Bookmark Website  | Free Registration  | The Team
Boxing Champions |  Boxing Schedule |  Boxing Video  |  Boxing History   |  Pound For Pound  | Lounge  | The Wire |  Audio  | Arcade

Navigation
Go Back   Boxing Forum > Non Boxing Talk > Mixed Martial Arts Discussion
Reply
Thread Navigation

#21
Old 02-27-2013, 09:52 PM
Virgil Caine
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Posts: 13,119
Rep Power: 82 Virgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 4,981.64
Bank: 192,156,010,130,581.41
Total Points: 192,156,010,135,563.03
A gift from The Last Emperor LOL! - jakkups Happy birthday homey - mangler Cocktail hour - mangler Sip this wine - mangler more drank - MANGLER 
Thanks for the stream dude. - Naps Happy Birthday! I hope you have a wonderful day - Bossy one of boxingscene's best posters - Freedom. Happy Holidays Nodogoshi - !! AI-Holmes!! Happy holidays bro! - led* 
10 years... impressive :beerchug: - jose830 Congrats on 10 years. - deanrw 
Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - DiLLiNGER 
Default

Also, rather convenient how you duck my examples of Randy Couture, AKA, Golden Glory.

Also, rather telling that you find no problem with the 'media'-complicit assault against Fedor, which was at least bordering on libel and slander (though I would say it was each of these things, as it likely did do damage to Fedor's reputation, on which basis it would be a civil crime, for which Fedor could be compensated, given a court judgment to such an effect. Of course, this is merely speculative, as no suit was ever filed, obviously--though "at least boarderline libel and slander" is not speculation, but rather statement of my view).

Last edited by Virgil Caine; 02-27-2013 at 11:16 PM.
Reply With Quote
Virgil Caine is offline
Advertisements
>>>TO REMOVE THESE ADS, PLEASE REGISTER HERE FOR FREE<<<
#22
Old 02-27-2013, 11:13 PM
-Swizzy-
The Bad Guy
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 10,389
Rep Power: 29 -Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 1,000,403,505.08
Bank: 11,980,910,177,423.98
Total Points: 11,981,910,580,929.06
tua ko4 over arreola. tua ko8 over peter. war tua!!! - Left Hook Tua so i'm just a big joke to you eh? lmao - Left Hook Tua thanks. i'm quite a post whore. - Left Hook Tua thanks for supporting my thread mate - D E M Dz A here's another beer for being generous - D E M Dz A 
and something to eat with those beers...cheers mate you deserved it - D E M Dz A happy new year , canuck. - Left Hook Tua youre one of the best basketball knowledgable posters, youre a lebron fan but  you still cool - Tha_Greatest Happy holidays bro! - led* 
Children with Disabilities - Parkinson's Disease - VACTERL - Young Onset Parkinson's Association - Left Hook Tua Adoptee - Bone Cancer - Child Exploitation and Abuse - Hope and Support - Peace - Retinoblastoma - Right to Life - Student Sexual Assault - Dorian Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - codey 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodogoshi View Post
Also, Alvarez is not even thinking for himself.

Contracts are legally binding documents.

I said that I don't like, necessarily, the matching rights clauses.

UFC contracts are much worse though, and that is well known.

And here is Fedor on the UFC situation.

You do realize that fighters are human beings, and are not commodities? You also do realize that a contract is a legally binding business agreement, which requires two sides to formalize? And based on this latter point, you do realize that it takes two parties to make a deal? And that if a deal is not reached, that it is because the terms negotiated are deemed unacceptable by one, or both, parties privy to the negotiations?

Yeah, of course you don't. You only care about what makes you feel fuzzy inside. Apparently, Dana White is one such thing (I say 'thing' because he's just a media persona, as we all know him).

Here's that Fedor video, where he explains some of the reasons the contract was unacceptable.


For good measure, here's the video where Eddie Alvarez admits that he doesn't even know what is in the contracts.
dude I have zero bias for any particular company or org. I'm just an mma fan....... unlike yourself.

If UFC was doing this to Alvarez you would have made a thread about it bashing the UFC no doubt.

