Could Muhammad Ali beat Joe Louis after his 3 1/2 year lay-off?

[JAB5239]

Typical response from you when your pinned in to the corner with facts.

Remember,your the one who deviated from the thread first.I just responded to your ill fated attempt to wiggle out of the corner.

There is no corner for me to wiggle out of. You simply underestimate Louis and overestimate a post ban Ali because you lack knowledge and objectivity. The only thing you have left now is trolling in hopes that I will keep responding to you.

[boxingbuff]

There is no corner for me to wiggle out of. You simply underestimate Louis and overestimate a post ban Ali because you lack knowledge and objectivity. The only thing you have left now is trolling in hopes that I will keep responding to you.

There are more people responding to this thread who believe Muhammad Ali would beat Joe Louis even after his 3 1/2 year lay-off.Is everyone underestimating Louis and overestimating Ali? It is you who is trolling and lacks knowledge and objectivity my friend.

Joe Louis would have to KO Muhammad Ali to win.Do you agree with this? Muhammad Ali took the best punch of all the heavyweight champions.Do you agree with that? Just answer me yes or no?

[JAB5239]

There are more people responding to this thread who believe Muhammad Ali would beat Joe Louis even after his 3 1/2 year lay-off.Is everyone underestimating Louis and overestimating Ali? It is you who is trolling and lacks knowledge and objectivity my friend.

Joe Louis would have to KO Muhammad Ali to win.Do you agree with this? Muhammad Ali took the best punch of all the heavyweight champions.Do you agree with that? Just answer me yes or no?

No I do not agree with that. Kenny Norton beat him without ko'ing him so I have no doubt Louis could do it to. Unlike you I don't just look at things won way and say only one fighter would win. I understand their are different circumstances and scenarios that should be looked at. You giving Louis no chance under any of these scenarios or different circumstances only proves you don't know what you're talking about and have a biased agenda. Now I answered your question, Your turn to answer mine. Was Louis a better fighter than Norton? Just answer me yes or no?

[boxingbuff]

No I do not agree with that. Kenny Norton beat him without ko'ing him so I have no doubt Louis could do it to. Unlike you I don't just look at things won way and say only one fighter would win. I understand their are different circumstances and scenarios that should be looked at. You giving Louis no chance under any of these scenarios or different circumstances only proves you don't know what you're talking about and have a biased agenda. Now I answered your question, Your turn to answer mine. Was Louis a better fighter than Norton? Just answer me yes or no?

Your not reading my posts again.I already said that Joe Louis is a better fighter than Ken Norton.Slow down and read my posts.You believe Joe Louis could beat Muhammad Ali on a decision? I don't really think you believe that,and few posters on here believe that. STYLES make fights my friend.Ken Norton fought Muhammad Ali better than George Forman did.Better than Sonny Liston did.Even better than Joe Frazier did.It's like Tommy Farr and Arturo Godoy fighting Joe Louis even.The difference is that was a PRIME Louis,where Ali was 6 and 9 years past his PRIME when he fought Ken Norton.Your the one who doesn't know what there talking about my friend.And most of the other posters agree with me.Your the one who has a biased agenda mate. I will ask you again,was Muhammad Ali 6 and 9 years past his prime of 1966/67 when he fought Ken Norton? Was Joe Louis in his PRIME when he fought Farr and Godoy?

[FunkyFresh]

Yes, he would.

Ali was simply in a class of his own and even a prime Louis couldn't beat a past-prime version of Ali.

[JAB5239]

Your not reading my posts again.I already said that Joe Louis is a better fighter than Ken Norton.Slow down and read my posts.You believe Joe Louis could beat Muhammad Ali on a decision? I don't really think you believe that,and few posters on here believe that. STYLES make fights my friend.Ken Norton fought Muhammad Ali better than George Forman did.Better than Sonny Liston did.Even better than Joe Frazier did.It's like Tommy Farr and Arturo Godoy fighting Joe Louis even.The difference is that was a PRIME Louis,where Ali was 6 and 9 years past his PRIME when he fought Ken Norton.Your the one who doesn't know what there talking about my friend.And most of the other posters agree with me.Your the one who has a biased agenda mate. I will ask you again,was Muhammad Ali 6 and 9 years past his prime of 1966/67 when he fought Ken Norton? Was Joe Louis in his PRIME when he fought Farr and Godoy?

