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#11
Old 12-31-2012, 10:32 AM
raskat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-MiZe View Post
I used to think you were knowledgeable, looks like you don't have the slightest clue. BoxRec does this to a lot of people, makes them look like idiots. Seek information elsewhere.
well, first of all, I read tons of boxing books, and I really mean TONS OF. So I do consider myself knowledgeable enough to talk boxing with pretty much ANYONE on this site here.
check out the first 100 opponents of Jimmy Wilde:
http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?hum...boxer&pageID=2
I know boxrec posts some things that are not true, but the records of boxers are mostly correct.
So look at the records of Wilde's first 100 opponents and then tell me he was beating world class guys. Almost EVERYBODY of them had a losing record and less than 5 pro fights.
this is the typical Jimmy Wilde opponent:
http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?hum...3727&cat=boxer
this guy fought Wilde 4 times, and nobody else...
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#12
Old 12-31-2012, 10:50 AM
D-MiZe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raskat View Post
well, first of all, I read tons of boxing books, and I really mean TONS OF. So I do consider myself knowledgeable enough to talk boxing with pretty much ANYONE on this site here.
check out the first 100 opponents of Jimmy Wilde:
http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?hum...boxer&pageID=2
I know boxrec posts some things that are not true, but the records of boxers are mostly correct.
So look at the records of Wilde's first 100 opponents and then tell me he was beating world class guys. Almost EVERYBODY of them had a losing record and less than 5 pro fights.
Those records are incomplete, as are most of BoxRec's records from those dates. In fact, most of Wilde's record is incomplete. He says himself that he had 800 fights and although this may be exaggerated he certainly had more than the 150 listed on BoxRec.

He lost 3 times in his career.

He was recovering from the flu when he fought Tancy Lee the first time and it showed, still he lasted 17 rounds. In the rematch Wilde proved his greatness outclassing and stopping Lee in 11. The others coming at the tail-end of his career against 2 great fighters and way out of his prime, still he looked good.

Wilde's well known for his power but this shouldn't mask his excellent boxing skills and counter punching ability. Wilde's not a lock for the greatest flyweight, I have no qualms there - how'd you rank them?
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#13
Old 12-31-2012, 11:04 AM
raskat
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Originally Posted by D-MiZe View Post
Those records are incomplete, as are most of BoxRec's records from those dates. In fact, most of Wilde's record is incomplete. He says himself that he had 800 fights and although this may be exaggerated he certainly had more than the 150 listed on BoxRec.

He lost 3 times in his career.

He was recovering from the flu when he fought Tancy Lee the first time and it showed, still he lasted 17 rounds. In the rematch Wilde proved his greatness outclassing and stopping Lee in 11. The others coming at the tail-end of his career against 2 great fighters and way out of his prime, still he looked good.

Wilde's well known for his power but this shouldn't mask his excellent boxing skills and counter punching ability. Wilde's not a lock for the greatest flyweight, I have no qualms there - how'd you rank them?
well, it looks you got your information from wikipedia, which is known to be A LOT LESS CREDIBLE than boxrec.com
I quote you:
Quote:
BoxRec does this to a lot of people, makes them look like idiots. Seek information elsewhere.
so you go to wikipedia and repeat here quotes from Wilde's wiki page and you want to teach me on the subject of "credible sources"?
As I said, I have lots of sources, every book I read is a source. But I agree most books say Jimmy Wilde has that unbelievable winning streak of 100 wins without a loss (or whatever it was). But no matter if a few fights are missing on boxrec, do you really think the ones that are missing were against world class opponents? Know what I mean? His first 100 opponents were 99 % guys with losing records and only a few fights. So I don't think the ones that are not mentioned on his record were against better opposition.
I can't rate Wilde cause I don't know how good he was. Beating 100 of those guys doesn't tell me anything. And when Wilde did fight good opposition, he got stopped a few times and/or lost.
I can't rate him cause I don't know how good he was.

Last edited by raskat; 12-31-2012 at 11:06 AM.
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#14
Old 12-31-2012, 11:13 AM
SBleeder
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Originally Posted by raskat View Post
well, it looks you got your information from wikipedia, which is known to be A LOT LESS CREDIBLE than boxrec.com
I quote you:

so you go to wikipedia and repeat here quotes from Wilde's wiki page and you want to teach me on the subject of "credible sources"?
As I said, I have lots of sources, every book I read is a source. But I agree most books say Jimmy Wilde has that unbelievable winning streak of 100 wins without a loss (or whatever it was). But no matter if a few fights are missing on boxrec, do you really think the ones that are missing were against world class opponents? Know what I mean? His first 100 opponents were 99 % guys with losing records and only a few fights. So I don't think the ones that are not mentioned on his record were against better opposition.
I can't rate Wilde cause I don't know how good he was. Beating 100 of those guys doesn't tell me anything. And when Wilde did fight good opposition, he got stopped a few times and/or lost.
I can't rate him cause I don't know how good he was.
There's footage of Wilde. That tells us a lot more about him than simply looking at his Boxrec page and scanning his opponents' win-loss records.
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#15
Old 12-31-2012, 11:14 AM
D-MiZe
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How have I gone to Wikipedia?

It's widely known that Wilde fought from anywhere in between 500 to a 1000 times. Do you honestly believe the English flyweight belt was contested between Wilde and a guy making his debut?

Like I said, most of the records are incomplete. I don't think the flyweight division was even recognized in America until 1915. Gene Tunney said 'He is the greatest fighter I ever saw'.

No shame in his losses to a great bantamweight in Herman and the same could be said about Villa, both fights taken well out of his prime.
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#16
Old 12-31-2012, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by TartanSoldier View Post
Wales is in Great Britain.

As is Scotland, and England.
Oops. I knew that.

Scotland, Wales, and England are "Great Britain", and Northern Ireland is the other piece of the "United Kingdom". Correct?
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#17
Old 12-31-2012, 11:21 AM
D-MiZe
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Originally Posted by SBleeder View Post
Oops. I knew that.

Scotland, Wales, and England are "Great Britain", and Northern Ireland is the other piece of the "United Kingdom". Correct?
Ze full title is 'The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland'.

The UK encompasses all of the above countries, GB all excluding Northern Ireland.
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#18
Old 12-31-2012, 11:39 AM
raskat
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well, there are only a few minutes of footage available of Wilde. Parts of 3 fights (2 of those fights did Wilde lose -Pancho Villa and Tancy Lee)
So, I still cannot rate him and I don't have to. He has his place in boxing history and I have my own opinion about him which is that I cannot rate him for all the reasons I mentioned. I don't belittle him, I am sure he was one hell of a fighter, I am just saying his record looks as the most padded I have ever seen.
When Cesar Chavez Senior almost won 100 fights without losing, he fought at least a few really good guys, with Wilde it is different.
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#19
Old 12-31-2012, 11:42 AM
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well, there are only a few minutes of footage available of Wilde. Parts of 3 fights (2 of those fights did Wilde lose -Pancho Villa and Tancy Lee)
So, I still cannot rate him and I don't have to. He has his place in boxing history and I have my own opinion about him which is that I cannot rate him for all the reasons I mentioned. I don't belittle him, I am sure he was one hell of a fighter, I am just saying his record looks as the most padded I have ever seen.
When Cesar Chavez Senior almost won 100 fights without losing, he fought at least a few really good guys, with Wilde it is different.
Wrong. There are quite a few full fights on video. You're going to need to dig deeper than Youtube. I have at least six or seven of his fights on VHS tapes.
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#20
Old 12-31-2012, 11:46 AM
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I thought Jimmy Wilde was from Great Britain?
american public schools ftw
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