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#11
Old 10-09-2012, 12:07 PM
shade darkar
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just another trainer to me.
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#12
Old 10-09-2012, 12:10 PM
1270
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Originally Posted by kokingbill View Post
hahaha dont even get me started on Angel Garcia. That guy has no business within 1000 ft. of a boxing ring, even with his son.
Father and son teams come down to emotional bond more than anything. Will Garcia improve as a fighter if he stays with his dad the rest of his career? Yes, through general experience of more fights and if hes receptive enough, he'll learn from his mistakes. Can the father bring anything to the table? Motivation I would say, but probably nothing from a technical standpoint.
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#13
Old 10-09-2012, 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted by 1270 View Post
Father and son teams come down to emotional bond more than anything. Will Garcia improve as a fighter if he stays with his dad the rest of his career? Yes, through general experience of more fights and if hes receptive enough, he'll learn from his mistakes. Can the father bring anything to the table? Motivation I would say, but probably nothing from a technical standpoint.
Sometimes the bold is what is really need by a person on the team. Ali and Ray Leonard both said Dundee was really just a motivator and not trainer/teacher that people thought he was.
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#14
Old 10-09-2012, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by kokingbill View Post
hahaha dont even get me started on Angel Garcia. That guy has no business within 1000 ft. of a boxing ring, even with his son.
The guy is a clown, but he got his son to the big show.
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#15
Old 10-09-2012, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted by kokingbill View Post
On the other side of the spectrum, im not saying only muhammad ali, mayweather, leonard, pacquiao, tyson, or chavez are qualified to train fighters. There is definitely something to be said for some credibility. I dont care if you were the worst professional fighter or veteran amateur in the history of the sport. I understand that a lot of guys know what is supposed to be done, but dont have the skill/athleticism to make their own bodies do it. I wouldnt follow a leader into combat whos only experience was they are a big fan of war movies, nor would I hire a doctor to take care of me who didnt go to med school. Its just that simple.
Those have to be the dumbest comparisons ever in this place. How about a doctor who went through med school, knows everything about medicine but just never practiced or a soldier who went through boot camp, knows military tactics but has never seen combat.

Those would be more accurate comparisons. While they can't tell you about first hand experience, they can teach another soldier or med student everything they need to know to become a doctor or soldier.
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#16
Old 10-09-2012, 05:00 PM
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Originally Posted by tredh View Post
Sometimes the bold is what is really need by a person on the team. Ali and Ray Leonard both said Dundee was really just a motivator and not trainer/teacher that people thought he was.
Boxing is mostly a mental thing I suppose. The likes of Ali and Ray Leonard and Floyd today, all so naturally gifted I think with them kind of fighters it comes down to 'feeling good'. I like Garcia and his dad and hope they do well in the game.
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#17
Old 10-09-2012, 08:56 PM
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We'll find out in due time about Virgil Hunter, but some of the greatest trainers ever didn't box.

I've never bought into the "if you didn't play/fight you don't know," argument for any sport. Some of the greatest trainers in boxing, greatest coaches and personnel people in the NFL or NBA or MLB, never played the sport.
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#18
Old 10-10-2012, 08:04 AM
kokingbill
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Originally Posted by bojangles1987 View Post
We'll find out in due time about Virgil Hunter, but some of the greatest trainers ever didn't box.

I've never bought into the "if you didn't play/fight you don't know," argument for any sport. Some of the greatest trainers in boxing, greatest coaches and personnel people in the NFL or NBA or MLB, never played the sport.
I know you are right about how those guys are viewed, but it just comes down to credibility among the athletes they coach. Sure the media/press/fans put those guys up on a pedestal because they probably wish the same for themselves somewhere subconsciously. What do the athletes think? Already in this thread theres been examples of guys like Dundee not actually knowing that much as advertised.
I dont feel like I have any business showing up at a basketball court and showing the kids how to play. Ya, I watch it on TV sometimes and shoot around for fun. I even played on a team as a kid, but never really competitively. Theres way less at stake in a basketabll game than there is in a boxing match. I dont really have a problem personally with Virgil Hunter, but the whole premise of any guy becoming a guru of somekind with out actually having done anything is absurd. Hey, I never picked up a violin in my life---but I'll teach you how to be the next yo yo ma/ world famous virtuoso performer. It is as absurd a claim in boxing.
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#19
Old 10-10-2012, 08:07 AM
kokingbill
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There would be more a-holes who dont know crap about violins hanging around music conservatories trying to manage young violinists if there was as much money/glamour/exposure/prestige/fame as there is in boxing and thats the bottom line.
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#20
Old 10-10-2012, 08:17 AM
bojangles1987
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kokingbill View Post
I know you are right about how those guys are viewed, but it just comes down to credibility among the athletes they coach. Sure the media/press/fans put those guys up on a pedestal because they probably wish the same for themselves somewhere subconsciously. What do the athletes think? Already in this thread theres been examples of guys like Dundee not actually knowing that much as advertised.
I dont feel like I have any business showing up at a basketball court and showing the kids how to play. Ya, I watch it on TV sometimes and shoot around for fun. I even played on a team as a kid, but never really competitively. Theres way less at stake in a basketabll game than there is in a boxing match. I dont really have a problem personally with Virgil Hunter, but the whole premise of any guy becoming a guru of somekind with out actually having done anything is absurd. Hey, I never picked up a violin in my life---but I'll teach you how to be the next yo yo ma/ world famous virtuoso performer. It is as absurd a claim in boxing.
If an athlete won't listen to a coach for no reason other than, "You never played," no matter how proven it is that the coach is one of the best in the sport, than that athlete is probably too closed minded to every be a success in the sport.

I can't say you are wrong to wonder, but I think there are enough examples throughout many sports that you don't have to play or fight to be a good trainer/coach.
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