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#11
Old 10-09-2012, 12:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxingwizard View Post
Well Chad switched trainers eight times in his career and you wonder why his skills are declining. Andre Ward as great as he is, has only had one trainer and that's Virigil Hill. Bernard Hopkins has had the same team practically throughout his whole career. Any boxer that goes through multiple coaches won't look the same.

Chad peaked in 2007 when he was with Floyd Sr and then fired him just two weeks before his next fight. I think that's the reason why Floyd Sr is still pissed at Dawson. His next fight against Glen Johnson, he didn't look the same.

The other problem is Scully, Scully is not a bad trainer, but Chad hired him at the wrong time. Scully does not have a lot of experience training boxers in championship fights, and the last time he trained Dawson was in 2005. Do you want a trainer like that preparing you against Hopkins and Ward? Of course not, but Chad made that DUMB decision to fire Steward. Had Chad stuck with Steward he would have looked much better against Hopkins. I think the only two trainers that can make Dawson a complete boxer is Floyd Sr and Steward. Maybe Scully if he learns from his mistakes.

And you saw in the Hopkins fight, that Chad looked different, he wasn't using his height and reach to create distance, he was head hunting. When was the last time you saw Dawson head hunting? He was bending his knees not fighting tall, which made him vulnerable to knock downs. He was almost knocked down twice from Hopkins for doing that ****.

Well changing trainers so often can also spell how truly unfocused Chad has become. Was he searching for a guy who could find that magic, or just looking for something that was broken in someone else? Sometimes it is the fighter themselves that is broken. 8 trainers tells a story. It tells me Chad lost his way, was distracted and kept blaming everyone but himself.
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#12
Old 10-09-2012, 01:27 AM
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#13
Old 10-09-2012, 11:25 AM
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That 9 pounds in 2 days more than likely did him in. For instance, let's compare Oscar and Dawson coming down a division. Oscar, on 24/7, I believe was 149 a week before the fight, he was still drained and there's no denying that, but he attempted to come down gradually and that may have been the reason his legs never went wobbly nor did he get dropped (i think him rehyrdating so little is because he over trained and his body never recovered thus using and burning all nutrients fed to his body before he began to gain weight). Dawson on the other hand is the younger guy by far, and he was facing an opponent that many would consider pfp a lesser puncher than pacquiao and yet he was dropped three times. To say Dawson wasn't drained, makes very little sense to me.

Quote:
“You don’t have to be knocked unconscious to suffer a concussion,” Dr. Goodman says. “That’s one reason a ring doctor evaluates each fighter immediately after every fight. There’s only one thing to do if a fighter is dazed in the gym. You take him to an emergency room or a comparable facility with similarly skilled doctors to be evaluated immediately. And you keep him there for a while after he has been examined so he can be observed by trained professionals.”

“There are no studies that I’m aware of on this point,” Dr. Goodman continues. “But my educated guess is that, more often than not when a fighter dies in a fight, it comes after he was hurt in the gym. If someone suffers a concussion, even a minor concussion, and is hit in the head again a week or two afterward, the damage can be additive, permanent, and even life-threatening. If a fighter is knocked out in a fight, he isn’t allowed to take punishment to the head for at least forty-five days. You can’t have a different safety standard for a fighter who suffers head trauma in the gym. And you certainly can’t have a bunch of lay people in the fighter’s camp saying, ‘It’s okay; he can still fight.’ That’s a recipe for disaster.”
that's a very interesting point.
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#14
Old 10-09-2012, 12:04 PM
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Finally some thoughts about the most important point: What to do if a fighter gets hurt in sparring.

Apparently there is no rules and it's up to the team to do what they feel neccessary. Apparently Dawson's team didn't do anything. If it was just a flash KD as they say I might understand. If it was indeed a real KO it is borderline negligence. .... no. Not borderline. It is negligence.

What really happened we probably will never know. We have team dawson saying it was a flash KD. Miranda's team says it was a KO. Both sides have a bias to say what they do.

There was also tweets from another sparringpartner who I forgot the name of, stating that Dawson was getting beat up all the time in sparring. If that is true and a KO happened we might have seen a fatality.

Here's to hoping for fighers trainers and managers to accept their responsibility. For Scully to say that he'd never do anything but tell the fighter that he looks great if the fighter says that himself is not good enough. The fighter will almost always say that. That's the way they are bred and brought up.


Thanks for posting TS.
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#15
Old 10-09-2012, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Boxingwizard View Post
I've been following Dawson since 2006, I was a big fan when he beat Eric Harding, I thought he was the best prospect I've ever seen. Eight months later he would beat Adamek for the wbc lhw title.

