Bookmark Website  | Free Registration  | The Team
Boxing Champions |  Boxing Schedule |  Boxing Video  |  Boxing History   |  Pound For Pound  | Lounge  | The Wire |  Audio  | Arcade

Navigation
Go Back   Boxing Forum > Boxing Forums > Boxing History
Reply
Thread Navigation

#121
Old 01-08-2013, 12:35 AM
THE REED™
Most Definitely
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Erie, PA
Posts: 57,957
Rep Power: 200000 THE REED™ has a reputation beyond reputeTHE REED™ has a reputation beyond reputeTHE REED™ has a reputation beyond reputeTHE REED™ has a reputation beyond reputeTHE REED™ has a reputation beyond reputeTHE REED™ has a reputation beyond reputeTHE REED™ has a reputation beyond reputeTHE REED™ has a reputation beyond reputeTHE REED™ has a reputation beyond reputeTHE REED™ has a reputation beyond reputeTHE REED™ has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 1,023,946,768,601.52
Bank: 989,465,790,356,858,752.00
Total Points: 989,466,814,303,627,520.00
For being so BOSS! - komodo Straight up G! - komodo Thanks man :hail: - komodo Top man! - komodo BOSS - komodo 
Good talking boxing sir - Atreyu Khalil 50k Posts - Unknown Champ for the Super 50,000 post... - jose830 Congrats on 50K solid KO's.. - !! AI-Holmes!! 50k Posts - BulgariasFinest 
50,000 - TBear Super Mod! Congrats on 50k Reed :D - Bossy 50K - -Mustang- 50k, congrats bro - MELLY-MEL... can't be touched. - Body Movin' 
Happy holidays bro! - led* Happy Birthday champ! - LoadedWraps Congrats on engagement! - Spacey1991 your daughter is adorable, Bless her :fing02: - -jose- is good to put a face to the name THE REED™ even doe you look nothing how I expected lol...I'll give you an 8.5 out of 10...good luck with your future wife :usa2: - -jose- 
Troop and Military Support - Amber Alert - Bladder Cancer - Endometriosis - Equality - Liver Cancer - Liver Disease - Missing Children - POW/MIA - Spina Bifida - Suicide - BattlingNelson Myasthenia Gravis - Ovarian Cancer - Sexual Assault - Substance Abuse - mangler World Trade Center Victims and Heroes - Fireworks Safety - dans01234 AIDS/HIV - DARE - DUI Awareness - Epidermolysis Bullosa - Heart Disease - Lymphoma - MADD - Substance Abuse - !! AI-Holmes!! Arthritis - Child Abuse - Colon Cancer - Colorectal Cancer - Dystonia - Education - Free Speech - Interstitial Cystitis - ME/CFIDS - Reye's Syndrome - Save the Music - Teens Against Smoking - Victim's Rights - Water Quality - S a m u r a i 
Aphasia - Asthma/Allergies - Brain Cancer - Brain Tumors - Diabetes - Mental Illness - S a m u r a i Anti-Tobacco - Colon Cancer - Colorectal Cancer - S a m u r a i Cultural Diversity - Hunger - Leukemia - Lupus - Melanoma - Racial Tolerance - Reflex Sympathetic Dystrophy Syndrome - Self Injury - mangler AIDS/HIV - DARE - DUI Awareness - Epidermolysis Bullosa - Heart Disease - Lymphoma - MADD - Substance Abuse - -veteran420- Head and Neck Cancer - Dominicano Soy! 
Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - Makavelli Alzheimer's - Crohn's & Colitis - Cystic Fibrosis - Domestic Violence - Fibromyalgia - Leimyosarcoma - Lupus - Makavelli Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - jazluvr Arthritis - Child Abuse - Colon Cancer - Colorectal Cancer - Dystonia - Education - Free Speech - Interstitial Cystitis - ME/CFIDS - Reye's Syndrome - Save the Music - Teens Against Smoking - Victim's Rights - Water Quality - jazluvr Alzheimer's - Crohn's & Colitis - Cystic Fibrosis - Domestic Violence - Fibromyalgia - Leimyosarcoma - Lupus - QUELOQUE 
Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - Freedom Fighter Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - Dorian.. Children with Disabilities - Parkinson's Disease - VACTERL - Young Onset Parkinson's Association - iBreakbeat Adoptee - Bone Cancer - Child Exploitation and Abuse - Hope and Support - Peace - Retinoblastoma - Right to Life - Student Sexual Assault - Dorian Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - Atreyu Khalil 
Default