Im on my way to work but will be back later. Before I go I will say that I find it highly amusing that you started this thread talking about an Ali that fought AFTER being out of the ring for 3 and a half years and know you're trying to turn this into a debate about a prime Ali. I would suggest you stick to the topic you originally raised. when you make a thread like this most people will base it on the best version of Louis versus Ali after his comeback. Ali never fought a fighter as good as the best version of Louis and lost to some who weren't even nearly as good. How could Louis not have a chance under your own scenario?

[boxingbuff]

Im on my way to work but will be back later. Before I go I will say that I find it highly amusing that you started this thread talking about an Ali that fought AFTER being out of the ring for 3 and a half years and know you're trying to turn this into a debate about a prime Ali. I would suggest you stick to the topic you originally raised. when you make a thread like this most people will base it on the best version of Louis versus Ali after his comeback. Ali never fought a fighter as good as the best version of Louis and lost to some who weren't even nearly as good. How could Louis not have a chance under your own scenario?

If you slow down and read my post I'm pointing out that Muhammad Ali was 6 and 9 years past his PRIME when he fought Ken Norton.I point out Norton fought him even,just like Farr and Godoy fought Louis even.I point out the only difference is Louis was in his PRIME.I'm not trying to turn this into a prime Ali thread.Just that he was far past his PRIME when fighting Norton.Your just mad and agitated that i present these facts.Your changing the subject again also.Your debating style is to try to put the other person on the defense,and ask several questions so the other person has to respond to them.If you slow down and read my posts you will see many FACTS backing up my beliefs.Since Muhammad Ali took the best punch of all the heavyweight champions,your now boxed back in to the corner of stating why Joe Louis can beat Muhammad Ali by decision.Which i bet 90% of boxing fans,writers,and experts disagree.So you bring up Ken Norton,which i have addressed again and again.

Of course we are talking PRIME Louis vs Muhammad Ali after his 3 1/2 year lay-off.And it's a FACT that this version of Muhammad Ali was still good enough to KO George Forman,and beat Smokin' Joe Frazier 2 out of 3.I believe it would still be hard for Louis to land many "clean" punches.He didn't put on nearly the pressure that Joe Frazier put on him.Louis didn't set the pace and put on enough pressure to beat Ali.He didn't have good enough head movement,like Frazier bobing and weaving.Ali would be able to hit Louis alot easier than Frazier.And Ali's good right hand could be big trouble for Louis.The same right hand that KO'd Foreman and hurt and stopped Frazier.Even if Louis cut the ring and got close to Ali,he would tie Joe up.And the few "clean" punches that Louis would land,would be against the best chin in heavyweight history.Even after his lay-off Ali's STYLE would be a nightmere for Joe.Joe Louis never punched unless BOTH of his feet were planted.You just got to keep him turning,keep him moving....And he could not plant both feet at the same time.

I will continue on my next post.So how would Joe Louis out point Muhammad Ali? Were all waiting to here your response,than just keep saying Ken Norton.Remember,were talking of Muhammad Ali from 1971-75,not a half shot fighter in 1976 and on.

[JAB5239]

If you slow down and read my post I'm pointing out that Muhammad Ali was 6 and 9 years past his PRIME when he fought Ken Norton.I point out Norton fought him even,just like Farr and Godoy fought Louis even.I point out the only difference is Louis was in his PRIME.I'm not trying to turn this into a prime Ali thread.Just that he was far past his PRIME when fighting Norton.Your just mad and agitated that i present these facts.Your changing the subject again also.Your debating style is to try to put the other person on the defense,and ask several questions so the other person has to respond to them.If you slow down and read my posts you will see many FACTS backing up my beliefs.Since Muhammad Ali took the best punch of all the heavyweight champions,your now boxed back in to the corner of stating why Joe Louis can beat Muhammad Ali by decision.Which i bet 90% of boxing fans,writers,and experts disagree.So you bring up Ken Norton,which i have addressed again and again.

