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#1
Old 08-09-2012, 01:05 AM
Mintcar923
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Default Let's transport our heavyweight ATG's into different era's and see what happens!

Let's put Marciano in the Louis era. Lets put Louis in the Marciano era. We'll put Holmes in Ali's era and vice versa. Let's have Tyson & Holyfield start off a few years later in the 90's. Lennox Lewis will be in the present Klits era. Would they all rule as well?
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#2
Old 08-09-2012, 01:42 AM
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The fact that Lewis defeated a prime Vitali at 38 years old, I think he would be able to dominate this era. That is all for now I must do some more research.
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#3
Old 08-09-2012, 06:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Mintcar923 View Post
Let's put Marciano in the Louis era. Lets put Louis in the Marciano era. We'll put Holmes in Ali's era and vice versa. Let's have Tyson & Holyfield start off a few years later in the 90's. Lennox Lewis will be in the present Klits era. Would they all rule as well?
Ok...

Marciano in the Louis era. Good fight! Lets just say that for as long as Marciano isn't fighting the Louis from Schmelling 1, he is in for a very torrid time. The old Louis in the 1950s was far from embarrassing himself when he met near prime Marciano, for six rounds or so the fight was passably even. I think that Marciano always has a chance to stop his opponent late, but I'd wager that more often than not Louis would decision Marciano or stop him on cuts. If Ezzard Charles could wreck the Rock's face.....what could Louis do?

Holmes in Ali's era: 'Overall' He'd beat everyone except Ali, and that fight would be a close 'ish' decision loss! To be fair though, Liston & Foreman would be terrifying fights for him. Norton would cause him at least as many problems as he did in 1978..........and the Frazier from Fight of the Century might well outpoint him. But given a 'best of three' against all, for me he'd come only second to Ali.

Prime Tyson & Holyfield in the 90s. Ouch!!! Prime Holyfield vs prime Lewis is always going to be a tough fight. Forget the first fight (the draw) the return showed how closely matched a prime Lewis and a post prime Holyfield actually are. Tyson for me in his absolute prime decisions Holyfield by a close margin, he is too sharp early and is lively enough over 12 rounds to avoid Holyfield's strong finish. Tyson vs prime Bowe: Megafight!!! Very tough to call, I'll say Tyson by close decision, but I may be wrong here. Prime Tyson vs Lewis? Tyson would find that chin!

Prime Lewis vs Prime Klitschkos: In a three fight series with each I'll pick Lewis to come out on top.
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#4
Old 08-09-2012, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Sugarj View Post
Ok...

Marciano in the Louis era. Good fight! Lets just say that for as long as Marciano isn't fighting the Louis from Schmelling 1, he is in for a very torrid time. The old Louis in the 1950s was far from embarrassing himself when he met near prime Marciano, for six rounds or so the fight was passably even. I think that Marciano always has a chance to stop his opponent late, but I'd wager that more often than not Louis would decision Marciano or stop him on cuts. If Ezzard Charles could wreck the Rock's face.....what could Louis do?

Holmes in Ali's era: 'Overall' He'd beat everyone except Ali, and that fight would be a close 'ish' decision loss! To be fair though, Liston & Foreman would be terrifying fights for him. Norton would cause him at least as many problems as he did in 1978..........and the Frazier from Fight of the Century might well outpoint him. But given a 'best of three' against all, for me he'd come only second to Ali.

Prime Tyson & Holyfield in the 90s. Ouch!!! Prime Holyfield vs prime Lewis is always going to be a tough fight. Forget the first fight (the draw) the return showed how closely matched a prime Lewis and a post prime Holyfield actually are. Tyson for me in his absolute prime decisions Holyfield by a close margin, he is too sharp early and is lively enough over 12 rounds to avoid Holyfield's strong finish. Tyson vs prime Bowe: Megafight!!! Very tough to call, I'll say Tyson by close decision, but I may be wrong here. Prime Tyson vs Lewis? Tyson would find that chin!

Prime Lewis vs Prime Klitschkos: In a three fight series with each I'll pick Lewis to come out on top.
I was actually thinking along the lines of if they were swapping era's rather than being an addition to them. But, this is quite fascinating, too. I suppose it's debatable being that Louis struggled with a few lesser opponents as did Marciano in their respective times. Many believe Louis lost the first Walcott fight and Marciano the first La Starza. I guess they were prone to having off nights as do virtually all fighters. Billy Conn was an excellent fighter who nearly dethroned Louis in his prime. Ezzard Charles had the perfect style to give Marciano fits being he had a good jab and all-around boxing ability. I think both would have been top-tier ATG's much the same had they swapped era's. However, Louis would not have retired as Marciano did in '56. He'd fight on a bit too long and perhaps lose to Patterson and then perhaps, Liston.

Larry Holmes had an incredible style as he was one of the most talented boxer-punchers there ever was. I believe his jab was more potent than Ali's. He also had very good lateral movement much in the same vein as Muhammad. I'd say he'd have a lot of success in the late '60's-early '70's a la Ali. His style would match up very well with Frazier and Foreman. There'd be a good chance he'd defeat a prime Foreman IMO.

The roles would be have been reversed had Holmes been washed-up when he met a young Ali in 1980. Muhammad would then rule the '80's much the same way Tyson did for about a decade. The '90's would be the second strongest era behind the '70's with Tyson, Holyfield, and Bowe. It would last until Lennox Lewis comes along and wreaks havoc on the division. The Klits would have some success but would not interfere with Lewis' reign of terror!
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#5
Old 08-10-2012, 02:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Sugarj View Post
Ok...

