Harry Greb, the true Goat

[Ivich]

Yes he was fighting heavyweights then, but also Middleweights because he was weighing in at or around the middleweight limit. And why was he fighting heavyweights? Because he couldn't get a title shot at 160 or 175 and there was more money against the big boys.

The reasons are irrelevant,the fact is he began fighting heavyweights in1905.

[Dr. Z]

No, you're trying to change this to Johnson ducking Langford and ignoring what and who I have pointed out to you from middle and lightheavyweight.

The topic was Langford being avoided by talented white fighters. Not a heavyweight, I said. I am not trying to change the topic to Johnson. I merely said he avoided Sam and ducked him from 1908-1915 while he was champion.

Well, I suppose I may be wrong. The above link proves that. Dempsey avoided him twice. Now he was a talented white fighter. Even the lame Ivich agrees with that!


Dempsey Afraid? He Says Yes; Ex-Champion Twice Refused to Fight Sam Langford


https://www.nytimes.com/1960/05/10/a...fight-sam.html

[Ivich]

The topic was Langford being avoided by talented white fighters. Not a heavyweight, I said. I am not trying to change the topic to Johnson. I merely said he avoided Sam and ducked him from 1908-1915 while he was champion.

Well, I suppose I may be wrong. The above link proves that. Dempsey avoided him twice. Now he was a talented white fighter. Even the lame Ivich agrees with that!


Dempsey Afraid? He Says Yes; Ex-Champion Twice Refused to Fight Sam Langford


https://www.nytimes.com/1960/05/10/a...fight-sam.html

The topic is Harry Greb!

As we know Johnson signed to fight both Langford and McVey in Australia,and posted a cash bond to do so.

As we also know H D McIntosh the promoter cancelled the fights.Which makes your statement ,not only wrong but yet another deliberate lie.
A young, green Dempsey ,sensibly refused to be sacrificed to his manager John Reznicks greed and turned thumbs down on a fight with Langford.
Once in his prime and now champion, Dempsey turned down Langford's request for a title fight,

Langford was past prime,fat,and half blind from a devastating stoppage loss to Fred Fulton,a man Dempsey had totally annihilated in under 2 minutes.
UnlikeJim Jeffries.who had no compunction in feasting on the alcoholic consumptive carcass of the 5 1/2 years retired Peter Jackson ,Dempsey showed some respect and compassion to a fellow pugilist. PS Langford pulled out of a proposed fight with Al Kaufman.
Now can we get off your pet hobby horses and return to the topic,Mr ,Roman Catholic Edward Henry Greb?

[Willie Pep 229]

The topic was Langford being avoided by talented white fighters. Not a heavyweight, I said. I am not trying to change the topic to Johnson. I merely said he avoided Sam and ducked him from 1908-1915 while he was champion.

Well, I suppose I may be wrong. The above link proves that. Dempsey avoided him twice. Now he was a talented white fighter. Even the lame Ivich agrees with that!


Dempsey Afraid? He Says Yes; Ex-Champion Twice Refused to Fight Sam Langford


https://www.nytimes.com/1960/05/10/a...fight-sam.html

No it doesn't. The headline is just 1960 'click bait.'

In fact he barely mentions Langford in the article.

Everyone knows young Dempsey was in awe of Langford and would not have fought him had he been offered such a fight, but he never was. So you can't duck someone who doesn't have you on their radar.

On the other hand champion Dempsey refused to fight a broken and worn Langford, so they (Dempsey, Fitzsimmons, Kearns) gave Sam some cash and put him on the undercard of the Miske defense. Big Bill Tate was charged with carrying the now finished Langford, so as not to hurt him. All three men loved Langford but knew he couldn't fight Dempsey in 1920 it would have been a massacre. Just as a young Dempsey couldn't have fought Langford in 1915, it too would have been a massacre the other way.

Just like the reporter from The Times, you take an out of context fact and twist the hell out of it.

[JAB5239]

The reasons are irrelevant,the fact is he began fighting heavyweights in1905.

I believe the reasons are very relevant. Had he been given his rightful chance at a middleweight and or lightheavyweight title who's to say he moves up so quickly to heavyweight? I would also argue he was fighting in the heavyweight division in 1905, but still weighing in at middleweight and lightheavyweight.

