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#11
Old 12-19-2012, 01:53 PM
hectari
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Originally Posted by 110110110 View Post
Let me guess you have never boxed ?

Boxing is at least 90% mental, I have beaten up big strong, vastly fysical superior men inside the rops, just because the diddent have the mental part in them.
Exactly, its a reason why strong fighters like Jean Pascal suk in the ring they lack the mental game, so does Zab Judah, these guys are probably the most explosive boxers but they don't have the ring IQ or focus to help them adapt so they get lost and in Zab's case he quits when he can't get to you.
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#12
Old 12-19-2012, 01:58 PM
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Originally Posted by hectari View Post
I think Pacquiao should have gotten with someone who is more of an all around trainer like Joe Goossen who trains fighters in So California, Goossen would have been a great trainer for Manny, he is offensive minded but also teaches his boxers how to cut off the ring and how to use the ring.

He trained Casamayor, Diego Corrales, Michael Nunn, and many others.
Fair enough, I do see what you're saying btw.

Khan KO, Pacquiao KO and Chavez orbital bone broken does not make good reading for Roach in 2012.

He'll be hoping 2013 is a better year.
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#13
Old 12-19-2012, 02:02 PM
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Fair enough, I do see what you're saying btw.

Khan KO, Pacquiao KO and Chavez orbital bone broken does not make good reading for Roach in 2012.

He'll be hoping 2013 is a better year.
Roach just needs to be humble again is all. He seems to have gotten a big head and stopped studying new strategies or fight tape. People who've trained there said he has a publicist and agent now, and acts all hollywood and is unapproachable since 24.7.

Roach used to study fight tapes with his boxers, he doesn't do it anymore because he is busy going to nice restaurants with his girlfriend and going to sleep.

I think if Roach doesn;t have the energy to train all these guys he needs to bring in an assistant trainer who is a good defensive strategies.
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#14
Old 12-19-2012, 02:09 PM
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With success comes downfall but just because Pac lost doesn't mean he needs to be sheeted on now, for majority of the time he was successful with his fighters, I do agree though that they win and lose together so he also deserve some criticism in that respect.
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#15
Old 12-19-2012, 04:51 PM
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Chavez Jr. was simply facing a superior opponent in Martinez. A big step up in class.

Khan is simply a dumb fighter lacking in many areas of boxing. Probably Roach should have trained Khan to be more defensive, but I doubt it would matter.
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#16
Old 12-19-2012, 05:12 PM
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#17
Old 12-19-2012, 06:35 PM
hectari
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With success comes downfall but just because Pac lost doesn't mean he needs to be sheeted on now, for majority of the time he was successful with his fighters, I do agree though that they win and lose together so he also deserve some criticism in that respect.
Not really sh1tting on Roach, but there is no denying Roach is the one sh1tting on everyone and talking the most crap, his head got filled with hot air.

Roach used to be cool when he was that silent humble guy you saw in Pac's corner, strict, and no nonsense. Now he acts like a celebrity too good for anyone and too busy to even study tapes, he basically let Pacquiao train himself for the past two fights.

Roach is overrated to put it bluntly
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#18
Old 12-19-2012, 06:36 PM
hectari
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Chavez Jr. was simply facing a superior opponent in Martinez. A big step up in class.

Khan is simply a dumb fighter lacking in many areas of boxing. Probably Roach should have trained Khan to be more defensive, but I doubt it would matter.
How can he train something he doesn't know?
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#19
Old 12-20-2012, 03:23 AM
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Wow! Pretty strong comment on Freddy Roach. My personal view is they (Pacquiao and Roach) had a good plan during the early part of the fight. E.g. Pacquiao varied the range of his leads by often dropping them short to the end of the range than stepped back just so he would have time to counters Marquez's counter lead. than tried to follow up if Marquez off balance. It worked really well most time until he got KOed. The long overhand right which dropped Pacquiao in the 3rd round was just a miscalculation of range. Similar slipped of concentraton from Marquez when he threw that lazy jab which intercepted by Pacquiao with a well timed left cross. The little stutter step (feint than follow with long jab and left cross) lead which got intercepted by Marquez and put him to sleep, worked well against everyone else from De La Hoya and even Marquez himself during the other fights. It also worked during the earlier part in the 4th fight. But that time, Marquez's back was close to the rope and he would fight back with all his got if he is being pressured. So when Pacquiao did that stutter before rushing in, Marquez just threw the right hand and caught Pacquiao right on the button (sleep time lol!). But you can't really say this was a defensive flaw. If Pacquiao was guilty of anything, it was because he was the more impatience out of the two (he was looking for the knock out and got paid the prize). Marquez was more disciplined methodical. After he dropped Pacquaio with that long overhand right, it was a minute before the round finished. He threw only about 25 punches, but mostly defensive jabs and only started to throw power punches when Pacquiao pressured him towards the end of the round. He stuck to his game plan even after he got Pacquiao in trouble. On the other hand after Pacquiao put Marquez on 8 counts with that short left crossed, it was about 1min 40 secs before the end of the round. Pacquiao threw nearly 80 punches, most were bad intention power shots. I can't speak on behalf of the other fighters but you don't need to be a rocket sciencetist to know that the most important thing in a camp is for the fighter to feel comfortable with his coach. And Freddy Roach is no spring chicken. He's experience and helped som many boxers win titles. Which shows the quality of the man (Pacquiao). He never blamed anyone but himself. Just as he didn't blame the judges or anyone after the fight with Bradly, when most people thought he won it convinciingly. Just an outside view from outside USA

Last edited by Live2box; 12-20-2012 at 03:29 AM.
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