Marciano in the Louis era. Good fight! Lets just say that for as long as Marciano isn't fighting the Louis from Schmelling 1, he is in for a very torrid time. The old Louis in the 1950s was far from embarrassing himself when he met near prime Marciano, for six rounds or so the fight was passably even. I think that Marciano always has a chance to stop his opponent late, but I'd wager that more often than not Louis would decision Marciano or stop him on cuts. If Ezzard Charles could wreck the Rock's face.....what could Louis do?

Holmes in Ali's era: 'Overall' He'd beat everyone except Ali, and that fight would be a close 'ish' decision loss! To be fair though, Liston & Foreman would be terrifying fights for him. Norton would cause him at least as many problems as he did in 1978..........and the Frazier from Fight of the Century might well outpoint him. But given a 'best of three' against all, for me he'd come only second to Ali.

Prime Tyson & Holyfield in the 90s. Ouch!!! Prime Holyfield vs prime Lewis is always going to be a tough fight. Forget the first fight (the draw) the return showed how closely matched a prime Lewis and a post prime Holyfield actually are. Tyson for me in his absolute prime decisions Holyfield by a close margin, he is too sharp early and is lively enough over 12 rounds to avoid Holyfield's strong finish. Tyson vs prime Bowe: Megafight!!! Very tough to call, I'll say Tyson by close decision, but I may be wrong here. Prime Tyson vs Lewis? Tyson would find that chin!

Prime Lewis vs Prime Klitschkos: In a three fight series with each I'll pick Lewis to come out on top.
I agree, except I think Holyfield wins a close decision over Tyson. It would be very close though, like 7 to 5 or 7 to 4, 1 even.
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#6
Old 08-10-2012, 05:34 AM
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I agree, except I think Holyfield wins a close decision over Tyson. It would be very close though, like 7 to 5 or 7 to 4, 1 even.
It really is a close one. Prime Holyfield vs prime Tyson at heavyweight....extremely good fight on paper. I doubt it would look anything like the 1996/97 fights.
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#7
Old 08-12-2012, 03:40 AM
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It really is a close one. Prime Holyfield vs prime Tyson at heavyweight....extremely good fight on paper. I doubt it would look anything like the 1996/97 fights.
I agree, it would be way better. And I consider the first fight in 1996 to at least be a pretty good one, but if they would've fought in their primes, especially when Tyson was still training with Rooney, it could've been a classic.
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#8
Old 08-12-2012, 09:57 AM
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I agree, it would be way better. And I consider the first fight in 1996 to at least be a pretty good one, but if they would've fought in their primes, especially when Tyson was still training with Rooney, it could've been a classic.
I'd agree, in their primes a classic!

Their 1996 fight was plagued by a lot of clinches/leaning on and holding, dare I say......Holyfield was probably more guilty of this than Tyson, but it may well have contributed to his win in tiring Tyson out and stopping him developing a rhythm.

Likewise, Holyfield's headwork might have been a little 'strategic' too in 1996. In Holyfield's absolute prime 5 years earlier he tended not to clinch as much, his workrate was higher, his combinations more crisp and he was probably less likely to use the head. This might have made him in some ways less of a force in respect of a Tyson match, but the fight would have looked much prettier.

In 1996 Tyson's 12 round stamina was not really upto scratch and his head movement and combination punching were not what they were 7 or 8 years previous.

I'd have liked to see their match that was being planned for what......? 1991/92. The Tyson that met Ruddock was still pretty useful and he definitely still had his 12 round stamina, I think that match would have been very good.
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#9
Old 08-12-2012, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Sugarj View Post
Ok...

Marciano in the Louis era. Good fight! Lets just say that for as long as Marciano isn't fighting the Louis from Schmelling 1, he is in for a very torrid time. The old Louis in the 1950s was far from embarrassing himself when he met near prime Marciano, for six rounds or so the fight was passably even. I think that Marciano always has a chance to stop his opponent late, but I'd wager that more often than not Louis would decision Marciano or stop him on cuts. If Ezzard Charles could wreck the Rock's face.....what could Louis do?

Holmes in Ali's era: 'Overall' He'd beat everyone except Ali, and that fight would be a close 'ish' decision loss! To be fair though, Liston & Foreman would be terrifying fights for him. Norton would cause him at least as many problems as he did in 1978..........and the Frazier from Fight of the Century might well outpoint him. But given a 'best of three' against all, for me he'd come only second to Ali.

Prime Tyson & Holyfield in the 90s. Ouch!!! Prime Holyfield vs prime Lewis is always going to be a tough fight. Forget the first fight (the draw) the return showed how closely matched a prime Lewis and a post prime Holyfield actually are. Tyson for me in his absolute prime decisions Holyfield by a close margin, he is too sharp early and is lively enough over 12 rounds to avoid Holyfield's strong finish. Tyson vs prime Bowe: Megafight!!! Very tough to call, I'll say Tyson by close decision, but I may be wrong here. Prime Tyson vs Lewis? Tyson would find that chin!

Prime Lewis vs Prime Klitschkos: In a three fight series with each I'll pick Lewis to come out on top.
I think Louis would dominate Marciano in his prime tbh

I can't see Holmes beating Sonny Liston either and obviously not Ali.. he could be in with a chance against Foreman( a really good chance)

Prime Tyson beats Lewis /Holyfield imo

Prime Lewis easily dominates Klit era but could possibly be ko'd but beating either in a comeback
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#10
Old 08-12-2012, 02:14 PM
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Prime Norton, Ali and Frazier beat Holmes buts that's it. He beats foreman, young, lyle and quarry etc

Younger Jersey Joe, Younger Ezzard Charles and Prime Joe Louis all beat the rock.

Tyson at his prime remains dominant with Holy second to him.

And LL pretty easily dominates both K Bros IMO
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