Now you're making up stuff like "Alvarez admits that he doesn't even know what is in the contracts". lol he never said that in the video.

Bellator has NEVER done a ppv and that is part of the contract. Even at the hearing the judge asked the Bellator reps if they have a ppv fight for him and they hesitated and said yes and named the champion Chandler. Then a couple of days later Chandler was asked if he's fighting Alvarez in a ppv fight and he said that nobody talked to him about any fight like that.

And when Rebney was doing a live interview on Ariel Helwani's show, Alvarez called in and wanted to air everything out with him in public. And Rebney pretended that he lost his connection and Helwani couldn't get a hold of him for the rest of the show. But Alvarez was there to discuss everything. Alvarez knows exactly whats in the contract. No need to twist everything to match your bias.

heres that interview -->

Last edited by -Swizzy-; 02-27-2013 at 11:16 PM.
Reply With Quote
-Swizzy- is offline
#23
Old 02-27-2013, 11:21 PM
Virgil Caine
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Posts: 13,119
Rep Power: 82 Virgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 4,981.64
Bank: 192,156,010,130,581.41
Total Points: 192,156,010,135,563.03
A gift from The Last Emperor LOL! - jakkups Happy birthday homey - mangler Cocktail hour - mangler Sip this wine - mangler more drank - MANGLER 
Thanks for the stream dude. - Naps Happy Birthday! I hope you have a wonderful day - Bossy one of boxingscene's best posters - Freedom. Happy Holidays Nodogoshi - !! AI-Holmes!! Happy holidays bro! - led* 
10 years... impressive :beerchug: - jose830 Congrats on 10 years. - deanrw 
Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - DiLLiNGER 
Default

What Bellator is doing with respect to Eddie Alvarez is not as bad as what Zuffa does with fighters, as a standard procedure.

I would like to see these sorts of contracts changed.

I have never defended Bellator, here, just given my analysis.

But, I lean in favor of Bellator, in this instance.

I just wish that fighters had better representation, than the legal team of an opposing promotional company, as in the Alvarez case.
Reply With Quote
Virgil Caine is offline
#24
Old 02-27-2013, 11:22 PM
Virgil Caine
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Posts: 13,119
Rep Power: 82 Virgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 4,981.64
Bank: 192,156,010,130,581.41
Total Points: 192,156,010,135,563.03
A gift from The Last Emperor LOL! - jakkups Happy birthday homey - mangler Cocktail hour - mangler Sip this wine - mangler more drank - MANGLER 
Thanks for the stream dude. - Naps Happy Birthday! I hope you have a wonderful day - Bossy one of boxingscene's best posters - Freedom. Happy Holidays Nodogoshi - !! AI-Holmes!! Happy holidays bro! - led* 
10 years... impressive :beerchug: - jose830 Congrats on 10 years. - deanrw 
Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - DiLLiNGER 
Default

Also, the terms of contracts are basically non-negotiable, once signed.

Of course, it is up to courts to determine these terms, once there is a disagreement.

I am just being rational here. You are being reactionary.
Reply With Quote
Virgil Caine is offline
#25
Old 02-27-2013, 11:26 PM
Virgil Caine
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Posts: 13,119
Rep Power: 82 Virgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 4,981.64
Bank: 192,156,010,130,581.41
Total Points: 192,156,010,135,563.03
A gift from The Last Emperor LOL! - jakkups Happy birthday homey - mangler Cocktail hour - mangler Sip this wine - mangler more drank - MANGLER 
Thanks for the stream dude. - Naps Happy Birthday! I hope you have a wonderful day - Bossy one of boxingscene's best posters - Freedom. Happy Holidays Nodogoshi - !! AI-Holmes!! Happy holidays bro! - led* 
10 years... impressive :beerchug: - jose830 Congrats on 10 years. - deanrw 
Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - DiLLiNGER 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by -Swizzy- View Post
Now you're making up stuff like "Alvarez admits that he doesn't even know what is in the contracts". lol he never said that in the video.
Skip to about 1:20 :


"He needs to match every term, that's what he was told, and that's what I'm being told. Without getting too deep into it, and I don't even know that much about the situation, um, it seems like they didn't match, and I'm being told they didn't match, Glen Robinson, I'm sure has my best interest in mind, and I trust him."

