Mayweather Mitt work all shallow?

[MrRolltide91]

this is a terrible article

[TheAuthority]

Originally Posted by deejd

Exactly. People who don't box or that aren't well-schooled wouldn't understand that style of mitt work.

Those who really understand training know that this form of pad work (i.e. Mayweather style) is flawed and normal pad work (i.e p.unching with power, sitting on punches, full rotation etc) is far superior for most occassions

I will put an argument together when I have more time outlining my thoughts on this style of pad work.

[ShoulderRoll]

If you want to work just on punching power then go hit the heavy bag. That's what it's for.

This mitt work is used to develop other attributes.

[deejd]

Originally Posted by TheAuthority

Those who really understand training know that this form of pad work (i.e. Mayweather style) is flawed and normal pad work (i.e p.unching with power, sitting on punches, full rotation etc) is far superior for most occassions

I will put an argument together when I have more time outlining my thoughts on this style of pad work.

I don't agree with your opening statement at all, but can understand about certain styles of mitt work being used on different occasions, but sure; would like to read your thoughts on it.

Originally Posted by ShoulderRoll

If you want to work just on punching power then go hit the heavy bag. That's what it's for.

This mitt work is used to develop other attributes.

If only people could comprehend that.

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

Originally Posted by deejd

It's a terrible article. That style of mitt work is specifically for counter-punching. It's not the only style they use either, I've seen them teach the basic punches and have the fighters use leverage by planting their feet, turning their hips, and turning their hands over on the punches.

The problem is that people only see the counter-punching mitt work and assume that's all that they do; that's wrong.

Along with that, I can't help but be a bit perturbed by trainers who observe that style of mitt work and bite off of it by selling dvds breaking down how to do it. If anyone should be getting paid and making dvds off of that style, it should be the Mayweather's.

Coach Rick posts a gagillion videos a day doing the Mayweather style mitt work, yet hasn't produced a single champion biting off of it... a fighter he trained got stopped on ESPN by Karim Mayfield; it's just bothersome that he's promoting somebody else's mitt work to get paid.

Originally Posted by deejd

Fair post, I can understand your viewpoint here, but to praise the article isn't a good look. The tone that writer takes is against that style of mitt work for the wrong reasons. They don't understand it and assume it's for flash.

Did you even read the entire article? Not the small part I posted, I'm talking about the link?

He never said it was bad or that it was useless. As a matter of fact he said it has it's place and can be beneficial in boxing. His take is that many trainers are using it PRIMARILY as their training tool or using it to look impressive as if they know what they are doing and don't.

I don't know who coach Rick is but that is a classic example of what I'm talking about and what the article outlines. It's not condemning that style of mitts if used in combination with the basics but there is an increasing amount of "trainers" that learn that and use that as their primary teaching tool.

Here's some more of the article that I assume you didn't bother reading.

I don’t condemn this philosophy completely, as I do believe that the Mayweather “speed-pads,” as some people call it, is the best cookie cutter mold for approaching offense and defense. The basics of Mayweather mittwork come down to a few basics (for those of you who have no clue to the mystical sleight of hand they see before them):

Catch a left hook, come back with a left hook
Weave a right hook
Shoulder roll a right hand, come back with a right hand
Roll (pull back) or catch a jab, come back with a right hand
Catch a left to body, come back with a right uppercut
Catch a right to the body, come back with a left uppercut
Pivots to stay in front of feeder

Ultimately, the Mayweather mittwork can be effective when it supplements the myriad of conventional boxing training, but don’t sell it long.

[mconstantine]

Originally Posted by ShoulderRoll

This mitt work is used to develop other attributes.

Bingo! Other attributes like reflects and instincts. I simple 1, 2, 3, duck 3, 2 combination on the mitts isn't so much about showing you how to throw hard punches but rather programming your body to almost instinctively duck after the first 3 and come back up with the 3, 2.

If you've ever fought or even just sparred, you know there is not much time to think in the ring outside of breaks in action to measure or assess your opponent. In exchanges, instincts and reflects based on vision takes over. Instincts and reflects based on VISION <<< That is what the Mayweather's style mitts works on.

[deejd]

Originally Posted by Cuauhtémoc1520

Did you even read the entire article? Not the small part I posted, I'm talking about the link?

He never said it was bad or that it was useless. As a matter of fact he said it has it's place and can be beneficial in boxing. His take is that many trainers are using it PRIMARILY as their training tool or using it to look impressive as if they know what they are doing and don't.

I don't know who coach Rick is but that is a classic example of what I'm talking about and what the article outlines. It's not condemning that style of mitts if used in combination with the basics but there is an increasing amount of "trainers" that learn that and use that as their primary teaching tool.

Here's some more of the article that I assume you didn't bother reading.

I did read the article, and again, because I made a mistake giving you the benefit of the doubt, the tone that the writer takes is quite reluctant to the idea of that specific mitt work. To downplay it by saying it's used for speed and flash is wrong.

Do trainers use it to show off, I don't believe it for a second. A trainer has to be able to comprehend what they're teaching the fighter. Do the fighters think they're legit because they're doing it; of course.

