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#21
Old 11-24-2012, 08:34 AM
Doctor_Tenma
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aztec Wanker View Post
No.

This guy conned everyone into thinking he's great. Fighting Pacquiao every couple of years with some EZ, tailor-made fights in between does not equal greatness.

Excluding Pac...MAB, Casamayor, Kats, and Diaz are his best official wins. That is not an ATG resume IMO.

Barrera's last hurrah was in '06 when he was going life and death with Rocky Juarez. He didn't do anything relevant after that.

Casamayor previously had received a gift with a bow on top in the Santa Cruz fight. He looked terrible and clearly lost. He also was coming off a yearlong layoff and fighting Corrales 3x, Castillo, Freitas, prime Nate Campbell. His body was DONE.

Diaz, good win, probably JMM's best official win. Diaz was a good fighter but was basically a full time LAW student when they fought. Still a good win.

It pains me to say it but Kats is just a journeyman. He's EZ to hit and comes right at you, tailor-made for JMM. It was a stay busy fight for Pacquiao III.

JMM also has wins over Juarez, Gainer, Peden, and Salido (NOW you can say it's a good win). Mediocre.

This is a good resume, maybe even a HOF, but ATG, LEGEND? GTFO. This con artist owes his entire career and life to one man, Manny Pacquiao. Without him, his legacy is ****. He is not greater than Barrera, Morales, or even Castillo. Not a chance. Those guys fought the best at their best. This guy took EZ fights and followed Pac around like a psycho ex-gf.
Don't agree with the whole conned part, but we're pretty much on the same page when it comes to the opposition, he could have done better for himself as oppose constantly chasing Manny and taking care of tunes up while doing so, Ramos and Fenchenko to name a few. The Diaz rematch served no purpose as well, I would have liked him to face credible opponents. Guerrero, Rios were there for the waiting, the 140 pound division is still stacked, Bradley is still there as well so maybe he can put in more work before he retires, I hope so.
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#22
Old 11-24-2012, 08:36 AM
dibzvincent143
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He has an ATG skills for sure. and he's an ATG for me. but depends on who you'll ask because marquez instead of fighting and continue beating this solid names at 140 he continued to chase pac and sometimes cab drivers. yes he will be forever be pac's kryptonite prime to prime. and he will be remembered for that. but he didnt do enough lately which I believed he could've because of his superior skills. he wouldve KOed khan and the other good guys. danny too. too bad he also chased the mayweather shot..
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#23
Old 11-24-2012, 08:38 AM
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yes, piss drinker is an atg
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#24
Old 11-24-2012, 09:03 AM
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ATG? No. HOF? Yes. Marquez problem is that outside of Pacquiao his resume is norhing impressive and he whent life and death with face first brawlers like Diaz and Katsidis. Also if you look at his las 10 fights is just garbage for a guy of his caliber.
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#25
Old 11-24-2012, 09:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aztec Wanker View Post
No.

This guy conned everyone into thinking he's great. Fighting Pacquiao every couple of years with some EZ, tailor-made fights in between does not equal greatness.

Excluding Pac...MAB, Casamayor, Kats, and Diaz are his best official wins. That is not an ATG resume IMO.

Barrera's last hurrah was in '06 when he was going life and death with Rocky Juarez. He didn't do anything relevant after that.

Casamayor previously had received a gift with a bow on top in the Santa Cruz fight. He looked terrible and clearly lost. He also was coming off a yearlong layoff and fighting Corrales 3x, Castillo, Freitas, prime Nate Campbell. His body was DONE.

Diaz, good win, probably JMM's best official win. Diaz was a good fighter but was basically a full time LAW student when they fought. Still a good win.

It pains me to say it but Kats is just a journeyman. He's EZ to hit and comes right at you, tailor-made for JMM. It was a stay busy fight for Pacquiao III.

JMM also has wins over Juarez, Gainer, Peden, and Salido (NOW you can say it's a good win). Mediocre.

