Muhammad Ali vs. George Foreman - the importance of fetching the ring

[frankenfrank]

The ropes were loose because they fought in a 16 foot ring!

Normally championship fights are in 20-24 foot rings.The ropes were loose because they were using the ropes for a 20 foot ring.Foreman has many times made excuses for losing that fight including saying that the ropes were loose.

On one hand Foreman says the ropes were to loose,and that's why he got beat.But he fails to mention the ropes were loose because he got his 16 foot ring from Don King.

Ali could have still layed on the ropes and beat Foreman if the ropes were tight.But if he had a 20-24 foot ring(Like he should have)he could have fought Foreman using more movement,and stopped him when George got tired fighting him that way.

Either way,Ali would have beat big George.

Interesting idea

But what about the combination of smaller ring with tight ropes ?
The thing Foreman meant.
Ring's ropes are supposed to fit the ring , it is not an excuse at all that the ropes were loose because of the ring's size.
Also , I read that Dundee actually blamed the damned heat in the loosening of the ropes ..

[boxing boy]

Interesting idea

But what about the combination of smaller ring with tight ropes ?
The thing Foreman meant.
Ring's ropes are supposed to fit the ring , it is not an excuse at all that the ropes were loose because of the ring's size.
Also , I read that Dundee actually blamed the damned heat in the loosening of the ropes ..

Smaller ring with tight ropes? Please,Forman got his 16 foot ring(That never happens in championship fights)so Ali could not dance.Now you want a 16 foot ring with tight ropes? Why not give George a 12 foot ring with tight ropes for crying out loud.

Foreman WAS making excuses about the ropes being loose.It was up to him and his corner(Saddler & Archie Moore) to make sure he got ropes for a 16 foot ring.Plus the ring canvas was padded to make it hard to move and dance.Foreman got that also!!

Foreman also used the heat as an excuse to why he lost the fight.But Ali said:It wasn't the Africa weather,it was the Ali leather.

Foreman also made excuses that he was the victim of a fast count.But i timed it and he was down 12 seconds!

[TheDreamer]

Even if the ropes were tighter, Ali would've still won.

During sparring for the fight, Ali trained himself to take a lot of body punches. And he did take a lot of body punches. So the loose ropes didn't really help him with that too much.

What it did help him with was avoiding head punches more easily. Even then, Ali had great head movement and I'm sure he would've still made Foreman miss a lot.

I see the same result happening, with Ali allowing Foreman to tire himself out and then going for the knockout.

[frankenfrank]

Smaller ring with tight ropes? Please,Forman got his 16 foot ring(That never happens in championship fights)so Ali could not dance.Now you want a 16 foot ring with tight ropes?

Yes , ring's ropes are supposed to be tight regardless of the ring's size.

Why not give George a 12 foot ring with tight ropes for crying out loud.

Foreman WAS making excuses about the ropes being loose.It was up to him and his corner(Saddler & Archie Moore) to make sure he got ropes for a 16 foot ring.Plus the ring canvas was padded to make it hard to move and dance.Foreman got that also!!

Foreman also used the heat as an excuse to why he lost the fight.But Ali said:It wasn't the Africa weather,it was the Ali leather.

Foreman also made excuses that he was the victim of a fast count.But i timed it and he was down 12 seconds!

I blame nothing else but the ropes being loose and it was a critical factor in the fight , fact.

The heat works for both directions , just for the ones making excuses for Robinson against Maxim.
And it was not Ali's leather as it was obvious Foreman was down from exhaustion and not from Ali's super heavy punches.

[frankenfrank]

Even if the ropes were tighter, Ali would've still won.

During sparring for the fight, Ali trained himself to take a lot of body punches. And he did take a lot of body punches. So the loose ropes didn't really help him with that too much.

What it did help him with was avoiding head punches more easily. Even then, Ali had great head movement and I'm sure he would've still made Foreman miss a lot.

I see the same result happening, with Ali allowing Foreman to tire himself out and then going for the knockout.

Again , see the posts before you , I already explained that tighter ropes mean harder punches as Ali's body would have to absorb a larger amount of the energy of Foreman's punches.
This is physic's energy conservation law.
less movement (as the ropes restrict it) => bigger heat (in the form of bigger damage to Ali's body)

M1V1^2 + heat1 = M1V2^2 + heat2
M1 is Ali's mass
in the left you got the case of tight ropes : V1 < V2 => heat1>heat2
in the right the case of loose ropes : V2>V1 => heat2
heat here does not mean the outer temperature it means the energy released by each punch's land.

