Bookmark Website  | Free Registration  | The Team
Boxing Champions |  Boxing Schedule |  Boxing Video  |  Boxing History   |  Pound For Pound  | Lounge  | The Wire |  Audio  | Arcade

Navigation
Go Back   Boxing Forum > Boxing Forums > Non Stop Boxing
Reply
Thread Navigation

#11
Old 02-22-2013, 02:15 AM
techliam
Caneloweight Champion
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Aberdeen, UK
Posts: 2,496
Blog Entries: 2
Rep Power: 10 techliam has a reputation beyond repute techliam has a reputation beyond repute techliam has a reputation beyond repute techliam has a reputation beyond repute techliam has a reputation beyond repute techliam has a reputation beyond repute techliam has a reputation beyond repute techliam has a reputation beyond repute techliam has a reputation beyond repute techliam has a reputation beyond repute techliam has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 11,100,081,128.15
Bank: 42,429,289,770,983.14
Total Points: 42,440,389,852,111.29
Consistently good poster. - ddangerous  cheers m8 - hougigo  knows his stuff - jas  great poster - jas 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Light_Speed View Post
Regardless of the inner workings, there are facts we can use to assess whether an organization is trustworthy. I listed those facts, ignoring them would be the stupid thing to do.
How can you know whether or not an organisation is truly trustworthy, if you are looking at it from the outside? There could be so many inner workings that only the elites know about. The facts you used are cool and all, but really that isn't enough to call them trustworthy.

The system needs transparency, not more friggin organisations. Until theres actually transparent behaviour by these organisations, quite frankly, theres not much evidence to suggest they aren't as bad as eachother
Reply With Quote
techliam is offline
Advertisements
>>>TO REMOVE THESE ADS, PLEASE REGISTER HERE FOR FREE<<<
#12
Old 02-22-2013, 02:23 AM
Phenom
Phenomdeaux
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 5,516
Rep Power: 18 Phenom has disabled reputation
Points: 13,957,476,510.06
Bank: 27,573,180,390,088,560.00
Total Points: 27,573,194,347,565,072.00
Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - bearman3000  Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - bearman3000 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by techliam View Post
How can you know whether or not an organisation is truly trustworthy, if you are looking at it from the outside? There could be so many inner workings that only the elites know about. The facts you used are cool and all, but really that isn't enough to call them trustworthy.

The system needs transparency, not more friggin organisations. Until theres actually transparent behaviour by these organisations, quite frankly, theres not much evidence to suggest they aren't as bad as eachother
USADA has history and is recognized by the Congress as national antidoping organization for United States Athletes while VADA is couple of years old and started by guy supposedly trying to vindicate himself
Reply With Quote
Phenom is offline
#13
Old 02-22-2013, 02:27 AM
Zyzz
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 115
Rep Power: 0 Zyzz will become famous soon enough Zyzz will become famous soon enough
Points: 3,916.62
Bank: 0.00
Total Points: 3,916.62
Default

Usada is an actual Olympic testing organization.. Vada is an alternative like shasta is to coke, regardless trusting an "anti-doping" organization ran by victor Conte is like trusting a murderer on trial defended by oj simpson