This is a good resume, maybe even a HOF, but ATG, LEGEND? GTFO. This con artist owes his entire career and life to one man, Manny Pacquiao. Without him, his legacy is ****. He is not greater than Barrera, Morales, or even Castillo. Not a chance. Those guys fought the best at their best. This guy took EZ fights and followed Pac around like a psycho ex-gf.


Hard to argue with this post. Maybe if he beats Pac on December.
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#26
Old 11-24-2012, 09:15 AM
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imo, JMM could be competitive and a champ in any era. is his resume good? yes. is he an excellent fighter who can adapt? hell yes!!

ATG? most definitely!

obviously the pac fans will say he is one of the best ATG who ever lived, for obvious reasons, but those who actually appreciate boxing for the sport, not for one man, most will say he is an ATG as well, because he is...
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#27
Old 11-24-2012, 09:22 AM
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I don't think so. People claim Floyd and Pacquiao cherry pick, yet they rate JMM right beside them

Pac's best wins:
Magarito, JMM, Cotto, Mosley, Bradley (YES), De La Hoya, Hatton, Clottey, Barrera (2x), Morales (x2), Ledwaba

Mayweather's best wins:
Cotto, Mosley, Corrales, Castillo, JMM, De La Hoya, Gatti

While JMM's best wins are:
Katsidis, Diaz, Casamayor, Barrera, Salido

So these so called cherry pickers (I dont think Pacquiao or Mayweather are cherry pickers) both has faced MUUUUCH better opposition than Marquez has, so I wonder why he is rated as highly as them, people often even rate him over Pacquiao which is absurd.
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#28
Old 11-24-2012, 09:34 AM
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Subjective question that requires objective answer. I say borderline ATG but.. and that's a big BUT... if he beats pac convincingly in the 4th fight then he becomes an ATG.
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#29
Old 11-24-2012, 09:37 AM
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The fairest way to gauge whether ATG is to take Pac off of his resume. Does it stand alone without his losses to Pac included?

People may think JMM is borderline and cant quite make up their mind. But if you then include how he nearly beat Pac 3 times, then yes i have no problem with him being ATG.

But clearly JMM is clearly doing less than Pac and dont get called up on it in between fighting Pac. JMM is allowed to fight no names boxers, but everyone seems to forgive him if he fights Pac again. Pacs' JMMs mealticket, whereas JMM for Pac is a cherry pic. Double standards.

Last edited by hugh grant; 11-24-2012 at 09:40 AM.
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#30
Old 11-24-2012, 10:40 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aztec Wanker View Post
No.

This guy conned everyone into thinking he's great. Fighting Pacquiao every couple of years with some EZ, tailor-made fights in between does not equal greatness.

Excluding Pac...MAB, Casamayor, Kats, and Diaz are his best official wins. That is not an ATG resume IMO.

Barrera's last hurrah was in '06 when he was going life and death with Rocky Juarez. He didn't do anything relevant after that.

Casamayor previously had received a gift with a bow on top in the Santa Cruz fight. He looked terrible and clearly lost. He also was coming off a yearlong layoff and fighting Corrales 3x, Castillo, Freitas, prime Nate Campbell. His body was DONE.

Diaz, good win, probably JMM's best official win. Diaz was a good fighter but was basically a full time LAW student when they fought. Still a good win.

It pains me to say it but Kats is just a journeyman. He's EZ to hit and comes right at you, tailor-made for JMM. It was a stay busy fight for Pacquiao III.

JMM also has wins over Juarez, Gainer, Peden, and Salido (NOW you can say it's a good win). Mediocre.

This is a good resume, maybe even a HOF, but ATG, LEGEND? GTFO. This con artist owes his entire career and life to one man, Manny Pacquiao. Without him, his legacy is ****. He is not greater than Barrera, Morales, or even Castillo. Not a chance. Those guys fought the best at their best. This guy took EZ fights and followed Pac around like a psycho ex-gf.
Cold truth here!! I like Marquez anyway though he's more an ATF (alltimefavorite) to me.....
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