Last edited by Virgil Caine; 02-28-2013 at 12:47 AM.
Reply With Quote
Virgil Caine is offline
#26
Old 02-27-2013, 11:32 PM
Virgil Caine
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Posts: 13,119
Rep Power: 82 Virgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 4,981.64
Bank: 192,156,010,130,581.41
Total Points: 192,156,010,135,563.03
A gift from The Last Emperor LOL! - jakkups Happy birthday homey - mangler Cocktail hour - mangler Sip this wine - mangler more drank - MANGLER 
Thanks for the stream dude. - Naps Happy Birthday! I hope you have a wonderful day - Bossy one of boxingscene's best posters - Freedom. Happy Holidays Nodogoshi - !! AI-Holmes!! Happy holidays bro! - led* 
10 years... impressive :beerchug: - jose830 Congrats on 10 years. - deanrw 
Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - DiLLiNGER 
Default

I can see how that can be interpreted as him saying that he doesn't know the ins and outs of the litigation situation.

When I heard this though the first time, I thought he was saying that he doesn't know the details of the contract, since he was talking about the 'terms' a breath before.

It is still just a talk on a show. But he doesn't seem too up to speed on it all. However, maybe it is just his speaking style.

In any case, I have nothing against Alvarez.

I'm just giving my views. Whether you want to accept this, or not, is all up to you.

And yes, I am very cynical of Zuffa, and I usually assume they are wrong, and go from there, because I consider them to be an extremely dirty organization, and a reflection of much which is wrong with professional fighting, and usually they are wrong.

Last edited by Virgil Caine; 02-27-2013 at 11:34 PM.
Reply With Quote
Virgil Caine is offline
#27
Old 02-27-2013, 11:54 PM
-Swizzy-
The Bad Guy
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 10,389
Rep Power: 29 -Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute-Swizzy- has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 1,000,403,505.08
Bank: 11,980,910,177,423.98
Total Points: 11,981,910,580,929.06
tua ko4 over arreola. tua ko8 over peter. war tua!!! - Left Hook Tua so i'm just a big joke to you eh? lmao - Left Hook Tua thanks. i'm quite a post whore. - Left Hook Tua thanks for supporting my thread mate - D E M Dz A here's another beer for being generous - D E M Dz A 
and something to eat with those beers...cheers mate you deserved it - D E M Dz A happy new year , canuck. - Left Hook Tua youre one of the best basketball knowledgable posters, youre a lebron fan but  you still cool - Tha_Greatest Happy holidays bro! - led* 
Children with Disabilities - Parkinson's Disease - VACTERL - Young Onset Parkinson's Association - Left Hook Tua Adoptee - Bone Cancer - Child Exploitation and Abuse - Hope and Support - Peace - Retinoblastoma - Right to Life - Student Sexual Assault - Dorian Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - codey 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodogoshi View Post
Also, rather convenient how you duck my examples of Randy Couture, AKA, Golden Glory.

Also, rather telling that you find no problem with the 'media'-complicit assault against Fedor, which was at least bordering on libel and slander (though I would say it was each of these things, as it likely did do damage to Fedor's reputation, on which basis it would be a civil crime, for which Fedor could be compensated, given a court judgment to such an effect. Of course, this is merely speculative, as no suit was ever filed, obviously--though "at least boarderline libel and slander" is not speculation, but rather statement of my view).
What about the Randy Couture thing? Are you talking about the bogus case where he tried to sue the UFC for lying about the ppv numbers and LOST the case or the more recent thing where he signed with Bellator?

And as far as Fedor goes, I'm a big fan of his. And I was pissed as hell as a fan of his that he didn't sign with the UFC. So all the sh*t that Dana said about him in public was exactly what I was feeling about fedor as well. So yeah I agree with all the stuff that Dana said. Fedor and his management were asking way more than they were worth. Asking for 50% of a UFC ppv is ridiculous. No way Fedor is worth that much. The UFC brings in 80% of the fans just because its the UFC. Fedor can't just jump in there after the UFC built this brand over a decade and leech more than his worth. That was greed on the part of Fedor.

