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#1
Old 09-20-2011, 02:31 PM
dan_cov
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Default Be honest...

lets have a proper debate regarding Manny Pacquaio, without calling each other silly playground names. I am willing to listen to all sides & mainly want the following questions answered.

I am not slating Manny, I think he's a very good fighter but I want answers as to how so many people think Manny can beat Floyd. (I personally can't see how)

A/ I have noticed Manny has improved his right hand a lot in recent years but do you not think though he is fast that his straight left is often very predictable? When out of range he literally throws himself forward, would he get away with that against Floyd? I mean if Marquez was able to make him pay & stunned/rocked/hurt him several times, I'm positive Floyd can.

B/ Do you not find Manny is rather 1-D? by that I mean he has one style, throws the same combinations over & over again. Do you think for 1 second Floyds going to be a sitting duck & not counter the **** out of him?
(After seeing the 4 rounds with Ortiz & against Shane, I have no doubt in my mind he can stand & trade with Pac if he wanted)
Again not saying they are Pacquaio but these guys are both a lot bigger, they're fast & hit just as hard.


He rarely throws feints, neglects his jab, with the height & reach disadvantage - How can he expect to land these combinations without these crucial assets?



Parry - jab over the top, steps in with the straight left = It might work against static fighters such as Clottey but Floyd is the most intelligent boxer to ever live.

Once he flicks that right out, you know damn well the lefts coming behind it 99% of the time - Ortiz is no Pac but look at the ease he countered him with & Ortiz is no slouch.

Though he lost Cotto had some great success & didn't let Pac get into a rhythm for most of the first half of the fight. If you let him unless you are an absolute world class counter puncher like Marquez the chances are he is winning every exchange.


That is why Floyds so hated because he is so great at adapting, effortlessly. If somebody has it can you upload the video of him sparring please (Paul Spadafora, I think). He starts mimicking fighters, shouting their names out & then whopping his sparring partner in a certain fighters style. He does James Toney, Winky Wright, Ali, it's ****ing amazing & pretty funny actually.


I just see a beatable fighter against a guy with zero weaknesses. I'm not sure I could give him as much as a punchers chance at 147.
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#2
Old 09-20-2011, 02:41 PM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PEANUT LIKACHU View Post
I don't think manny can outbox mayweather. Mayweather can also take a punch. But Mayweather is more stationary now, that might work against or for manny because he wont have to chase mayweather. but mayweather will also land his precision shots right down the pipe.

The most feasable outcome is a UD win for Mayweather.


The more of them both I see the more & more I think Manny gets stopped.
People will laugh but I've have had crazier predictions come true before.
Floyds just too intelligent & skillful, to cut it short.
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#3
Old 09-20-2011, 03:01 PM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PEANUT LIKACHU View Post
Manny's defense is much better though, may will have a difficult time landing CLEAN on manny. Roach has worked with James toney and toney has a similar style to mayweathers. So he might know things we don't he is probably aware of some things the regular fan does not know.

Didn't Toney get caught for using peds (was it twice?) whilst under Roach? Yes they both use the Philly-shell but Toneys is a much more relaxed, laying on the ropes style. But Floyd has a lot more than just the shell. I just don't see how a gun with an Uzi takes out a whole army.
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#4
Old 09-20-2011, 03:17 PM
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I really like manny as a fighter. I think he is one of the most exciting fighters in the game but i just dont think he is the "best fighter in the world". He has too many flaws for me to ever say that.

I touched on this once before but i dont really think manny has improved and if he has then only slightly. I say this because any hardcore guy already knows what manny weaknesses and strenghts are. Pure boxers are his weakness, anyone who really follows boxing knows this. With that said he has not fought a pure boxer since JMM. Since then he has fought mostly slow handed/footed, come forward fighters. These fighters play into his strenghts. Thats not a bad thing but it does not help manny in regards to fighting pure boxers. When him and jmm fight in november it will not be a blowout like floyd and jmm was because for as much as people want to say he has improved he hasnt really fought against his weakness to show us that.

For example people like to say that floyds weakness are southpaws but he was fighting a southpaw the other night and from a technical standpoint i didnt see him having many problems. There wasnt any head clashes due to the their stances nor did i see floyd stepping on his feet. I can say that he has improved because his supposed weakness are southpaw and he showed to not really have problems from a technical standpoint. But i can not say that about manny because he has not fought any pureboxers in a while. His fight in nov will show you if he really improved or has he just been matched to fit his style.

Now if he goes out and handles jmm no problem then i will change my opinion but if jmm gives him the same problems as he always has then i will stick firm with my opinion that manny cannot beat floyd. A guy who is probably the best at the style which is known to be ur weakness. add to that the height and reach advantage and the fact that may is as fast or faster than manny and i dont see him winning.
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#5
Old 09-20-2011, 03:24 PM
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it would be tough for 4 rounds if pac does not knock floyd out b4 then which is possible its going to be a nightmare for the lil monster!!!!!!
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Old 09-20-2011, 03:27 PM
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Pacquiao has the speed, the skills with his punches, and the chin to make Mayweather's life hell. I'm not sure he has the hunger anymore, but if he does Floyd will have to fight as well as he ever has to beat Pacquiao.
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#7
Old 09-20-2011, 03:27 PM
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Pretty solid post. I personally would love to see Marquez pull it off but I just really can not see this B/S 144lb catchweight doing him any favours at all.

I'll place a few quid on Marquez just because of the massive odds but I can't see him pulling it off unfortunately. I hope he does though because it'll be an amazing win especially under the circumstances of the stupid catchweight.

Last edited by dan_cov; 09-20-2011 at 03:31 PM.
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#8
Old 09-20-2011, 03:31 PM
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I could see Mayweather making things somewhat easy on himself fighting Pacquiao, if he were to just move backwards and counter Pacquiao with single shots at a time. The fans wouldn't like it, the media wouldn't like it, but it would get him a comfortable decision win.

If he goes at Pacquiao, things would be much harder, but much more exciting.
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Old 09-20-2011, 03:54 PM
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I think Manny has the mental will to keep coming forward at Floyd. Manny has been caught with some big shots that have left him wobbly, but he recovers and stil lcomes forward. Yes he only knows one style, but he doesn't give up on it. I think if Floyd does sit back and counter Manny, or get those lead right hands to land with a clinch to follow or side steps Manny, he'll win with ease.

The key for manny to win is speed, endurance, pressure and body shots. Floyd hates to get hit in the body. If Manny can throw right jabs to the body early, he has the speed to follow up with a stright left, sort of like what Mosely did early in the fight before he decided to gas out. Ortiz really didn't try to throw his Jab to the body, it was more towards the face, and Floyd can see that coming all day. IMO Manny has to work the Jab to the body and head of Floyd and Follow with the straight left here and there, watch for Floyds lead right hands, don't worry about head shots early, work the body and things could possibly open up. Freddie Roach has to literally come up with at least four different gameplans to swtich from during the fight because if you bring one or two, Floyd will pick up on them fast and adjust. It sounds impossible, but that's what needed to get a victory or Floyd.
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Old 09-20-2011, 03:56 PM
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LOL at the OP for asking for an "honest debate" about Pac when you have an avatar mocking him.

BTW RED K SENT.
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