighter at the time if Im not mistaken, so why not give Frazier his due credit there?

And as I've already stated,frazier needed no such preparation for a guy he had already fought twenty seven rounds with.


Lyle too was a top 10 fighter.It's not "who" frazier did fight that is the issue,it's who frazier "didn't" fight.

99% of all fighters in history have missed fights against other top fighters in their era's, Should we label them all "duckers"?

frazier avoided 99% of the punchers of his era.That many fights that were not made,many of whom managed to land fights with other elite heavyweights with that era is no coincidence.

what fighter in history, win or lose, fought more fights against all time top 10 heavyweights than Frazier?

That depends on who you rate in your top ten.If you rate Liston,foreman,Holmes and frazier in your top ten, then Ali is an obvious pick.

Quarry above Frazier?

Overall he does have a better resume.His resume counts as wins and losses and in regards to who he fought,he fought more top heavyweights than frazier did.

The only other heavyweight from that era who fought more top heavyweights was Ali

No you haven't. You make it a point to admonish what you perceive to be Fraziers faults at EVERY mere mention of his name. Bit of a difference there son.

Actually,I have.I've never credited foreman for consistently fighting the best.He was a cherry picker at his peak and in his comeback.

[Dynamite76]

I not going to say that Frazier ducked Lyle, Young, or Shavers, but it would have been nice to see him fight those guys instead of those two pre-Foreman defenses he did.

[JAB5239]

Thje point is if you aren't a mandatory and can't force a fight, you can't be ducked. There was no obligation on Fraziers part to make a fight with Lyle when he could fight better fighters. The ONLY fighter from that era that I know of who fought everyone is Ali. why are you not making a stink about Foreman not fighting Quarry or Shavers? Thats right, because it destroys your agenda and proves what Im saying is correct.

It seems you're having a problem responding to this post so I took the liberty of reprinting it for you. Let me give you a couple of examples of a fighter "ducking" another. Purposely avoiding when there is clearly no better fighter to fight. Rid**** Bowe purposely trashing his belt to avoid #1 contender Lennox Lewis. Do you see ANY similarities in the two instances? Jack Dempsey purposely avoiding #1 contender Harry Wills for 7 years in order to take on lesser fighters or tour Broadway. Do you see and similarities in these instances?

This is a serious roasting, huh? The same kind of roasting you gave me when you said plenty of people see things your way about Harry Greb? I can pull that poll up and the one from ESB to see who got roasted there if you'd like?

And r.burgundy con****uously avoids this post again.....lol...figures.

[JAB5239]

If they're rated in the same regard that frazier is then they deserve the same criticism that frazier deserves.

P4p I can show many of these fighters, yet you only show this disdain for Frazier and a few others. I don't particularly like you, but I don't consider you completely totally ignorant either. That is why you are considered a bias troll. You want things to agree with your every perception and are unwilling to listen to anyone elses's points no matter how valid they might be.

And as I've already stated,frazier needed no such preparation for a guy he had already fought twenty seven rounds with.

We're talking arguably the greatest heavyweight ever. What exactly could Lyle have brought to the table to make Frazier a better fighter against Ali?

Lyle too was a top 10 fighter.It's not "who" frazier did fight that is the issue,it's who frazier "didn't" fight.

And again I ask you, why not the same disdain for so many other fighters who took the same route? You claim a "duck", but a "duck" should only be applied when a fight is unavoidable. Bottom line is Joe fought better fighters. Would it have been nice to see him fight Lyle? Of course. But that does not imply a "duck". If it does you should be ridiculing many fighters through out history, but you don't. You "cherry pick" Frazier band a few others.

frazier avoided 99% of the punchers of his era.That many fights that were not made,many of whom managed to land fights with other elite heavyweights with that era is no coincidence.

This is a biased assumption that holds no water if you look at the big picture. You're focusing on one man and giving him no credit for the fights he did have. EVERYTHING you claim is easily debunked, but more than that you avoid the time line and expect a fighter to do what you think is right, with no knowledge of how things really work.

That depends on who you rate in your top ten.If you rate Liston,foreman,Holmes and frazier in your top ten, then Ali is an obvious pick.

Besides Ali, what other fighter besides Frazier fought more fights against all time top 10 opposition?

Overall he does have a better resume.His resume counts as wins and losses and in regards to who he fought,he fought more top heavyweights than frazier did.

I disagree. Not only that, but you have to consider the better wins, no?

The only other heavyweight from that era who fought more top heavyweights was Ali

Besides Ali who beat more top fighters? I know you don't think Quarry has a better resume of quality wins than Frazier, do you?

Actually,I have.I've never credited foreman for consistently fighting the best.He was a cherry picker at his peak and in his comeback.

Fine. But we can still go through history and find dozens of others. Why the hate for one man when we can show so many others who have travelled the same path?

[r.burgundy]

And r.burgundy con****uously avoids this post again.....lol...figures.

Thje point is if you aren't a mandatory and can't force a fight, you can't be ducked. There was no obligation on Fraziers part to make a fight with Lyle when he could fight better fighters. The ONLY fighter from that era that I know of who fought everyone is Ali. why are you not making a stink about Foreman not fighting Quarry or Shavers? Thats right, because it destroys your agenda and proves what Im saying is correct.

It seems you're having a problem responding to this post so I took the liberty of reprinting it for you. Let me give you a couple of examples of a fighter "ducking" another. Purposely avoiding when there is clearly no better fighter to fight. Rid**** Bowe purposely trashing his belt to avoid #1 contender Lennox Lewis. Do you see ANY similarities in the two instances? Jack Dempsey purposely avoiding #1 contender Harry Wills for 7 years in order to take on lesser fighters or tour Broadway. Do you see and similarities in these instances?

This is a serious roasting, huh? The same kind of roasting you gave me when you said plenty of people see things your way about Harry Greb? I can pull that poll up and the one from ESB to see who got roasted there if you'd like?

lmao who in the hell needs to avoid 1 of your posts

i actually do log off

so let me get this strait,the only way you can duck somebody is if they are a mandatory?lmao.i didnt think that foolishness needed a response.why dont you make a poll asking who agrees with that

havent you said floyd ducked cotto,rito and others???

what poll on harry greb?i said make a poll on gene tunney,put it in nsb and see how many think tunney is a quality fighter.your reply was"they dont know about boxing history in nsb",as if you have to know about history to recognize a good fighter.

so lets look at your ******ity in this thread.
you compared jimmy ellis 12rnd slip that was ruled a knockdown to ron lyles vs foreman.
you said a knockdown is a knockdown regardless of circumstance
you said that ron lyle didnt have power
a fighter can only duck another if its a mandatory
your asking why were not commenting on foreman not fighting shavers or quarry despite this thread being about joe frazier

if you want this roasting to continue,all you have to do is keep replying,as all yoiur posts have plenty ammo