I'm sure all organizations play hard ball and do dirty things to get their way, but there's no need to have irrational sentiments about everything that a company does. Just wait till you see the evidence before forming an opinion.

Last edited by -Swizzy-; 02-27-2013 at 11:58 PM.
Reply With Quote
-Swizzy- is offline
#28
Old 02-28-2013, 12:41 AM
Virgil Caine
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Posts: 13,119
Rep Power: 82 Virgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 4,981.64
Bank: 192,156,010,130,581.41
Total Points: 192,156,010,135,563.03
A gift from The Last Emperor LOL! - jakkups Happy birthday homey - mangler Cocktail hour - mangler Sip this wine - mangler more drank - MANGLER 
Thanks for the stream dude. - Naps Happy Birthday! I hope you have a wonderful day - Bossy one of boxingscene's best posters - Freedom. Happy Holidays Nodogoshi - !! AI-Holmes!! Happy holidays bro! - led* 
10 years... impressive :beerchug: - jose830 Congrats on 10 years. - deanrw 
Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - DiLLiNGER 
Default

Swizzy, it is quite pointless for us to discuss.

But, keep learning.

Did you watch the video I posted where Fedor discussed the contract?
Reply With Quote
Virgil Caine is offline
#29
Old 02-28-2013, 12:44 AM
Virgil Caine
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Posts: 13,119
Rep Power: 82 Virgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 4,981.64
Bank: 192,156,010,130,581.41
Total Points: 192,156,010,135,563.03
A gift from The Last Emperor LOL! - jakkups Happy birthday homey - mangler Cocktail hour - mangler Sip this wine - mangler more drank - MANGLER 
Thanks for the stream dude. - Naps Happy Birthday! I hope you have a wonderful day - Bossy one of boxingscene's best posters - Freedom. Happy Holidays Nodogoshi - !! AI-Holmes!! Happy holidays bro! - led* 
10 years... impressive :beerchug: - jose830 Congrats on 10 years. - deanrw 
Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - DiLLiNGER 
Default

Also, my cynicism about Zuffa is rational.

I'll change my opinion if information comes to light to lead me to do so.

But, the safe medium for me, with respect to essentially everything Zuffa does, is cynicism. And, my cynicism is based on rationality.
Reply With Quote
Virgil Caine is offline
#30
Old 02-28-2013, 12:51 AM
Virgil Caine
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Posts: 13,119
Rep Power: 82 Virgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond reputeVirgil Caine has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 4,981.64
Bank: 192,156,010,130,581.41
Total Points: 192,156,010,135,563.03
A gift from The Last Emperor LOL! - jakkups Happy birthday homey - mangler Cocktail hour - mangler Sip this wine - mangler more drank - MANGLER 
Thanks for the stream dude. - Naps Happy Birthday! I hope you have a wonderful day - Bossy one of boxingscene's best posters - Freedom. Happy Holidays Nodogoshi - !! AI-Holmes!! Happy holidays bro! - led* 
10 years... impressive :beerchug: - jose830 Congrats on 10 years. - deanrw 
Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - DiLLiNGER 
Default

Oh, and I was indeed referring to the recent situation, with respect to Randy Couture signing on to work with Bellator, and Zuffa and Dana White attempting one of their typical character assassination campaigns, almost before the ink dried.

And Randy didn't lose the suit. They settled out of court.

Also, it seemed as though part of the strategy of Zuffa was to keep the thing tied up in court indefinitely, to keep Couture on the shelf, and to wear out some of the luster of the fight.

But, that is just my opinion. That they settled the suit out of court is a fact.
Reply With Quote
Virgil Caine is offline
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
fame?, hall

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Privacy Policy - Submit News - Feedback - Site Map - Advertise with Us

Copyright 2003-2013 BoxingScene LLC All rights reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:41 AM.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.