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#31
Old 11-02-2012, 08:58 AM
kadyo
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Thanks, mate. Reminds me of Lennon's lyrics.


"I saw a film today oh, boy
The English army had just won the war
A crowd of people turned away
But I just had to look
Having read the book
I'd love to turn you on."
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#32
Old 11-02-2012, 09:04 AM
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i think you've got to be in some 'i don't give a phuck anymore' type of anguish because, like bringer said, it takes massive nuts to do this to yourself regardless of the cards you're dealt in the game of life.
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#33
Old 11-02-2012, 09:47 AM
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I think every person should have the right to end his/her life.
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#34
Old 11-02-2012, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Timothy Horton View Post
i think you've got to be in some 'i don't give a phuck anymore' type of anguish because, like bringer said, it takes massive nuts to do this to yourself regardless of the cards you're dealt in the game of life.
You commit the act coz of anguish? It takes guts to not care about primitive instinct? Suicide is courageous act not cowardice.

Btw, I remember my 15 year old neighbor, who seems like he is having identity crisis, thought that suicide is cool because his fellow band member did it. He said the suicide letter is poetic because life is an art and so is death.
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#35
Old 11-02-2012, 09:58 AM
Virgil Caine
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Originally Posted by The_Bringer View Post
Weak my ass.

It takes brass balls to knowingly end your life. Anybody who would say otherwise has never known someone who's done the deed, or contemplated it, themselves.

People do commit suicide over trivial issues like relationship drama and whatnot every day, but that doesn't change the fact that the act itself takes an immense amount of courage the likes of which most of us would never be able to muster.
You're right. But, it is a form of irrational courage, all the same.

I would never kill myself. But, I have been on the phone, not suicidal mind you, but just depressed and drunk, saying something like: "I don't have the courage to kill myself, so I just drink like crazy" (I was speaking Japanese). I was being irrational though, and the girl I was talking to sort of called me out on it. (Again in Japanese), she asked me: "when are you thinking this kind of thing? When you are feeling very good? Or when you are feeling down?".

I wasn't actually suicidal at this time. In fact, I've never been suicidal. But it's a lie if I say I've never contemplated the possibility.

I will say though, the main case in which I have contemplated suicide was while studying for the entrance exams to the graduate school at my Japanese university. The **** is no joke. They need to change the system here. It is responsible for suicides among Japanese (I mean nationwide).

I did have a friend who killed herself. I understand that part of your post as well. Don't feel like commenting on that.
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#36
Old 11-02-2012, 10:01 AM
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You can't just say they are weak.. It must have been a very hard life for them to be thinking of suicide in the first place..
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#37
Old 11-02-2012, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by The_Bringer View Post
All human beings know what survival means. It's in our DNA. Self preservation is the strongest of all motivating factors for human beings. People who commit suicide simply don't give a sh*t about such primitive desires for survival. They're fully aware of it, they just don't care anymore.

Which is why the decision to commit suicide is, in my eyes, a ballsy move. I might even argue a noble move given our own species' blatantly obvious disregard for population control.
I disagree with noble.

I think that it is usually an irrational act.

It does take bravery. Unless you are under the influence of drugs or something, in which case your senses might be dulled.

It may be a very brave act, if you are say sacrificing yourself for someone else. But it is mostly just a selfish act, which is a reflection of a loss of hope in oneself and a false belief that you have no friends or loved ones left in the world.
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#38
Old 11-02-2012, 10:08 AM
kadyo
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Originally Posted by Nodogoshi View Post
You're right. But, it is a form of irrational courage, all the same.

I would never kill myself. But, I have been on the phone, not suicidal mind you, but just depressed and drunk, saying something like: "I don't have the courage to kill myself, so I just drink like crazy" (I was speaking Japanese). I was being irrational though, and the girl I was talking to sort of called me out on it. (Again in Japanese), she asked me: "when are you thinking this kind of thing? When you are feeling very good? Or when you are feeling down?".

I wasn't actually suicidal at this time. In fact, I've never been suicidal. But it's a lie if I say I've never contemplated the possibility.

I will say though, the main case in which I have contemplated suicide was while studying for the entrance exams to the graduate school at my Japanese university. The **** is no joke. They need to change the system here. It is responsible for suicides among Japanese (I mean nationwide).

I did have a friend who killed herself. I understand that part of your post as well. Don't feel like commenting on that.
I was thinking of bringing this up earlier today, Nogo. I have read in readers digest a long time ago about the high suicide rate among japanese students who failed entrance exams in Japan's prestigious universities.

I wonder what's happening now.
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#39
Old 11-02-2012, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Uncle Kadyo View Post
Animals also commit suicide.

Tarsiers have been known to intentionally injure or kill themselves due to unhappiness or stress of being in an enclosure. Because of this reason they are not in zoos. In captivity, the tarsier can be so extremely distressed it may die of psychological trauma and have even been reported to smash their heads against objects resulting in fatality.


http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Do_any_ani...commit_suicide
Can't vouch for the truth of this, but it is compelling if true.

Quote:
Are bears purposely committing suicide to protest the horror of bile farms?
Bears held captive in bile farms often go on hunger strikes, their only means of escape from the conditions.


