Jose Luis Castillo underrated

[TBear]

Originally Posted by Mastrangelo

Yes, maybe I'm giving Castillo a bit too much credit for his defence, but still it was pretty good to me considering level of oppositions.
And about Tszyu it's my personal opinion that I don't expect everyone to agree with. It's close, but I rate lightweight Castillo higher than 140 Tszyu.

I don't know, Tszyu did unify all the titles and holds the claim "Undisputed" champion. Castillo had some good wins and epic battles but if you take away the first bout with Mayweather his reigns at lightweight were more exciting than spectacular IMO.

[Mastrangelo]

Originally Posted by TBear

I don't know, Tszyu did unify all the titles and holds the claim "Undisputed" champion. Castillo had some good wins and epic battles but if you take away the first bout with Mayweather his reigns at lightweight were more exciting than spectacular IMO.

Lightweight that Castillo fought in was just so much better than 140 of Tszyu.. I believe that fighter legacy is measured by fighters that he has beaten, not by titles that he won. You can take all belts in the world but what does it mean if the fighters you fought to get them are poor champions?
I'm not impressed by Tszyus record or achievements. He never beat a fighter on Johnston or Casamayor level. He's ranked higher because there was more hype around boxers that he has beaten. Castillo on the other hand has his best wins over two of the most underrated fighters of last era, thuse he's not given a credit he deserves. Other fighters that he beat are also very underrated. Lazcano was really good lightweight. Bazan could fight as well and like I said before, Ngoudjo to me was best 140 pounder not winning a belt in last decade!
You say also "take away first bout with Mayweather". But we can't take away that, we can't take away the fact that he is only man who can argue that he has beaten the best fighter of our generation.

[TBear]

Originally Posted by Mastrangelo

Lightweight that Castillo fought in was just so much better than 140 of Tszyu.. I believe that fighter legacy is measured by fighters that he has beaten, not by titles that he won. You can take all belts in the world but what does it mean if the fighters you fought to get them are poor champions?
I'm not impressed by Tszyus record or achievements. He never beat a fighter on Johnston or Casamayor level. He's ranked higher because there was more hype around boxers that he has beaten. Castillo on the other hand has his best wins over two of the most underrated fighters of last era, thuse he's not given a credit he deserves. Other fighters that he beat are also very underrated. Lazcano was really good lightweight. Bazan could fight as well and like I said before, Ngoudjo to me was best 140 pounder not winning a belt in last decade!
You say also "take away first bout with Mayweather". But we can't take away that, we can't take away the fact that he is only man who can argue that he has beaten the best fighter of our generation.

You do have some points and Lazcano and Johnston were good lightweights and my respect for Corrales is high. I do seem to remember the decision in the Ngoudjo fight being discussed in the same regard as the decision in the first Castillo-Mayweather fight was however.

[bojangles1987]

For those wondering whether Castillo is underrated or overrated, there is a poll on NSB about Castillo(from the Floyd fights) vs. Marquez(from the first Diaz fight). Last I checked 2 people thought Castillo would win, me being one of them, 12 people thought Marquez would win, and 2 thought Marquez would stop Castillo.

So as many people think Castillo would win as think Marquez would stop Jose Luis Castillo.

[Mastrangelo]

Originally Posted by TBear

You do have some points and Lazcano and Johnston were good lightweights and my respect for Corrales is high. I do seem to remember the decision in the Ngoudjo fight being discussed in the same regard as the decision in the first Castillo-Mayweather fight was however.

Fight was close like many in boxing, but it wasn't robbery or anything just like Floyd - Castillo wasn't.
I scored Castillo - Ngoudjo for Castillo, 115:113.

Originally Posted by bojangles1987

For those wondering whether Castillo is underrated or overrated, there is a poll on NSB about Castillo(from the Floyd fights) vs. Marquez(from the first Diaz fight). Last I checked 2 people thought Castillo would win, me being one of them, 12 people thought Marquez would win, and 2 thought Marquez would stop Castillo.

So as many people think Castillo would win as think Marquez would stop Jose Luis Castillo.

And me being second, so...

[raf727]

Originally Posted by Mastrangelo

Definitely! To me he's the most underrated Mexican fighter of last decade, one of my favorites as well. I saw even some people stating that Juan Diaz was better! huh...
He not only gave hell to Mayweather and Casamayor, his first fight with Floyd could've gone either way on neutral ground and his win over Joel is completely legit. Don't get me wrong, Casa was great fighter as well, I rank him even higher than Castillo and I think he was robbed against Corraless blind and should've got the decision against Freitas, but he didn't with that night against Castillo. He started well, but then fight even up in middle rounds and JL completely took control in last 3-4. If any of the scorecards was questionable, to me it's the one that had Casa winning.
Another thing is Corrales fight, he lost it but you know.. it was once in boxing history kind of come-back for Chico and also If you ask me, guy should've been disqualified when he threw mouthpice on the ring He wouldn't be able to survive if he didn't get that additional time TWICE. I truly believe that Jose knocks Diego out any other day than that one.
People also still overlook Stevie Johnston who was ... he was little but bad guys. High volume puncher, good athlethe with great defensive skills and great abilities to counter in close distance, also tough as nails. It were two great, very close fights that could've really gone either way, but results were completely legit as well. And I believe Castillo get even better later in his career.
Then there comes really good wins over Lazcano, Diaz, Bazan and also Ngoudjo who I think was the best junior welterweight of last decade that didn't win a belt.
Castillo was really great at fighting pure boxers, I mean, what aggressiv, brawler kind of fighter can argue that he beat guys like Mayweather and Casamayor, two of the smartest, trickest boxers of last decade?
He was so great at shortening up the distance, he would go low on his legs and bend in waist and then when he was close he'd just keep working, he wasn't stopping after getting hit like most of the fighters do, so even when he was getting hit, he always threw back immediately. In every clinch he'd just keep banging that body as well. Relentless. Another thing that let him do that well against Floyd and Casa was that he actually had decent counterpunching skills. You couldn't just jab at him freely like boxers can do against most of pressure fighters, he had pretty good countering right hand. His defence was also underrated considering his style, especially against single punches and when he was getting hit much it was usually when guys were following it up with combinations. When you add his height, welterweight-like size, decent speed and good punching power you have almost perfect pressure fighter.
I just love his style, technique, the way he fights, Jose Luis Castillo was great fighter and it's really ridiculous that some people are questioning his Hall of Fame status. I really believe that he was better than Kostya Tszyu who I think was inducted in his first try?

SB dropping knowledge.

[Florence52]

Also probably the best inside fighter of the lower weights after his mentor.