The only reason usada is constantly bashes, and vada conspicuous praise all the time, is because maxboxing and all these other writers that are top rank jock sniffers look for any reason to **** on golden boy and Al Haymon fighters..
Reply With Quote
Zyzz is offline
#14
Old 02-22-2013, 02:31 AM
BIGPOPPAPUMP
Big Bad Booty Daddy
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: New York
Posts: 20,734
Rep Power: 200000 BIGPOPPAPUMP has a reputation beyond repute BIGPOPPAPUMP has a reputation beyond repute BIGPOPPAPUMP has a reputation beyond repute BIGPOPPAPUMP has a reputation beyond repute BIGPOPPAPUMP has a reputation beyond repute BIGPOPPAPUMP has a reputation beyond repute BIGPOPPAPUMP has a reputation beyond repute BIGPOPPAPUMP has a reputation beyond repute BIGPOPPAPUMP has a reputation beyond repute BIGPOPPAPUMP has a reputation beyond repute BIGPOPPAPUMP has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 2,502,108,402,156.83
Bank: 0.00
Total Points: 2,502,108,402,156.83
Cheers, to the servers BPP! - mangler  unban kev183 - Kevin Jesus  Thanks for all u du Pops! - jazluvr  For the Sam Tribute thread! Thanks Pops! - jazluvr  Our Boxingscene father, who art in heaven.... - Disposable Arts 
A Medal For Boxing Scenes Father...... ;-) nyargles! - BritishBoxing92  Apple for Pump - Poor Lad  Enjoy your Parallelogram - Spray_resistant  Merry Christmas - Flab  ...and a Happy New Year! - Flab 
.........no homo - MANIAC310  for the amazing job you do reporting the boxing news! - jose830  happy holidays Popa! - jazluvr  To wipe yourself down with after Reeno's sprayed his seed up you - !! Anorak  Kudos to responding to the trolling!  Seeing your pic of Mayweather on the throne has become a daily routine for me. - Trudoe 
saw your name on my 'recent visitor list'...I'm flattered :flirt: - -jose-  Merry Christmas - TBear  No Message - fokas  No Message - fokas  new phone layout :fing02: love it!!! - -jose- 
Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - Butterball  Anti-Tobacco - Colon Cancer - Colorectal Cancer - S a m u r a i  Cesarean Sections - Headaches - Hospice Care - Multiple Myeloma - S a m u r a i  Arthritis - Child Abuse - Colon Cancer - Colorectal Cancer - Dystonia - Education - Free Speech - Interstitial Cystitis - ME/CFIDS - Reye's Syndrome - Save the Music - Teens Against Smoking - Victim's Rights - Water Quality - S a m u r a i  Childhood Cancer - S a m u r a i 
Lou Gehrig's Disease (ALS) - -Ash-  Head and Neck Cancer - -Ash-  Breast Cancer - Birth Parents - -Ash-  Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - bearman3000  Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - jazluvr 
World Trade Center Victims and Heroes - Fireworks Safety - jazluvr  Troop and Military Support - Amber Alert - Bladder Cancer - Endometriosis - Equality - Liver Cancer - Liver Disease - Missing Children - POW/MIA - Spina Bifida - Suicide - jazluvr  Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - Grand Champ  Arthritis - Child Abuse - Colon Cancer - Colorectal Cancer - Dystonia - Education - Free Speech - Interstitial Cystitis - ME/CFIDS - Reye's Syndrome - Save the Music - Teens Against Smoking - Victim's Rights - Water Quality - jazluvr  Anti-Tobacco - Colon Cancer - Colorectal Cancer - jazluvr 
Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - bigpauly  Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - Trudoe  Alzheimer's - Crohn's &amp; Colitis - Cystic Fibrosis - Domestic Violence - Fibromyalgia - Leimyosarcoma - Lupus - jas  Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - Scott-Weiland  World Trade Center Victims and Heroes - Fireworks Safety - jazluvr 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Light_Speed View Post
VADA automatically notifies the commission when a fighter tests positive for PEDs, that's the reason why Golden Boy stopped using them and went with USADA who have done some shady things. They didn't notify the commission when Morales tested positive, instead they kept taking samples from him until he tested negative. They tested Quillin and Winky but then two days later abandoned the testing at Golden Boy's request and destroyed the samples when they're supposed to keep them for 6 years.

VADA caught Peterson and Berto who works with Conte (there goes the conspiracy theory).

All in all, VADA is a much more trustworthy organization than USADA.
They stopped working with VADA because they DIDN'T TELL the promoter OR the Las Vegas Commission until it was too late to save the show. In other words, they sat on the information that Peterson tested positive for weeks, which then cost Golden Boy a lot of money in cancelling that event because the cancellation insurance does not cover financial losses due to a fighter testing positive for a banned substance. If they would have notified all parties the moment Peterson tested positive, the show would have likely been saved. Nobody wanted to face Khan on less than two weeks notice.
Reply With Quote
BIGPOPPAPUMP is offline
#15
Old 02-22-2013, 02:40 AM
josenoway
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: May 2005
Age: 45
Posts: 2,198
Rep Power: 15 josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 2,100,029,101.12
Bank: 2,657,666.83
Total Points: 2,102,686,767.95
Default

Is this a joke? USADA = non-profit, been in the field of testing for like 10 years, providing testing for thousands of athletes, pursued and brought down some of the most well-organized, well-funded cheats across a variety of sports. Olympics = $50 billion dollar industry, like USADA is going to risk their reputation and everything they've accomplished to protect who? Morales? GBP? What's the motive again?
Reply With Quote
josenoway is offline
#16
Old 02-22-2013, 02:54 AM
chav
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 4,574
Rep Power: 29 chav has a reputation beyond repute chav has a reputation beyond repute chav has a reputation beyond repute chav has a reputation beyond repute chav has a reputation beyond repute chav has a reputation beyond repute chav has a reputation beyond repute chav has a reputation beyond repute chav has a reputation beyond repute chav has a reputation beyond repute chav has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 25,669.70
Bank: 49,898,405,741,907,192.00
Total Points: 49,898,405,741,932,864.00
for the times when you don't have a man - Freedom.  Cheers m8 - Manny_ate_myDog  for being a freedom fighter! - JAB5239  thanks for making me a billionaire again! cheers - Prawn Cornelius  Happy holidays bro! - led* 
Merry Christmas my brotha! - jose830  You too, bud! - yoz  thanks for the quick payment Papi! - jose830  coco pop lmao! thanks for the pics - jose830  Here's a fish in return papi! - jose830 
What's up papi! Long time Here's a burger the yank way to eat lol - jose830  and a healthy milkshake to wash it down - jose830  it has been a while geezer!!! hope your keeping good bro. - HUGH JASS  Morning C-Dog, have a brew on me. - HUGH JASS  Jesus dude,good to see around! - HughJass 
god bless you homie, lol, - Tha_Greatest  Happy New Year bro - HughJass 
Troop and Military Support - Amber Alert - Bladder Cancer - Endometriosis - Equality - Liver Cancer - Liver Disease - Missing Children - POW/MIA - Spina Bifida - Suicide - jose830 
Default