The writer claims it's just paddy-cake work; do you think it's paddy-cake work? Pretty sure I've seen Mayweather, Mickie Bey, Jessie Vargas, and a host of others load up on some of those counters when doing the drill.

Here are some other action words the writer uses to describe the mitt work:

- Chimpmunk quick mitt work (didn't even use commas where needed)
- paddy-cake-paddy-work
- Touching
- Cookie cutter
- Choreography

The mere fact that the writer resides in that it's choreographed is the worst part. There's a difference between remembering which counter to throw and something being choreographed. A ballet is choreographed, synchronized swimming is choreographed, a theatrical production is choreographed; when a fan at the gym requests a triple hook, and Mayweather is obliged to do so, or when Roger says "catch" or "roll" and Mayweather reacts, that's not choreography. Even Jr. has talked to Roger during the mitt work and told him what he wants to see more of [i.e. shots to the body to work on upper cuts, see pad work for Cotto media day].

Are you starting to comprehend what I mean. He can take shots at all the trainers he wants to, but he's essential trying to shoot down that style of mitt work. Nothing wrong with supporting the basics... but it's wild how the basics haven't worked against Mayweather yet his pull counters, check hooks, and lead rights rolling under seem to do the trick every time.

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

Originally Posted by deejd

I did read the article, and again, because I made a mistake giving you the benefit of the doubt, the tone that the writer takes is quite reluctant to the idea of that specific mitt work. To downplay it by saying it's used for speed and flash is wrong.

He didn't only say that is was all flash, if you said you actually read the piece you would understand that yet you keep repeating something that is clearly false. He talks about both sides of it and even talks about how it's great for counter work and muscle memory of those counters.

Do trainers use it to show off, I don't believe it for a second. A trainer has to be able to comprehend what they're teaching the fighter. Do the fighters think they're legit because they're doing it; of course.

If you think that trainers don't use it to show off, then you either haven't been in enough gyms or are taking this way to personal for some other reason. I PERSONALLY have seen it used just for that, showing off. Again, I am not against it, I just think it needs to be used in conjunction with proper and fundamental technique. Not as the sole usage of the mitts.

The writer claims it's just paddy-cake work; do you think it's paddy-cake work? Pretty sure I've seen Mayweather, Mickie Bey, Jessie Vargas, and a host of others load up on some of those counters when doing the drill.

Again, I said it has it's purpose. I think it's great for hand eye coordination, learning the basic counters and good cardio work.

Here are some other action words the writer uses to describe the mitt work:

- Chimpmunk quick mitt work (didn't even use commas where needed)
- paddy-cake-paddy-work
- Touching
- Cookie cutter
- Choreography

The mere fact that the writer resides in that it's choreographed is the worst part. There's a difference between remembering which counter to throw and something being choreographed. A ballet is choreographed, synchronized swimming is choreographed, a theatrical production is choreographed; when a fan at the gym requests a triple hook, and Mayweather is obliged to do so, or when Roger says "catch" or "roll" and Mayweather reacts, that's not choreography. Even Jr. has talked to Roger during the mitt work and told him what he wants to see more of [i.e. shots to the body to work on upper cuts, see pad work for Cotto media day].

Well it is choreographed, in that there is no doubt. Not saying that Roger doexn't mix in different commands, but Floyd knows what to throw after what is thrown at him. There's nothing wrong with that but it's not like Roger is just throwing an array of shots and Floyd doesn't know what is coming at him.

Are you starting to comprehend what I mean. He can take shots at all the trainers he wants to, but he's essential trying to shoot down that style of mitt work. Nothing wrong with supporting the basics... but it's wild how the basics haven't worked against Mayweather yet his pull counters, check hooks, and lead rights rolling under seem to do the trick every time.

Because Mayweather has had success, isn't something you need as evidence for the way they use the mitts. Mayweather is a GREAT fighter, one of the best of all times. If you watch Mayweather in his amateur career and in his early pro career, he wasn't fighting with his lead hand down either. He's been properly schooled, make no mistake about it. Using the Mayweather style mitts has it's place, but again as the writer put, it shouldn't be used as the primary tool and style to teach in boxing. I think that's his only point and yet you took it and ran with it. It's just a conversation and nothing to get all upset about. I personally don't use that style but have nothing against those who do as long as they are teaching the fundamentals.

[DIB42]

Originally Posted by ShoulderRoll

The Mayweathers know what they are doing but there are copy cats all over YouTube who obviously don't.

Well said...

[707puncher]

I agree with copycat trainers not knowing **** about mitt work, specifically how Floyd and Roger do it.

Floyd has been boxing his entire life, he has the fundamentals of boxing down like brushing his teeth. The mitt work he does, maintains his reflexes, timing, and defense, which is a staple of Floyds boxing style. Its what makes his timing, head movement and overall defense more superior than most. He doesnt have to rely on throwing a million punches a round, because his connection percentage/ accuracy is high.

Problem with copycat trainers is that they try scripting the Mayweather mitt routine without ever getting the fundamentals down to perfection. So now the boxer has picked up bad habits because they are trying to bite more than they can chew.