Greb vs the great heavyweights

[JAB5239]

Nobody tears anyone apart in sparing.

Fitzsimmons had Greb under contract and he two agendas . . .

To build up Greb because he was on the Miske under card

He was trying to make a Dempsey-Greb fight after the Miske fight.

Dempsey owed Rickard a fight, that became the Brennan fight.

Then Fitz tried to get Dempsey-Greb going but he couldn't meet Kearns demand of $300,000 up front. Kearns didn't like taking the risk of a percentage, especially after the Brennan fight lost Rickard money.

Rickard could meet 300K demand for Carpentier. **

And before I have to listen how Kearns picked the easier fighter, that is nonsense. That is 20-20 hindsight. No one knew how good Carpentier was in 1921.

You're placing too much emphasis on a 'fight camp' talk and concluding that the sparing session is the end-all of the story. Na!

Look at the big picture.

** He offered Kearns a 100K and a percentage but Kearns would not bite. Had Kearns taken the percentage he would have cleared 470K.

Kearns ended up leaving 170K in Rickard's pocket instead of Dempsey's. The newspapers rode Kearns about the call and he didn't like it.

This is also one of the reasons why Kearns wouldn't consider the Pittsburg offer he got in 1922 to fight Greb. Again the promoter only had 100K and was offering a percentage. And again Kearns said no.

You say "duck" way too fast!

Every reporter that saw Greb spar Dempsey had him whacking Jack all around the ring with nary a glove being landed on himself. And you can say no one knew how good Carpentier was in 1921, but that just makes Dempsey look worse to me for picking him. EVERYONE knew how good Greb was. And everyone knows Dempsey fought guys, sometimes more than once that Harry hadn't beaten already and in some cases more than once.

I don't believe I used the term "duck". But you can call it what you want. The fact remains that Dempsey never fought Greb or Will and instead fought lesser fighters.

[IronDanHamza]

Every reporter that saw Greb spar Dempsey had him whacking Jack all around the ring with nary a glove being landed on himself. And you can say no one knew how good Carpentier was in 1921, but that just makes Dempsey look worse to me for picking him. EVERYONE knew how good Greb was. And everyone knows Dempsey fought guys, sometimes more than once that Harry hadn't beaten already and in some cases more than once.

I don't believe I used the term "duck". But you can call it what you want. The fact remains that Dempsey never fought Greb or Will and instead fought lesser fighters.

Sparring stories are a dime a dozen.

It doesn't mean anything.

To put Greb, someone who's highest weight was around 170 lbs in the conversation with ATG Heavyweights is just comical.

[JAB5239]

Sparring stories are a dime a dozen.

It doesn't mean anything.

To put Greb, someone who's highest weight was around 170 lbs in the conversation with ATG Heavyweights is just comical.

first, I'm not saying he could beat all the greats. But styles make fights. Sam Langford is highly regarded at heavyweight and wasnt that much bigger than Greb.

Second, there were a lot of dimes present when these sparring sessions. Did all of the make up the same story?

[IronDanHamza]

first, I'm not saying he could beat all the greats. But styles make fights. Sam Langford is highly regarded at heavyweight and wasnt that much bigger than Greb.

Second, there were a lot of dimes present when these sparring sessions. Did all of the make up the same story?

I’m not saying the story is made up I’m saying that sparring stories of Fighter A beating up fighter B are endless and it doesn’t mean anything.

Paul Spadfora “beat up” Mayweather in sparring. It doesn’t mean anything.

Yeah but the big difference there is Langford did it, Greb didnt. And Langford has no place in those discussions either.

It’s a preposterous concept. Greb was one of the all time greats, but he does not belong in that conversation.

[JAB5239]

I’m not saying the story is made up I’m saying that sparring stories of Fighter A beating up fighter B are endless and it doesn’t mean anything.

Paul Spadfora “beat up” Mayweather in sparring. It doesn’t mean anything.