Sup wmute..
Reply With Quote
THE REED™ is offline
Advertisements
>>>TO REMOVE THESE ADS, PLEASE REGISTER HERE FOR FREE<<<
#122
Old 01-08-2013, 02:04 AM
wmute
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 8,037
Rep Power: 31 wmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 197,713.10
Bank: 14,828,039,655.72
Total Points: 14,828,237,368.82
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by THE REED™ View Post
Sup wmute..
sup reed! will pm you now
Reply With Quote
wmute is offline
#123
Old 01-08-2013, 06:05 PM
joseph5620
undisputed
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Calabasas, Calif
Posts: 5,821
Rep Power: 20 joseph5620 has a reputation beyond reputejoseph5620 has a reputation beyond reputejoseph5620 has a reputation beyond reputejoseph5620 has a reputation beyond reputejoseph5620 has a reputation beyond reputejoseph5620 has a reputation beyond reputejoseph5620 has a reputation beyond reputejoseph5620 has a reputation beyond reputejoseph5620 has a reputation beyond reputejoseph5620 has a reputation beyond reputejoseph5620 has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 12,043,005,116,762.71
Bank: 1,207,599,303,087.43
Total Points: 13,250,604,419,850.14
a knowledgeable poster - Carnivore Great Poster! - Barnburner I would say you have the IQ of a rodent. But that would be an insult to the rodent.. - Unknown Champ quality posts - Stokely 
Arthritis - Child Abuse - Colon Cancer - Colorectal Cancer - Dystonia - Education - Free Speech - Interstitial Cystitis - ME/CFIDS - Reye's Syndrome - Save the Music - Teens Against Smoking - Victim's Rights - Water Quality - JAB5239 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wmute View Post
Fighters learn by doing and Hopkins did not have 1 mln am bouts, but f-ck numbers and arguments...

just watch Hopkins at the time (pick the first Marcado fight or some other guy, i think everything is on yt now) and watch Hopkins against Echols or Johnson (first ones coming to my mind). You don't see any improvement, not even in positioning and accuracy? or in his ability to constantly foul without getting caught?

Obviously Jones speed, movement and IQ would have always been a nightmare, and Jones improved too (to a lesser extent, as he was more experienced and had a style which relied more on physicality). IMO no way Hopkins would get the W until Jones is past it, but that does not mean that Hopkins 93 is the same as Hopkins 98-2000.
Maybe not, but Hopkins went unbeaten for a very long period of time after his fight with Jones. I have a hard time believing that he became a completely different fighter after the Jones fight. He may have improved but it doesn't take away the fact that Jones beat a great fighter that night.
Reply With Quote
joseph5620 is offline
#124
Old 01-09-2013, 03:23 AM
wmute
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 8,037
Rep Power: 31 wmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 197,713.10
Bank: 14,828,039,655.72
Total Points: 14,828,237,368.82
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by joseph5620 View Post
Maybe not, but Hopkins went unbeaten for a very long period of time after his fight with Jones. I have a hard time believing that he became a completely different fighter after the Jones fight. He may have improved but it doesn't take away the fact that Jones beat a great fighter that night.
and did I ever say otherwise?
Reply With Quote
wmute is offline
#125
Old 01-09-2013, 03:50 AM
SCtrojansbaby
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,859
Blog Entries: 2
Rep Power: 16 SCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 30,290,747.96
Bank: 0.00
Total Points: 30,290,747.96
No Message - Toney616 Happy New Year - Freedom. Happy Christmas amigo - chav 
Gay and Lesbian Pride - poet682006 Gay and Lesbian Pride - jazluvr 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wmute View Post
Fighters learn by doing and Hopkins did not have 1 mln am bouts, but f-ck numbers and arguments...

just watch Hopkins at the time (pick the first Marcado fight or some other guy, i think everything is on yt now) and watch Hopkins against Echols or Johnson (first ones coming to my mind). You don't see any improvement, not even in positioning and accuracy? or in his ability to constantly foul without getting caught?

