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Old 11-10-2005, 04:51 PM #1
VERSION1 (V1) VERSION1 (V1) is offline
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Cool prime Jim Jeffries vs prime jack johnson

who win will it have the same out come or what
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Old 11-10-2005, 06:10 PM #2
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uh,... yes.
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Old 11-10-2005, 07:37 PM #3
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Originally Posted by VERSION1 (V1)
who win will it have the same out come or what
Well, look at their records. Johnson lost his first fight to a lightweight. Well, Johnson was just a teen, so we can excuse him, but he never faced the best primed heavies during the time he held his title. The best part of his career was when he held the colored title, but even then he could still be beat.

Who was the best prime heavy Johnson ever beat? Should be an easy question, but it's surprisingly weak once you study up. At anyrate, Jeffries only had 21 fights when he retired, and he had beat black contenders Bob Armstrong and Hank Griffin in their primes. He also beat HOFer Peter Jackson, but Jackson was reported to have TB and died a few years later. Jeffrey's did beat a prime Sharkey, Corbett, and Fitz, all HOFers and drew with a prime Choynski when Jeff was just a novice.

It would take exceptional modern boxing or KO skills to beat a prime Jeff. Johnson was a good grappler, but an inconsistant boxer and lacked big KO power. He'd give Jeff a tough fight in the beginning, but as the rounds wore on Johnson would fade and be KOed. Johnson relied on his size advantage against smallish middle types. Jeff was a solid 220 lber and as strong or stronger than Johnson, negating Johnson's grappling strength.

If Johnson had just faced a few of the best when he held the title, perhaps he might have proved to be Jeff's equal. Johnson chose not to face the best.
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Old 11-10-2005, 08:40 PM #4
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i think johson wouldve ko'd that racist *****
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Old 11-11-2005, 02:09 AM #5
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Originally Posted by NextRocky
i think johson wouldve ko'd that racist *****
lol, lol, i definitely agree!
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Old 11-11-2005, 02:14 AM #6
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Whether or not he was racist, Jim Jeffries was a tough son of a ***** in the ring, a 6'2" 220 lb version of Rocky Marciano. He would fight through all kinds of hell and wear you down. Yeah he was probably the crudest of all the heavyweight champions, but also one of the strongest and most determined.

Maybe Johnson outboxes him, but he'd have to watch out for the left hook at all times. By all acounts Jeff was quick on his feet and quite an athlete. He was a powerful explosive guy at everything he did.

On the street no question in my mind that Jeffries breaks him in half. In a boxing ring I'll give the edge to Johnson, though no way does he knock out a prime Jeffries.
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Old 11-11-2005, 02:18 AM #7
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jim jeffries himself said he never could have beaten johnson, even in his prime. johnson had no trouble with jeffries. a prime jeffries would have hit him a couple more times, but johnson still would have ko'd him.
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Old 11-11-2005, 02:46 AM #8
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jim jeffries himself said he never could have beaten johnson, even in his prime. johnson had no trouble with jeffries. a prime jeffries would have hit him a couple more times, but johnson still would have ko'd him.
It's called having class. Joe Louis said the same thing about Marciano. Do you really think that a prime Louis would have gotten KO'ed by Marciano? I love the Rock but I say no way.

There is no way any of us could accurately predict what would happen, but Jeffries would do a hell of a lot better than the drained (lost 100 pounds in training) weak version that fought Johnson. To say he would have hit Johnson a "couple more times" is a bit of an understatement. There is no comparing the old sloth that fought Johnson and the well conditioned athlete who could run 100 meters in 10 seconds and ran 10-15 miles every day of training camp. No comparison at all.
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Old 11-11-2005, 09:45 PM #9
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Originally Posted by Kid Achilles
It's called having class. Joe Louis said the same thing about Marciano. Do you really think that a prime Louis would have gotten KO'ed by Marciano? I love the Rock but I say no way.

There is no way any of us could accurately predict what would happen, but Jeffries would do a hell of a lot better than the drained (lost 100 pounds in training) weak version that fought Johnson. To say he would have hit Johnson a "couple more times" is a bit of an understatement. There is no comparing the old sloth that fought Johnson and the well conditioned athlete who could run 100 meters in 10 seconds and ran 10-15 miles every day of training camp. No comparison at all.
in the 1900s and 1910s, nobody cared if you had CLASS for black fighters. everybody (whites) probably wanted him to say that he would have murdered johnson in his prime, to give themselves a false hope or false idea that their "aryanist" would have handed it to that "*****". but instead, he didn't, he told what he thought was the truth, and if he said it, he should know more than anyone what his capabilities are!
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Old 11-12-2005, 09:24 AM #10
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Originally Posted by KidBlackie
Well, look at their records. Johnson lost his first fight to a lightweight. Well, Johnson was just a teen, so we can excuse him, but he never faced the best primed heavies during the time he held his title. The best part of his career was when he held the colored title, but even then he could still be beat.

Who was the best prime heavy Johnson ever beat? Should be an easy question, but it's surprisingly weak once you study up. At anyrate, Jeffries only had 21 fights when he retired, and he had beat black contenders Bob Armstrong and Hank Griffin in their primes. He also beat HOFer Peter Jackson, but Jackson was reported to have TB and died a few years later. Jeffrey's did beat a prime Sharkey, Corbett, and Fitz, all HOFers and drew with a prime Choynski when Jeff was just a novice.

It would take exceptional modern boxing or KO skills to beat a prime Jeff. Johnson was a good grappler, but an inconsistant boxer and lacked big KO power. He'd give Jeff a tough fight in the beginning, but as the rounds wore on Johnson would fade and be KOed. Johnson relied on his size advantage against smallish middle types. Jeff was a solid 220 lber and as strong or stronger than Johnson, negating Johnson's grappling strength.

If Johnson had just faced a few of the best when he held the title, perhaps he might have proved to be Jeff's equal. Johnson chose not to face the best.
Great post!

I'm having some difficulties deciding who would win this one. I really don't know enough about Jeffries as a fighter. But from what I have been reading, he was awesome in his prime. So was Johnson.

Considering that an over-the-hill Jeffries lasted 15 rounds against a prime Johnson before his trainer stopped the fight, I'm thinking a prime Jeffries finds a way to stop Johnson.

James J. Jeffries by late stoppage.
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