If GBP had all of their terms about testing disclosure made public so we could understand all the mechanics of their agreement with USADA I would trust them more due to their history.

VADA in fairness have a strong history in the 2 guys they have busted, they just don't have the pedigree of USADA.

At the moment, I would want both involved
Reply With Quote
chav is offline
#17
Old 02-22-2013, 03:05 AM
DoktorSleepless
DoktorWakeless
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 10,098
Rep Power: 35 DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 5,107,972,133,049.56
Bank: 0.00
Total Points: 5,107,972,133,049.56
cheers brother! - jose830  Thanks for posting that great fight - Libido Sanchez  You're the Man! - SCEN3RY  The GO-TO Medal! Given to those who report to duty! (1/20) LIMITED EDITION. - Golovkin  have a beer - sugarsmosley 
Knows his stuff - jas  Top poster - jas 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGPOPPAPUMP View Post
They stopped working with VADA because they DIDN'T TELL the promoter OR the Las Vegas Commission until it was too late to save the show. In other words, they sat on the information that Peterson tested positive for weeks, which then cost Golden Boy a lot of money in cancelling that event because the cancellation insurance does not cover financial losses due to a fighter testing positive for a banned substance. If they would have notified all parties the moment Peterson tested positive, the show would have likely been saved. Nobody wanted to face Khan on less than two weeks notice.
VADA only followed standard WADA protocol, which USADA is also supposed to follow. An athlete has the right to to test the B sample in order to confirm the positive result before he officially becomes guilty and it's made public to anyone. VADA even gave Golden Boy the option to sign a contract that would reveal to them the result of the A sample immediately without testing the B sample, but Golden Boy never signed it. Meanwhile, USADA just allowed Morales on two different occasions to have both the A and B samples test positive before informing the comission.

But you're right that they were angry for being told so late, not because they told the commission, but that was their own damn fault.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zyzz View Post
Usada is an actual Olympic testing organization.. Vada is an alternative like shasta is to coke, regardless trusting an "anti-doping" organization ran by victor Conte is like trusting a murderer on trial defended by oj simpson

The only reason usada is constantly bashes, and vada conspicuous praise all the time, is because maxboxing and all these other writers that are top rank jock sniffers look for any reason to **** on golden boy and Al Haymon fighters..
Margaret Goodman MD | President/Board Chairman
Dr. Edwin "Flip" Homansky | Vice-President/Board
Robert Cantu, MD | Board
Deborah K. Stout | Board
Angela Silva, DC | Secretary / Treasurer
Ryan Connolly | Chief Legal Counsel / Client Relations
Dr. Ron Kamm
Sharon R. Kamm, PSY.D.
http://www.vada-testing.org/index.ph...=50&Itemid=112

Nope, don't see Conte listed anywhere.

Last edited by DoktorSleepless; 02-22-2013 at 03:10 AM.
Reply With Quote
DoktorSleepless is offline
#18
Old 02-22-2013, 03:09 AM
Body Movin'
60/40 I KICK YO ASS
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Maidana's Farm
Posts: 6,898
Rep Power: 32 Body Movin' has a reputation beyond repute Body Movin' has a reputation beyond repute Body Movin' has a reputation beyond repute Body Movin' has a reputation beyond repute Body Movin' has a reputation beyond repute Body Movin' has a reputation beyond repute Body Movin' has a reputation beyond repute Body Movin' has a reputation beyond repute Body Movin' has a reputation beyond repute Body Movin' has a reputation beyond repute Body Movin' has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 1,213,251.39
Bank: 5,989,386,625,343,301.00
Total Points: 5,989,386,626,556,552.00
good work - BostonGuy  No Message - BostonGuy  floyd - BostonGuy  money mayweather - BostonGuy  I like that beer-money thing you got going there, here add this beer to it...Jersey up in here! - jose830 
No Message - BostonGuy  cheers - handwraps  what a legend - sugarsmosley  Keep schooling these cats about Maidana. Campana campana Chino Maidana. - punchr  ole ole ole ole chino chino - punchr 
Graves Disease - Lymphedema - Men's Health - Pro Choice - Prostate Cancer - Scleroderma - Thyroid Disease - Trisomy 18 - Just Now Hit Me  Adoptee - Bone Cancer - Child Exploitation and Abuse - Hope and Support - Peace - Retinoblastoma - Right to Life - Student Sexual Assault - Just Now Hit Me  Graves Disease - Lymphedema - Men's Health - Pro Choice - Prostate Cancer - Scleroderma - Thyroid Disease - Trisomy 18 - Just Now Hit Me 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by chav View Post
If GBP had all of their terms about testing disclosure made public so we could understand all the mechanics of their agreement with USADA I would trust them more due to their history.