[frankenfrank]

And to everyone : stop assuming that Ali's ability to take the punches he took in the fight is an evidence of his ability to take harder punches/the same punches harder.
It is really ******.

[NChristo]

And to everyone : stop assuming that Ali's ability to take the punches he took in the fight is an evidence of his ability to take harder punches/the same punches harder.
It is really ******.

I have already said that it was dependent on if Ali could take the extra amount of pain and survive a possible KD on if the outcome would be the same or not.

He would never fight again if the ropes were tight, he took enough damage as it was with loose ropes.

Edit: Not going to vote, not really sure how it would go.

[TheDreamer]

Again , see the posts before you , I already explained that tighter ropes mean harder punches as Ali's body would have to absorb a larger amount of the energy of Foreman's punches.
This is physic's energy conservation law.
less movement (as the ropes restrict it) => bigger heat (in the form of bigger damage to Ali's body)

M1V1^2 + heat1 = M1V2^2 + heat2
M1 is Ali's mass
in the left you got the case of tight ropes : V1 < V2 => heat1>heat2
in the right the case of loose ropes : V2>V1 => heat2
heat here does not mean the outer temperature it means the energy released by each punch's land.

I think you're over-exaggerating the body punches/ropes thing. Ali was basically taking his body punches while not leaning back on the ropes too much. He may have had his back to them, but he wasn't leaning that far back.

[boxing boy]

Yes , ring's ropes are supposed to be tight regardless of the ring's size.



I blame nothing else but the ropes being loose and it was a critical factor in the fight , fact.

The heat works for both directions , just for the ones making excuses for Robinson against Maxim.
And it was not Ali's leather as it was obvious Foreman was down from exhaustion and not from Ali's super heavy punches.

Muhammad Ali was just kidding when he said:It wasn't the African weather,it was the Ali leahter.He was just kidding around and made it ryme.He said this when hearing about George saying it was the heat that beat him.

I have to diagree with you about the ring ropes having to be tight.The ring is suppossed to be either 20 or 24 feet for a championship fight.But Foreman gets a 16 foot ring!! Plus the ring canvas was really padded to make the ring slow,and very hard to move or dance.That's now two BIG advantages for George Foreman!! And your complaining about one advantage that Ali got with the ropes being loose?

So lets start over.....The fight is in a 20-24 foot ring,like it is suppossed to be.Now lets talk about how the fight would have went? With no advantages going either way.Muhammad Ali trained to dance and dance more.He had just danced 12 rounds against Joe Frazier in his previous fight,and was in better shape to dance for the Foreman fight. Oh,I forgot....The ring canvas would not be heavily padded either.

In the first round Muhammad Ali danced against George Foreman,and won the round even in a 16 foot ring,with the ring canvas heavily padded.He landed alot of hard clean punches,mainly his right hand lead.He was also landing combinations,and scoring with his left jab.Foreman managed to land only a couple of body punches.

It was after the 1st round that Muhammad Ali changed his mind to stop dancing.He said George was cutting off the ring real good,since it was a 16 foot ring with a heavily padded canvas.He said George was making him take 4 steps to every step that he took.Muhammad Ali said he knew after the 1st round that he could not keep up the moving and dancing because he would be the one who would get tired first,taking 4 steps to every step that Foreman was taking.

But watching Ali moving and dancing in the 1st round,and his hand speed enabling him to beat Foreman to the punch again and again,I can only imagine what Ali would have been able to do if it was a 20-24 foot ring.That is the issue,the size of the ring.Foreman should not have been able to get a 16 foot ring!! With a heavily padded canvas! Something really smells,especially with Don King involved.With a 20-24 foot ring Muhammad Ali would have been able to make Foreman look slow,clumbsy,and tottally outclassed on his way to a late round(10-13) KO or a clear UD.

[boxing boy]

And to everyone : stop assuming that Ali's ability to take the punches he took in the fight is an evidence of his ability to take harder punches/the same punches harder.
It is really ******.

It's pure speculation to say how the fight would have went with the ropes tighter.

But here are some FACTS about the real fight.......

1-Muhammad Ali was not hurt the entire fight,not once.

2-Muhammad Ali was FIGHTING off the ropes.And landing good clean hard punches.He hardly never just layed on the ropes(Save the 5th round)but was fighting off the ropes,and rather well.

3-Muhammad Ali took harder punches from Ernie Shavers.Shavers was landing his big hard right hand again and again.They were good hard clean punches,and Ali never went down.