The reason why Chad was outlcassed was a combination of factors. One being Ward really good, two was the weight-loss, and three Chad's skills are declining because of constantly switching trainers.

There was a lot of odd things going into the fight Ward/Dawson fight. Why did Chad except all of Ward's demands including a low-pay, and why take a huge risk in the first place? If Chad was truly confident he can beat Ward, he would fought Ward at 175, it didn't make sense to fight him at 168.

And Scully is wrong, if a boxer is not 100% physically for a fight you cancel the fight or you let the media know about it. I know Freddie gets criticized a lot, but at least he's not a yes man. Pacquiao is a mega star but Freddie is always advising Pacquiao what to do in preparation for his next fight.


You right about that,you see the problem is Dawson wanted a yes man which is why he left Mayweather senior.And Dawson sure got what he wished for.And a lot of people agree that Dawson looked his best when he was with Mayweather senior.Mayweather senior said before the Dawson/Ward fight that Dawson should not be going down to 168.And Senior picked Ward to win also.

Dawson would probably still be undefeated if he was still with Senior cause Senior don`t beat around the bush and he`s the type that would light a fire up under a fighters a$$.
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#16
Old 10-09-2012, 11:31 PM
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You have to understand why I say what I say...if the fight is looming and someone outside of the camp (media, fans, friends) asks how he feels NO trainer on earth will say anything other than something positive...things happen before EVERY fight so it is a waste of time for a reporter to call me the week of the fight and ask how the fighter feels, how does he look, whats the game plan, etc. And its very easy for outsiders to sit there still not knowing the full story and say what "should" have been done when certain situations arose in camp...remember, hindsight is ALWAYS 20/20... And I am always on this board and try to be as respectful as possible but u cant honestly expect to be an outsider knowing 10 pct of the full picture and say what should have been done, what YOU would do, etc. Its nice to speculate and also to lay out a scenario of ur own that makes u look like a genius, etc but, again, its something u really cannot play armchair QB with. PS; if any of u saw the clip of Miguel telling what happened and if u knew his issues with someone in our camp-then u can CLEARLY see his alterior motives behind what he implied.
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#17
Old 10-09-2012, 11:58 PM
Frank Ducketts
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ICEMAN JOHN SCULLY View Post
You have to understand why I say what I say...if the fight is looming and someone outside of the camp (media, fans, friends) asks how he feels NO trainer on earth will say anything other than something positive...things happen before EVERY fight so it is a waste of time for a reporter to call me the week of the fight and ask how the fighter feels, how does he look, whats the game plan, etc. And its very easy for outsiders to sit there still not knowing the full story and say what "should" have been done when certain situations arose in camp...remember, hindsight is ALWAYS 20/20... And I am always on this board and try to be as respectful as possible but u cant honestly expect to be an outsider knowing 10 pct of the full picture and say what should have been done, what YOU would do, etc. Its nice to speculate and also to lay out a scenario of ur own that makes u look like a genius, etc but, again, its something u really cannot play armchair QB with. PS; if any of u saw the clip of Miguel telling what happened and if u knew his issues with someone in our camp-then u can CLEARLY see his alterior motives behind what he implied.
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#18
Old 10-10-2012, 12:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ICEMAN JOHN SCULLY View Post
You have to understand why I say what I say...if the fight is looming and someone outside of the camp (media, fans, friends) asks how he feels NO trainer on earth will say anything other than something positive...things happen before EVERY fight so it is a waste of time for a reporter to call me the week of the fight and ask how the fighter feels, how does he look, whats the game plan, etc. And its very easy for outsiders to sit there still not knowing the full story and say what "should" have been done when certain situations arose in camp...remember, hindsight is ALWAYS 20/20... And I am always on this board and try to be as respectful as possible but u cant honestly expect to be an outsider knowing 10 pct of the full picture and say what should have been done, what YOU would do, etc. Its nice to speculate and also to lay out a scenario of ur own that makes u look like a genius, etc but, again, its something u really cannot play armchair QB with. PS; if any of u saw the clip of Miguel telling what happened and if u knew his issues with someone in our camp-then u can CLEARLY see his alterior motives behind what he implied.
that's was it is. we're all guilty of it, but you make an excellent point; we weren't there, we know no more than a speck of what happened. And because of that we're not at liberty to pass judgement. I wish you luck Scully, and I look forward to you and Dawson defending your light-heavyweight belt
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