VADA in fairness have a strong history in the 2 guys they have busted, they just don't have the pedigree of USADA.

At the moment, I would want both involved
100%
Reply With Quote
Body Movin' is offline
#19
Old 02-22-2013, 03:11 AM
josenoway
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: May 2005
Age: 45
Posts: 2,198
Rep Power: 15 josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute josenoway has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 2,100,029,101.12
Bank: 2,657,666.83
Total Points: 2,102,686,767.95
Default

Yeah, but the Morales example is problematic because it involved Clen. Even WADA struggled with similar positives like a year+ before the Morales situation and ultimately cleared athletes. Let's stop pretending like it's USADA's MO to keep testing until a negative appears, that's idiotic to even suggest that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoktorSleepless View Post
VADA only followed standard WADA protocol, which USADA is also supposed to follow. An athlete has the right to to test the B sample in order to confirm the positive result before he officially becomes guilty and it's made public. VADA even gave Golden Boy the option to sign a contract that would reveal to them the result of the A sample immediately without testing the B sample, but Golden Boy never signed it. Meanwhile, USADA just allowed Morales on two different occasions to have both the A and B samples test positive before informing the comission.

But you're right that they were angry for being told so late, not because they told the commission, but that was their own damn fault.


Margaret Goodman MD | President/Board Chairman
Dr. Edwin "Flip" Homansky | Vice-President/Board
Robert Cantu, MD | Board
Deborah K. Stout | Board
Angela Silva, DC | Secretary / Treasurer
Ryan Connolly | Chief Legal Counsel / Client Relations
Dr. Ron Kamm
Sharon R. Kamm, PSY.D.
http://www.vada-testing.org/index.ph...=50&Itemid=112

Nope, don't see Conte listed anywhere.
Reply With Quote
josenoway is offline
#20
Old 02-22-2013, 03:18 AM
DoktorSleepless
DoktorWakeless
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 10,098
Rep Power: 35 DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute DoktorSleepless has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 5,107,972,133,049.56
Bank: 0.00
Total Points: 5,107,972,133,049.56
cheers brother! - jose830  Thanks for posting that great fight - Libido Sanchez  You're the Man! - SCEN3RY  The GO-TO Medal! Given to those who report to duty! (1/20) LIMITED EDITION. - Golovkin  have a beer - sugarsmosley 
Knows his stuff - jas  Top poster - jas 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by josenoway View Post
Yeah, but the Morales example is problematic because it involved Clen. Even WADA struggled with similar positives like a year+ before the Morales situation and ultimately cleared athletes. Let's stop pretending like it's USADA's MO to keep testing until a negative appears, that's idiotic to even suggest that.
It shouldn't matter. USADA should have given the results to the commission after the first B sample was tested and let commission decide. USADA shouldn't decide for themselves if Morales is guilty before informing the commission.

Also, it seems USADA's only obligation is to Golden Boy. Nowhere in the USADA contracts does it even mention the athletic commissions.
http://www.maxboxing.com/news/max-bo...ement-part-one
Quote:
Perhaps it is found in the fact that in no clause, rule or any other place found in several Master Agreement contracts obtained by Maxboxing.com, between Golden Boy Promotions and the United States Anti-Doping Agency regarding anti-doping testing for their fighters are the words ***8220;State Athletic Commission***8221; used. No variation of those words is used. It would appear, after careful perusal of these varied versions of the same Master Agreement, that this alliance between Golden Boy and USADA potentially takes the commission completely out of the loop.

Last edited by DoktorSleepless; 02-22-2013 at 03:29 AM.
Reply With Quote
DoktorSleepless is offline
Reply

Share This With Friends

Tags
trustworthy , usada , vada

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Privacy Policy - Submit News - Feedback - Site Map - Advertise with Us

Copyright 2003-2014 BoxingScene LLC All rights reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:50 AM.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.