Obviously Jones speed, movement and IQ would have always been a nightmare, and Jones improved too (to a lesser extent, as he was more experienced and had a style which relied more on physicality). IMO no way Hopkins would get the W until Jones is past it, but that does not mean that Hopkins 93 is the same as Hopkins 98-2000.
Hopkins was 28
had 23 pro fights
3rd full year as a pro
and most importantly Hopkins didn't lose again for 12 years after fighting Roy.

You can't just arbitrarily say when someone improved. Sure if they fought and Hopkins was 20 years old and in his 11th pro fight you can say he definitely improved. If he was losing to scrubs at the time you can say he improved. If he got a new trainer maybe you can say he improved. None of those things are the case. You are correct that Hopkins style changed though

1990-2001 - B-Hop was an aggressive KO artist

2001-2005 - super cautious counter puncher

2006-present - light heavyweight who likes to maul guys on the inside

3 different styles but still an equally good fighter

Last edited by SCtrojansbaby; 01-09-2013 at 04:23 AM.
Reply With Quote
SCtrojansbaby is offline
#126
Old 01-09-2013, 05:36 AM
wmute
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 8,037
Rep Power: 31 wmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond reputewmute has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 197,713.10
Bank: 14,828,039,655.72
Total Points: 14,828,237,368.82
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SCtrojansbaby View Post
Hopkins was 28
had 23 pro fights
3rd full year as a pro
and most importantly Hopkins didn't lose again for 12 years after fighting Roy.

You can't just arbitrarily say when someone improved. Sure if they fought and Hopkins was 20 years old and in his 11th pro fight you can say he definitely improved. If he was losing to scrubs at the time you can say he improved. If he got a new trainer maybe you can say he improved. None of those things are the case. You are correct that Hopkins style changed though

1990-2001 - B-Hop was an aggressive KO artist

2001-2005 - super cautious counter puncher

2006-present - light heavyweight who likes to maul guys on the inside

3 different styles but still an equally good fighter
Hopkins kept improving until 97 more or less. In 2003-04 he starts declining. You just need to watch the fights. If you do not see that, get yourself a better pair of glasses.
Reply With Quote
wmute is offline
#127
Old 05-21-2013, 05:19 PM
fight_professor
Flowers in my hair!
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,695
Rep Power: 23 fight_professor has a reputation beyond reputefight_professor has a reputation beyond reputefight_professor has a reputation beyond reputefight_professor has a reputation beyond reputefight_professor has a reputation beyond reputefight_professor has a reputation beyond reputefight_professor has a reputation beyond reputefight_professor has a reputation beyond reputefight_professor has a reputation beyond reputefight_professor has a reputation beyond reputefight_professor has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 100,922,353,123.65
Bank: 17,258,155,509,487.34
Total Points: 17,359,077,862,610.99
Happy 4K :wave: - Bossy :wave: - Bossy No Message - Bossy No Message - Bossy No Message - Bossy 
Over 5000. - TartanSoldier Congrats on 5K solid KO's.. - !! AI-Holmes!! Happy holidays bro! - led* some gifts for you. they're all out of the good ones right now. - RossCA No Message - RossCA 
No Message - RossCA No Message - RossCA happy birthday - jose830 To many more. - Sweet Pea 50 6000 post! - jose830 
Happy 6K! - Oasis_Lad Six..............Thousand! - Barnburner 7000 post :fing02: - -jose- Khan's Army - Box-Office 
Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - Sox8055 Emphysema - Lung Cancer - Lung Disease - Multiple Sclerosis - ??? Childhood Cancer - Grand Champ Alzheimer's - Crohn's &amp; Colitis - Cystic Fibrosis - Domestic Violence - Fibromyalgia - Leimyosarcoma - Lupus - RossCA Autism - RossCA 
Default

