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#121
Old 10-30-2011, 06:43 PM
Russian Crushin
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Originally Posted by Mr.0pal View Post
It's clear the only people regarding the Ring as an official world title is boxing fans. Promoters, however, understand that if their fighter wins a Ring title, he has not won an official world title. That's why, for example, Top Rank, did not count it for Pacquiao.
Dont forget Guinness
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#122
Old 10-30-2011, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr.0pal View Post
It's clear the only people regarding the Ring as an official world title is boxing fans. Promoters, however, understand that if their fighter wins a Ring title, he has not won an official world title. That's why, for example, Top Rank, did not count it for Pacquiao.
its not a world title.it;s "THE TITLE"
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#123
Old 10-30-2011, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr.0pal View Post
It's clear the only people regarding the Ring as an official world title is boxing fans. Promoters, however, understand that if their fighter wins a Ring title, he has not won an official world title. That's why, for example, Top Rank, did not count it for Pacquiao.
If Top Rank don't consider Pacquaio to be an 8 Division Champion then why do Top Rank events such as Pacquaio-Mosley announce him as an '8 Division Champion'?
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#124
Old 10-30-2011, 06:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Russian Crushin View Post
Dont forget Guinness
Which makes Guinness either ignorant or mere fans themselves because their not dealing with what's official. When people decide to personally "count" the Ring as an official title you're dealing with opinions.
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#125
Old 10-30-2011, 06:48 PM
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Originally Posted by HaglerSteelChin View Post
i am not defending the WBC. In fact, it was obvious that they had their hands in getting Saul Alvarez, Chavez, and Morales titles due to their linkage to Mexico.

Martinez getting stripped by the WBC for failing to fight Zbik was obviously a ploy to get Chavez an easy opponent.

Morales was suppose to fight Matthysse, yet that fight never happened as GBP probably gave him step aside money and he pretended to be injured.

The subjective part is that there are so many intangibles in determining what should be considered real champions.

THere are many times where the RIng belt which is now owned by GBP has exercised poor judgment. Pavlik flat out ducked Paul Williams with staph infections, and even missed doctor appointments, despite being idle he never had to worry about being stripped, it never happens with the lineal title.

If you want to count the WBC,WBA, IBF, and Ring/Lineal as all legit than its fine. But than sometimes you get fighters that are IBO or NABO titles that have been more active and fought better competition than some of the "legit" champions.
So why do you rely more on the "major" titles then?

The RING title is simply given to the best fighters in the division. Just look at the RING champs and tell me which doesnt belong, and then look at all of the Major titles and tell me who doesnt belong
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#126
Old 10-30-2011, 06:50 PM
Russian Crushin
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Originally Posted by Mr.0pal View Post
Which makes Guinness either ignorant or mere fans themselves because their not dealing with what's official. When people decide to personally "count" the Ring as an official title you're dealing with opinions.
Guinness is as far from ignorant as it gets
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#127
Old 10-30-2011, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Russian Crushin View Post
Stripped of what? Its a title, the lineal title. There is no mandatory defense or any of that crap

You lose the title once you retire or change weight classes.

Do you know that there hasnt been a Bantamweight lineal champ since Pinango in 1987?
So a fighter can go idle for three years and still be the "true" champion? Should a legit contender be punished for a the "true" champ refusing to fight them?

You classify Morales as a "paper" champion, which i actually agree on, but in the case of a Michael Spinks he was a paper champion as many felt he lost his rematch with Larry Holmes. Tyson won all three sanctioning belts-WBC,WBA, and IBF, he also beat Holmes who many felt had beat SPinks in the rematch. As a result, Spinks the "lineal" champ was a paper champ in many eyes. When Tyson finished him in 91 seconds he proved the Lineal title was only a paper title-- in the Spinks case.
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#128
Old 10-30-2011, 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr.0pal View Post
Which makes Guinness either ignorant or mere fans themselves because their not dealing with what's official. When people decide to personally "count" the Ring as an official title you're dealing with opinions.
But, it's not an opinion.

The Guinness Book of Records state that Pacquaio has won legit titles in 8 Weight classes.

The fact of the matter is; He has.

He has won either a Major Sactioning Bodie's title or a Lineal Title in 8 different Weight classes. Fact.

And that is all they're saying.
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#129
Old 10-30-2011, 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted by haglersteelchin View Post
so a fighter can go idle for three years and still be the "true" champion? Should a legit contender be punished for a the "true" champ refusing to fight them?

You classify morales as a "paper" champion, which i actually agree on, but in the case of a michael spinks he was a paper champion as many felt he lost his rematch with larry holmes. Tyson won all three sanctioning belts-wbc,wba, and ibf, he also beat holmes who many felt had beat spinks in the rematch. As a result, spinks the "lineal" champ was a paper champ in many eyes. When tyson finished him in 91 seconds he proved the lineal title was only a paper title-- in the spinks case.
spinks"offically" beat holmes 2 times..so what others think doesnt matter..we was the lineal champion
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#130
Old 10-30-2011, 06:58 PM
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Originally Posted by HaglerSteelChin View Post
So a fighter can go idle for three years and still be the "true" champion? Should a legit contender be punished for a the "true" champ refusing to fight them?

You classify Morales as a "paper" champion, which i actually agree on, but in the case of a Michael Spinks he was a paper champion as many felt he lost his rematch with Larry Holmes. Tyson won all three sanctioning belts-WBC,WBA, and IBF, he also beat Holmes who many felt had beat SPinks in the rematch. As a result, Spinks the "lineal" champ was a paper champ in many eyes. When Tyson finished him in 91 seconds he proved the Lineal title was only a paper title-- in the Spinks case.
If you're idle for three years the Lineage will be vacated.

If you're Idle for 3 years the chances are you have taken a short retirement anyway.

Micheal Spinks offically won the fight with Larry Holmes thus was still the Lineal Champion. And that's a fact.

Whether or not he deserved to be or was worthy at that point is another story. But the fact is, he was the Lineal Champion thus the Champion.

And what does the fact he was destroyed in less than 2 minutes have to do with him being the Lineal Champion?

The Lineal Champion could be knocked out with a single punch. It still doesn't change the fact they are the Champion.
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