From animal experimentation to factory farming, humans have done some horrible things to other animals. Few practices are as cruel, though, as bear bile farming.

The practice is so barbaric that bears kept in captivity for bile harvesting are often driven mad by the poor living conditions and cruelty of the process. Now reports have surfaced that some bile bears may be performing hunger strikes and committing suicide as a last respite to protest the cruel conditions they're kept under, according to Wildlife Extra.

Consider wildlife campaigner Louis Ng's visit to a Laotian bile farm in 2009. There he encountered a female bear lying motionless in a cage. The owner of the farm explained to Ng that the bear was refusing food and was starving herself to death. This kind of behavior was not uncommon, he explained. This bear was on the 10th day of her "hunger strike" and had been left outside, likely dry of bile, to meet her inevitable end.

After a few minutes sitting with the bear and mourning her fleeting life, Ng watched as her paw limply reached out from a hole in the cage toward his hand, as if she wanted to hold it. Filled with emotion, Ng gave it to her. They sat there, hand in paw, for several minutes. Ng described her eyes as filled with both anguish and gentleness. It was a moment he would never forget.

The bear succumbed the following day.

Tragically, this bear's story is just one of many. Around 12,000 bears are currently estimated to populate bile farms across Southeast Asia. It's all done in the name of traditional Chinese medicine, for which bear bile is believed to be an essential ingredient.

The typical bile farm holds its bears in extraction cages sometimes called "crush cages" which measure about 2.6 feet by 4.2 feet by 6.5 feet. For animals as large as Asiatic black bears, the species most often harvested for bile, these dimensions can make it impossible to stand up or even roll over. The lack of movement is convenient for farmers, since it allows them easier access to the bear's abdomen, where the bile can be extracted.

"The bile is removed from the bear by inserting a catheter tube through a permanent incision in the abdomen and gall bladder," explained Ng. "Sometimes a permanently implanted metal tube is used."

Needless to say, the process is extremely painful for the bears. Bile is typically tubed from the gall bladder at least twice a day. Often the solitude, pain and fear will drive bears to madness. According to Ng, the dominant sound inside a bile farm is a banging noise bears slamming their own heads against the cages.

Other bears have been known to chew off their own limbs. One incident in China saw a mother bear escape from her cage, run over and strangle her cub to death, then kill herself by intentionally running into a wall.

These tragedies are difficult to hear, but for some people they may raise further questions. For instance, is it really possible that these animals are capable of consciously and purposely killing themselves, as Ng's encounter might suggest? Might they even be doing it as an act of protest?

Scientists warn of anthropomorphizing animal behavior, but such attributions do have comparisons elsewhere in the animal kingdom. For instance, whales are known to beach themselves, and a few scientists have postulated that some of these beachings demonstrate suicidal behavior. Stories also abound of dogs and horses killing themselves to escape maltreatment. Ric O'Barry, former dolphin trainer and current animal activist, has claimed to have witnessed a depressed, captive dolphin named Kathy willingly commit suicide in his arms.

Although no one can say for sure what goes on inside another animal's head, these tragedies resonate. Regardless of whether the bear suicides were intended as protest or not, they are waking people up to the horror of bile farming.

For instance, Ng is currently setting up a five-hectare bear rescue center in Laos. Not only will the bears be rescued, but they will also be put through a rehabilitation process that will help adapt them to a community something they've never experienced on the bile farms.

It's just a first step, but for all the bears who have never stepped foot outside of a crush cage, it's a big one.
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Old 11-02-2012, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Isaac Hunt View Post
Given the right circumstances and the right stimuli anyone can be broken down. Ending your own life is not an easy thing to do.
I have known 2 people personally who have committed suicide, one who used to take LSD and dropped an electric heater into a bath while bathing. He was a really nice guy but had a messed up background. He was a very gentle caring person. It shocked me when it happened but then I reflected on his life story and it kind of made sense. He was born into a family where he had 3 ultra religious older spinster sisters in their 20s who lived with their mother who was single and they all hated men and said sex was dirty. The father was an alcoholic who abondoned the elder sisters as a kid but he turned up one day 20 years later spent the night and slept with the mother and left in the morning never to be seen again and poor Phil was born into that. When he broke up with his girlfriend who ended up sleeping with and leaving him fo his best friend he finished himself off.
The other guy I knew who committed suicide was property dealer who had 56 houses in good areas in London in places like Islington,Stoke Newington,Clapham,Balham, Brixton and Notting Hill. It was around 1990 in the last recession and the banks went for him and he was getting wiped out. He jumped out of a window. Each one of those houses would be worth over a a Million pounds now but the banks pulled the rug on him and forced sales at fractions of what the houses were worth. He went from being worth millions to nothing overnight and it was too much for him. He was a very clever gutsy guy that took a lot of financial risks. Risks that would be beyond what most of us would cope with but that is how he accumulated his fortune but when the recession hit he was over leveraged and the banks were ruthless.He hit the bottle and jumped out the window holding a glass of alcohol.
More British soldiers who were in the Falklands war have committed suicide after the war than were killed in it. These were tough guys and can no way be described as mentally weak. You will see the same kind of pattern with returning veterans from places like Iraq and Afghanistan.
The suicide rate among current or formerly active military in these wars is off the charts, in fact. Just look it up.
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