Marciano was overrated and not an ATG.

[Cyberspace]

Overrated because he was short and his fights are in black and white probably.

But he did more with his limited tools than any heavyweight has done in recent times.

[BennyST]

Its widely known that RM wanted no part of Liston. Just today I watched SL v Patterson 2, Liston was a beast. He would have kept RM behind the jab and cut him to ribbons.

Really?

Just like it's widely known that Dundee cut Ali's glove in between rounds against Cooper when Ali was so hurt he was about to be KTFO and bought him an extra five minutes to recuperate, thus winning him the fight?

You mean that widely known?

[McGoorty]

Really?

Just like it's widely known that Dundee cut Ali's glove in between rounds against Cooper when Ali was so hurt he was about to be KTFO and bought him an extra five minutes to recuperate, thus winning him the fight?

You mean that widely known?

Benny you are a legend, great stuff, I cant give you more Karma till I sporead it around a bit but consider this a thumbs up cobber.

[McGoorty]

Dude....This post is pure gold, I think I luv you!!!

Heres a bit of irony: If you watch films of Marciano he rolled a lot of those bombs he "took" He had excellent upper body (what we in the martial arts call tai sabaki) movement...imo better than Dempsey's.

awww shucks !!!!... Fact is if Rocky thought to himself after the Moore fight, """ Hey, 49 and 0 ???.. hmmmm I like the sound of 50 and 0, hmmmm who can I fight thats got no experience and is years before his prime, hmmm I say this huge lump in a warm up fight name of Liston.. hmmm he may be somebody in the future.. ahh to hell with that bastard Al Weill and his ripping me off, I'll have just one last fight against this Liston guy, hell he may just last two whole rounds, I'll do it""" ------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Just imagine what the public reaction is after MORAL Rock maims this poor beginner Sonny, and I have no doubt that Marciano (still in his prime) absolutely destroys Sonny Liston, it would have made the last SRR V LaMotta fight look like the Nelson Vs Ad Wolgast fight squeezed into 4 rounds.. No fighter was capable of beating Rocky that year, and he would have ruled 1956 as well. Nuthugging doesn't get much bigger than this conspiracy theory.

[Ray Corso]

In regards to Rocky retiring when he did! It was well known that his back promblems had increased and the training to get ready to fight became increasingly difficult to get through.
As for "avoiding" Sonny Liston I don't think Sonny was a rated top ten heavy in 1955, I don't think he was a steady main event performer yet either!
I believe that Rocky was also 8 years older than Sonny so their progression in the sport was not exactly at the same time.

People who watch Rocky in the blk & wht film really don't get an appreciation of what this guy was all about. I had a friend who fought Rocky and he told me many times that Rocky's opponents after feeling his punches didn't try to engage him at all! My friend was a 500% fighter who was tuff as nails and had fought or sparred with the best heavies from 1950 to 1965 and he told me that Rockys punches made the most "impression" on him than any other man hahahaha!!!!
Fans that have never fought are at a total loss when the topic of hard hitters is discussed. They have no idea how a punch from these men "stops time" and freezes your mind! They have zero understanding how the brain disconnects from the body yet they continue to disregard the reality they never have faced. Is a waste of time to speak with people who have never been smashed in the jaw or chin and then listen to them give their expertise!!! A total joke!! It would be a beautifull thing to have these idiots get cracked in the jaw then take a kidney shot just to have that extra paralizing feeling run through their bodies as they "go to sleep" nite!!!! Ray

[zelley]

[QUOTE=Ray Corso;13207429]In regards to Rocky retiring when he did! It was well known that his back promblems had increased and the training to get ready to fight became increasingly difficult to get through.
As for "avoiding" Sonny Liston I don't think Sonny was a rated top ten heavy in 1955, I don't think he was a steady main event performer yet either!
I believe that Rocky was also 8 years older than Sonny so their progression in the sport was not exactly at the same time.

EXCELLENT detail Ray, the big problem will always be discussions among
folks that know the sport, folks that think they know the sport, and folks
that have no idea of the ability and skills needed to be undefeated
by any boxer.

We could make a long long list of former champions and uncrowned champions
that do not get the proper recognition, or they are quickly added to the bottom
group of former boxers rather than being considered for a p4p best list.
One small example could be light-heavyweight champ HAROLD JOHNSON.

[elfag]

Marciano is a light heavyweight by todays standards. And all of his meaningful wins were over guys who moved up from light heavyweight which are super middles by todays standards.

Yet you got a bunch of noobs running around spouting nonsense how little marcianonito would be KOing REAL heavyweights like Tyson and Wlad. GTFO of here unknowledgeable noobs.



Thats a light heavyweight right there.

[Bolo Punch]

Marciano is a light heavyweight by todays standards. And all of his meaningful wins were over guys who moved up from light heavyweight which are super middles by todays standards.

Yet you got a bunch of noobs running around spouting nonsense how little marcianonito would be KOing REAL heavyweights like Tyson and Wlad. GTFO of here unknowledgeable noobs.



Thats a light heavyweight right there.

They're unknowledgeable, when it's you that's talking nonsense?

Might as well call Willie Pep the greatest Bantamweight ever and Eder Jofre the Flyweight King, then. Just because people weighed in on the same day back then doesn't mean that they should be classed as lighter weight fighters for H2H debates today. They weren't. End of.

Also, people in general were smaller back then. Fact. Can't hate on Marciano for fighting "super-middleweights", by your reckoning, if there was no-one bigger around for him to fight.

[rightsideup]

just some thoughts on rocky. I personally believe he did not duck anyone. His punching power while maybe not to foremans standards was incredible for a man his size. In 1969 while filming the ali computer fight he popped ali in the chest hard enough to have him stop trying to slap off his toupee. Other asset+s that rocky had was endurance and courage. Is he the greatest heavy weight to have graced the sport maybe not but he was the best of his era and rightly deserves praise for his accomplishments not belittlement.

[Anthony342]

In regards to Rocky retiring when he did! It was well known that his back promblems had increased and the training to get ready to fight became increasingly difficult to get through.
As for "avoiding" Sonny Liston I don't think Sonny was a rated top ten heavy in 1955, I don't think he was a steady main event performer yet either!
I believe that Rocky was also 8 years older than Sonny so their progression in the sport was not exactly at the same time.

People who watch Rocky in the blk & wht film really don't get an appreciation of what this guy was all about. I had a friend who fought Rocky and he told me many times that Rocky's opponents after feeling his punches didn't try to engage him at all! My friend was a 500% fighter who was tuff as nails and had fought or sparred with the best heavies from 1950 to 1965 and he told me that Rockys punches made the most "impression" on him than any other man hahahaha!!!!
Fans that have never fought are at a total loss when the topic of hard hitters is discussed. They have no idea how a punch from these men "stops time" and freezes your mind! They have zero understanding how the brain disconnects from the body yet they continue to disregard the reality they never have faced. Is a waste of time to speak with people who have never been smashed in the jaw or chin and then listen to them give their expertise!!! A total joke!! It would be a beautifull thing to have these idiots get cracked in the jaw then take a kidney shot just to have that extra paralizing feeling run through their bodies as they "go to sleep" nite!!!! Ray

I've had that feeling in the schoolyard, a lot of guys have. Huge Rocky fan and I can definitely appreciate his toughness, ability and what he was all about. I always enjoy a fighter that can end it at any time with a well placed shot or combination.