Related question combining my 2 threads, P4P, do you reckon prime RJJ > prime Floyd Mayweather?
Reply With Quote
fight_professor is offline
#128
Old 05-21-2013, 06:39 PM
SCtrojansbaby
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,859
Blog Entries: 2
Rep Power: 16 SCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 30,290,747.96
Bank: 0.00
Total Points: 30,290,747.96
No Message - Toney616 Happy New Year - Freedom. Happy Christmas amigo - chav 
Gay and Lesbian Pride - poet682006 Gay and Lesbian Pride - jazluvr 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fight_professor View Post
Related question combining my 2 threads, P4P, do you reckon prime RJJ > prime Floyd Mayweather?
Yes not even close
Reply With Quote
SCtrojansbaby is offline
#129
Old 05-21-2013, 10:40 PM
CHEECH
Contender
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 262
Rep Power: 2 CHEECH has a spectacular aura aboutCHEECH has a spectacular aura aboutCHEECH has a spectacular aura about
Points: 5,956.44
Bank: 0.00
Total Points: 5,956.44
Default

jones in his prime was 175. not as unhittable as Floyd but far more destructive. check the one shot body punch stop of virgil hill n the slaughter of griffin. also the beating laid on telesco. as to the original question, at 160 jones was wicked fast as he always was but he was just barely good enough to outpoint a very raw Hopkins. Hopkins had a steady improvement thru his career. put it this way, the Hopkins who wore down john david Jackson was a far better fighter than the Hopkins who faced jones. the Hopkins who hypnotized echols n outstrategized tito woulda been even money with jones. so jones at 160 wasn't at his peak either and no he wasn't so fast that nobody could beat him at that weight. Gerald McClellan had beaten jones in the amateurs and nigel benn was a mf at 160. there's 2 rightthere woulda given jones all he could handle at 160. at 175 jones makes the top 5s n 10s of history but at middle he hadn't peak yet so he is not ranked as high
Reply With Quote
CHEECH is offline
#130
Old 05-22-2013, 01:49 AM
SCtrojansbaby
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,859
Blog Entries: 2
Rep Power: 16 SCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond reputeSCtrojansbaby has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 30,290,747.96
Bank: 0.00
Total Points: 30,290,747.96
No Message - Toney616 Happy New Year - Freedom. Happy Christmas amigo - chav 
Gay and Lesbian Pride - poet682006 Gay and Lesbian Pride - jazluvr 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CHEECH View Post
jones in his prime was 175. not as unhittable as Floyd but far more destructive. check the one shot body punch stop of virgil hill n the slaughter of griffin. also the beating laid on telesco. as to the original question, at 160 jones was wicked fast as he always was but he was just barely good enough to outpoint a very raw Hopkins. Hopkins had a steady improvement thru his career. put it this way, the Hopkins who wore down john david Jackson was a far better fighter than the Hopkins who faced jones. the Hopkins who hypnotized echols n outstrategized tito woulda been even money with jones. so jones at 160 wasn't at his peak either and no he wasn't so fast that nobody could beat him at that weight. Gerald McClellan had beaten jones in the amateurs and nigel benn was a mf at 160. there's 2 rightthere woulda given jones all he could handle at 160. at 175 jones makes the top 5s n 10s of history but at middle he hadn't peak yet so he is not ranked as high
1. Roy won 8-5 and was in danger
2. It is a complete myth that Hopkins was raw when he fought Jones

Last edited by SCtrojansbaby; 05-22-2013 at 01:52 AM.
Reply With Quote
SCtrojansbaby is offline
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
anyone?, beaten, fast

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Privacy Policy - Submit News - Feedback - Site Map - Advertise with Us

Copyright © 2003-2013 BoxingScene LLC All rights reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:59 AM.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.