Sonny Liston vs Larry Holmes - Page 3

JAB5239

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCtrojansbaby

Where do you get that from?

Liston has a 3" advantage in reach. Holmes has a 2 1/2" advantage in height. The difference is a 1/2" in Liston's favor.

Quote:

And besides just whose punches reach longer Holmes is a superior fighter in every way except power

I would probably favor Larry in this fight, but lets not pretend he is head and shoulders better than Liston. Holmes is faster and more Fluid.
Liston is a better puncher to the head and body, better hooks. Both are durable with proven chins.

I read your comment "Larry Holmes dominates Liston". Where exactly do you get dominate from? In Liston's defense he destroyed Cleveland Williams twice, and Williams was as good or better than the versions of Norton, Witherspoon or Carl Williams who Holmes struggled against. Holmes is a slight favorite in my opinion, but no way is this fight just a walk over.

DarkTerror88

IMO Liston's jab makes a telephone poll look flimsy. Holmes could beat him, but i would more often that not favor liston.

SCtrojansbaby

Reach and height don't correlate. Assuming Holmes and Liston had the same exact size back and shoulders 3 inches in reach means 1 and 1/2 inches in arm length.

JAB5239

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCtrojansbaby

Holmes height more than makes up for what ever the difference in arm length was(if there was any). Liston wouldn't be able to jab with Holmes

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCtrojansbaby

Reach and height don't correlate. Assuming Holmes and Liston had the same exact size back and shoulders 3 inches in reach means 1 and 1/2 inches in arm length.

First, how does Holmes height more than make up for Liston's reach? Second, how does it not correlate? And third, back and shoulder size is not the end all and determining factor in reach. If it were it would be able to explain why someone like Hagler has a longer reach than Marciano. Surely you're not claiming Hagler was bigger in the back and shoulders, are you?

DarkTerror88

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAB5239

First, how does Holmes height more than make up for Liston's reach? Second, how does it not correlate? And third, back and shoulder size is not the end all and determining factor in reach. If it were it would be able to explain why someone like Hagler has a longer reach than Marciano. Surely you're not claiming Hagler was bigger in the back and shoulders, are you?

Who are you giving this fight to JAB and why?

JAB5239

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkTerror88

Who are you giving this fight to JAB and why?

I like Holmes by hard fought, close, but unanimous decision. I've always rated Holmes and Liston 1 and 2 in terms of all time heavyweight jabs, with Larry's being better because it was quicker. He's also quicker of foot which will help to build an early lead while Liston is mauling him to the body and looking for the ko. After 10 or 11 rounds Liston's body work will pay dividends as he starts to land to the head more, but Larry is just to tough and crafty and Liston won't have enough rounds to get the job done. Just my opinion, as always.

DarkTerror88

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAB5239

I like Holmes by hard fought, close, but unanimous decision. I've always rated Holmes and Liston 1 and 2 in terms of all time heavyweight jabs, with Larry's being better because it was quicker. He's also quicker of foot which will help to build an early lead while Liston is mauling him to the body and looking for the ko. After 10 or 11 rounds Liston's body work will pay dividends as he starts to land to the head more, but Larry is just to tough and crafty and Liston won't have enough rounds to get the job done. Just my opinion, as always.

Listons jab was 10x stronger, but Holmes could change the rythm of his jab which is why he has the better jab in my opinion. But i feel that Liston's far underrated technique and boxing ability along with his bone crunching power carry him to victory.Holmes would have to clinch him on the inside to win and i dont feel Holmes is strong enough to do that.

joseph5620

Quote:

Originally Posted by kendom

Interesting matchup I have them very close on my all time heavyweight list, who win H2H?

I would only slightly favor Holmes but not by much. I can't help but think about the way Mike Weaver's heavy hands and his jab gave Holmes fits. So it's not hard to imagine Liston doing this or even beating Holmes. And Holmes made sure he never gave him a rematch when it mattered too. Holmes rates higher than Liston all time but head to head I think he would have problems and a very tough fight.

SCtrojansbaby

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAB5239

First, how does Holmes height more than make up for Liston's reach? Second, how does it not correlate? And third, back and shoulder size is not the end all and determining factor in reach. If it were it would be able to explain why someone like Hagler has a longer reach than Marciano. Surely you're not claiming Hagler was bigger in the back and shoulders, are you?

I'll say it again, assuming Holmes and Liston back/shoulders were the same exact size, 3 more inches in reach = 1.5 inches in arm length.

ghns1133

Quote:

Originally Posted by fitefanSHO

Holmes's chin and overall better boxing skills prevail over Liston.

Say, TKO12

agree to dissagree

View Poll Results: Who wins
Sonny Liston	7	25.93%
Larry Holmes	20	74.07%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 27. You may not vote on this poll

DarkTerror88 Undisputed Champion Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 1,051 Rep Power: 5 Points: 135,588,682.28 Bank: 0.00 Total Points: 135,588,682.28 Donate	IMO Liston's jab makes a telephone poll look flimsy. Holmes could beat him, but i would more often that not favor liston.

SCtrojansbaby Undisputed Champion Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 5,618 Blog Entries: 2 Rep Power: 15 Points: 30,243,959.53 Bank: 0.00 Total Points: 30,243,959.53 Donate	Reach and height don't correlate. Assuming Holmes and Liston had the same exact size back and shoulders 3 inches in reach means 1 and 1/2 inches in arm length.