Of course we are talking PRIME Louis vs Muhammad Ali after his 3 1/2 year lay-off.And it's a FACT that this version of Muhammad Ali was still good enough to KO George Forman,and beat Smokin' Joe Frazier 2 out of 3.I believe it would still be hard for Louis to land many "clean" punches.He didn't put on nearly the pressure that Joe Frazier put on him.Louis didn't set the pace and put on enough pressure to beat Ali.He didn't have good enough head movement,like Frazier bobing and weaving.Ali would be able to hit Louis alot easier than Frazier.And Ali's good right hand could be big trouble for Louis.The same right hand that KO'd Foreman and hurt and stopped Frazier.Even if Louis cut the ring and got close to Ali,he would tie Joe up.And the few "clean" punches that Louis would land,would be against the best chin in heavyweight history.Even after his lay-off Ali's STYLE would be a nightmere for Joe.Joe Louis never punched unless BOTH of his feet were planted.You just got to keep him turning,keep him moving....And he could not plant both feet at the same time.

I will continue on my next post.So how would Joe Louis out point Muhammad Ali? Were all waiting to here your response,than just keep saying Ken Norton.Remember,were talking of Muhammad Ali from 1971-75,not a half shot fighter in 1976 and on.

You keep writing these long winded posts but you avoid the fact the Norton wasn't nearly as good as Louis and caused Ali fits. If Norton could beat him, how can you suggest Louis couldn't? Watch this video and tell me in all honesty that Louis couldn't beat this Ali and I'll call you foolish. This isn't a dancing non stop movement Ali. He sits in front of Norton for more than enough time for Louis to capitalize. And when Ali was against the ropes Norton wasn't throwing the types of combination's Louis was capable of.







Come on, are you really going to stick with your story and say Louis couldn't beat THAT Ali?

[boxing boy]

I would like to talk about this fight.Lets talk like two adults.

Muhammad Ali left a big piece of himself in the ring in the Trilla in Manilla.

So I'm going to breakdown the fight with a 1971-75 Muhammad Ali.

I'm going to break down the fight,and then let others breakdown the fight.

I'm very buzy right now,but will be back tommorrow to break down the fight.

[boxing boy]

I'm going to try to break down this fight.

I believe Muhammad Ali would be able to counter over Joe Louis's left jab with his good right hand.The same right hand that KO'd George Forman.The same right hand that hurt Joe Frazier in all 3 fights. The same right hand that did in Jimmy Ellis,Ron Lyle,and many other fighters.I believe that Ali would be able to hurt and drop Joe Louis with that same right hand.This would be one of the big keys to this fight.

Jab vs jab? Muhammad Ali had the reach advantage.He also had the faster jab,and would be able to out jab Louis more often than not.

Muhammad Ali's fight plan would be to keep moving and dancing.Even after his 3 1/2 year lay-off he could still dance 12 rounds when he trained hard to dance.Like in the 2nd Norton and 2nd Joe Frazier fights.Joe Louis was slow on his feet.I'm not downing or demeaning Joe Louis.I'm just pointing out a weakness that Ali would try to take advantage of.Louis didn't put as much pressure on you as Joe Frazier did.I believe Joe would have trouble catching Ali,or cutting off the ring on him.When he did catch Ali on the ropes,Ali would lock him up,which he was very good at doing.

I don't see Joe Louis landing many "clean" punches.But when he did,remember Muhammad Ali could take the best punch of all the heavyweight champions.

Joe Louis was easier to hit than Joe Frazier,with his bobing and weaving style of fighting.This would be another big key in this fight.

Styles make fights.And Joe Louis's style would be easier than Ken Norton and Joe Frazier.Joe Louis never punched unless "both" feet were planted.So you need to keep him moving,keep him turning....So he couldn't plant "both" feet to punch.Muhammad Ali would be able to do this by moving and dancing,and giving him angles.

Muhammad Ali would use his left jab alot,and his good right hand to counter over Joe Louis's left jab.And keep his feet moving and turning.

I see Muhammad Ali winning a UD or on a late round TKO.

If anybody brings up Ken Norton,I will bring up Tommy Farr and Arturo Godoy.And i would say:C'mon,your telling me that Muhammad Ali could not beat that Joe Louis?

Anyway I look forward to someone else breaking down this fight.Not just saying because fighter A beat fighter B and fighter B beats fighter C,this means fighter A beats fighter C.NO,that is not how it works. An example....George Forman destroys Ken Norton,and Ken Norton beats Muhammad Ali.Then this means George Forman beats Muhammad Ali? NO,this is not how it works.So saying Joe Louis beats Ken Norton,and Ken Norton beats Muhammad Ali,means Joe Louis beats Muhammad Ali? NO,every boxing trainer and boxing experts know this is not how it works.Styles make fights. So just "break down" the fight,like i have please.

Thank You