[Ivich]

I believe the reasons are very relevant. Had he been given his rightful chance at a middleweight and or lightheavyweight title who's to say he moves up so quickly to heavyweight? I would also argue he was fighting in the heavyweight division in 1905, but still weighing in at middleweight and lightheavyweight.

I'd say he would have won both titles had he been given the opportunity to fight for them,which still doesn't change the fact he began fighting heavyweights in1905.

[Ivich]

No it doesn't. The headline is just 1960 'click bait.'

In fact he barely mentions Langford in the article.

Everyone knows young Dempsey was in awe of Langford and would not have fought him had he been offered such a fight, but he never was. So you can't duck someone who doesn't have you on their radar.

On the other hand champion Dempsey refused to fight a broken and worn Langford, so they (Dempsey, Fitzsimmons, Kearns) gave Sam some cash and put him on the undercard of the Miske defense. Big Bill Tate was charged with carrying the now finished Langford, so as not to hurt him. All three men loved Langford but knew he couldn't fight Dempsey in 1920 it would have been a massacre. Just as a young Dempsey couldn't have fought Langford in 1915, it too would have been a massacre the other way.

Just like the reporter from The Times, you take an out of context fact and twist the hell out of it.

Just another example of his perpetual hate campaigns against Johnson.Dempsey ,Louis , and Lewis.

Dempsey boxed a benefit for Sam and also donated cash.

[Dr. Z]

The topic is Harry Greb!

As we know Johnson signed to fight both Langford and McVey in Australia,and posted a cash bond to do so.

As we also know H D McIntosh the promoter cancelled the fights.Which makes your statement ,not only wrong but yet another deliberate lie.
A young, green Dempsey ,sensibly refused to be sacrificed to his manager John Reznicks greed and turned thumbs down on a fight with Langford.
Once in his prime and now champion, Dempsey turned down Langford's request for a title fight,

Langford was past prime,fat,and half blind from a devastating stoppage loss to Fred Fulton,a man Dempsey had totally annihilated in under 2 minutes.
UnlikeJim Jeffries.who had no compunction in feasting on the alcoholic consumptive carcass of the 5 1/2 years retired Peter Jackson ,Dempsey showed some respect and compassion to a fellow pugilist. PS Langford pulled out of a proposed fight with Al Kaufman.
Now can we get off your pet hobby horses and return to the topic,Mr ,Roman Catholic Edward Henry Greb?

It is so like you to omit facts such as Langford had a signed contract to fight Johnson In England.

It is so like you to not list when the fight was offered to Johnson by date and when the promoter eventually closed it out and saved his money months later. Johnson had little interest in fighting the opponents offered by HD McIntosh as champion , you Dolt. He was not going to risk his cash cow championship vs. Langford, McVey, or Jeannette! Otherwise we would have seen that fight. Australia and England offer these fights. France did too. In all cases Johnson balked sometimes fighting second rate guys for less.

Your head like you say is " pig sick "

[Dr. Z]

I believe the reasons are very relevant. Had he been given his rightful chance at a middleweight and or lightheavyweight title who's to say he moves up so quickly to heavyweight? I would also argue he was fighting in the heavyweight division in 1905, but still weighing in at middleweight and lightheavyweight.

Quick question did Johnson lose his colored title when he lost to Marvin Hart? Just a bit of humor.

In fact Johnson kept his colored title losing to Jeannette via foul after a rough first round, he low blowed Joe in the second round. This is according to the press and the doctor verified the low blow.

[JAB5239]

I'd say he would have won both titles had he been given the opportunity to fight for them,which still doesn't change the fact he began fighting heavyweights in1905.

You are missing the point here my friend. Sam was fighting at heavyweight yes, but not solely heavyweight. In 1910 the Ketchel exhibition was to try and garner a middleweight title shot. There are plenty of fights between 1905 and 1913 where Sam weighed under either middle or lightheavyweight. It was until 1913 that his weight actually rose to that of a heavyweight. Had he not been ducked we may have never seen him stay at heavyweight......who knows?