Yeah but the big difference there is Langford did it, Greb didnt. And Langford has no place in those discussions either.

It’s a preposterous concept. Greb was one of the all time greats, but he does not belong in that conversation.

But it does mean something because Dempsey fought many of the men Greb had already beaten but wouldn't fight Greb himself. The fight itself is fantasy. We can have opposite outcomes and both would be true and false. The fact that is didn't happen and Jack fought those others instead....that tells me Greb was a risk not worth taking for him. Could he beat Louis, Ali and other great heavyweights? I don't know. I do know one great heavyweight didn't fight him after being beaten pillar to post in sparring but fought men Greb had already beaten. You can glean from that what you will, everyone has a different opinion. Mine is Greb was good enough (win or lose) to give Dempsey fits.

[IronDanHamza]

But it does mean something because Dempsey fought many of the men Greb had already beaten but wouldn't fight Greb himself. The fight itself is fantasy. We can have opposite outcomes and both would be true and false. The fact that is didn't happen and Jack fought those others instead....that tells me Greb was a risk not worth taking for him. Could he beat Louis, Ali and other great heavyweights? I don't know. I do know one great heavyweight didn't fight him after being beaten pillar to post in sparring but fought men Greb had already beaten. You can glean from that what you will, everyone has a different opinion. Mine is Greb was good enough (win or lose) to give Dempsey fits.

It literally means nothing.

Sparring and fighting are two totally different things. It’s totally irrelevant there are about a million sparring stories.

There is not a single reason to even make a comparison between Greb and any of the ATG Heavyweights.

He was a Middleweight. He shouldn’t be in these kind of discussions it’s ludicrous to do so.

[JAB5239]

It literally means nothing.

Sparring and fighting are two totally different things. It’s totally irrelevant there are about a million sparring stories.

There is not a single reason to even make a comparison between Greb and any of the ATG Heavyweights.

He was a Middleweight. He shouldn’t be in these kind of discussions it’s ludicrous to do so.

The fact is that Dempsey fought guys Greb had already beaten, but not Greb himself. The fact is also Harry knocked the crap out of Dempsey in sparring. Does that mean he would win a real fight? Who can say. I'm not talking g about any other heavyweight besides Dempsey. I am certain Dempsey knew the risk of fighting Greb outweighs the reward.

Greb vs Louis.....I don't know who would win, its a fantasy fight. But Conn was game, you have to believe Greb would be as well.

[QueensburyRules]

So if you believe he'd have trouble against modern light heavyweights, you must think Tunney would as well. Is the correct?

And let's face it, Greb tore Dempsey up so bad in sparring the jack wanted nothing to do with him, instead fighting Harry's leftovers.

- - Face it, you got tore up so bad you don't which end of you is up and which is down.

Greb a natural middle/LH, Tunny a natural LH/Heavy. Greb ain't even challenging Willard much less fighting him.

[JAB5239]

- - Face it, you got tore up so bad you don't which end of you is up and which is down.

Greb a natural middle/LH, Tunny a natural LH/Heavy. Greb ain't even challenging Willard much less fighting him.

You make no sense and didn't answer the question. You're assuming Greb would lose against modern light heavyweights. If you believe that you must believe Tunney would also considering the competitiveness of their 5fight series.

[IronDanHamza]

The fact is that Dempsey fought guys Greb had already beaten, but not Greb himself. The fact is also Harry knocked the crap out of Dempsey in sparring. Does that mean he would win a real fight? Who can say. I'm not talking g about any other heavyweight besides Dempsey. I am certain Dempsey knew the risk of fighting Greb outweighs the reward.

Greb vs Louis.....I don't know who would win, its a fantasy fight. But Conn was game, you have to believe Greb would be as well.

No one can say it because there’s nothing to suggest he would. He could have beating him up in sparring 100 times in a row it means nothing I regards to what would happen if they had a fight.