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#21
Old 09-05-2011, 06:49 PM
IronDanHamza
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fooly Cooly View Post
Liston was obviously bluffing because he is a quitter and a cheater who tried to blind Ali with acid in his eyes.
Do you consider Duran to be both of those things fo the same reasons?

It's one fight, which happened to be against the argubally the greatest Heavyweight of all time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fooly Cooly View Post
Liston was obviously scared of Ali because Ali didn't roll over like the usual punks do when a bully tries to pull a fast one on him.
Mere speculation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fooly Cooly View Post
You are sitting here and pretending Liston isn't a human and he has no fears about going in the ring? lol.
No, I'm not.

Pretty sure I stated in an earlier post that he was utterly overmatched by Muhammad Ali.

But, Sonny Liston genuinely wasn't afraid of anyone he faced as a fighter. That includes Ali.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fooly Cooly View Post
EVERY fighter has fear before entering the ring. You pretending Liston was some evil robot killer is more of the same kind of mythologizing that a lot of these hack writers do with old fighters to try and sound "profound" when in fact its a lotta bull and puckey.
And you know this how? How do you know that?

And no I'm not. Liston had his flaws, he had many. And evidently he wasn't unbeatable or even close.

But the things you are claiming about Sonny Liston are false.

That 'Ali called Liston's tough guy bluff and wasn't afraid of him thus Liston folded' completely false.

That is truley not the reason Liston lost, at all.

Like I said, Liston lost to Ali because he was overmatched by a much greater fighter.

Last edited by IronDanHamza; 09-05-2011 at 10:50 PM.
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#22
Old 09-05-2011, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by poet682006 View Post
Excellent article!

Yes it was.
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#23
Old 09-06-2011, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Cokezaghe_Loc View Post
Possibly the most underrated Heavyweight ever for me.

I have him at number 3 ( Heavyweight All-Time ), behind Muhammad Ali, and Joe Louis respectively.

I rate His - Liston's - as the best jab of all-time - even ahead of Holmes ( Debatable I know. )

He could box, he could punch, he could take a punch, and he had an aura of intimidation that already had half his opponents beaten before they even entered the ring.

Tyson was absolutely right when asked who the last man he wanted to see across the other side of the ring before a fight.....

..... Tyson's reply:

SONNY LISTON.
I'm going to second everything you said.

Truly the champion no-one wanted.
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#24
Old 09-06-2011, 06:56 AM
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Brilliant article thanks for sharing
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#25
Old 09-06-2011, 07:12 AM
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Im a bit confused by the mob backing Sonny to lose the first Ali fight, I thought it was a mob guy in Liston's corner that put that stuff on Liston's glove inbetween rounds to blind Ali.
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#26
Old 09-06-2011, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fooly Cooly View Post
Sounds like a guy projecting his histrionic fantasies onto a one dimensional fighter for the sake of sounding like a poor man's Norman Mailer. Its frankly been done to death.





He was a big strong guy. Not a very good fighter. There's a difference.



If you're stupid outside the ring, how can you be smart inside the ring? It has everything to do with his approach to the sport.




Oh so now he's horribly past prime? Why do you make excuses for him when you yourself said you didn't know his age? Everyone just guessed. Liston sympathizers always use that as a crutch when its convenient. I'm sure if he would've beaten Ali like his usual Mid-west bum of the month opponents he would've been considered "absolutely prime".

Not to mention his quittage in the second fight but that could use its own thread.



I specifically excluded you from that. Don't get your panties wet over nothing.




I don't "hate" on him. I didn't know him personally. But I'm realistic, I've seen the video of him fighting and none of it comes close to reconciling the hyperbole that people attribute to him. The gap between the rhetoric and his actual skill level is pretty wide.

I got no horse in this race.
You accuse Williams of being one dimensional when your hero Wladimir only has one style and tactic?

Sorry I forgot all ATG's had diplomas...

His birthday falls between 1928 and 1932, yes his exact birthday isn't known but, he was a minimum of 32 for the first Ali fight and could have been 36. Lets call it halfway and say he was 34, that's still old for a fighter and it's clear if you compare him with the Ali fights he wasn't his best, only having 1 easy demolition the previous year.

I do think it;s obvious he quit in the second fight, (by staying down after being unintentionally dropped) but, you don't know the reasons behind this so there is no need to slate the guy.

If you watch Sonny Liston closely he has an excellent jab, is very strong in every punch with good head movement and is also very strong with a decent chin. These are all attributes that make him a good fighter and his ability to switch styles (unlike your hero) is another great asset to his very broad skillset.

Oh and for the record, he UD's Vitali and KO's Wlad.
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#27
Old 09-06-2011, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fooly Cooly View Post
tl;dr

Liston was a bum. Who cares if he had a long reach or a big ass neck?

He wasn't even competitive with Ali. What kind of logic is this anyway?

Either Klitschko would k.o him in the first round.
Who's ALT is this?

I think it's -JUGGERNAUT-
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#28
Old 09-06-2011, 01:44 PM
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I disagree with his portion about Ali vs Liston but otherwise a good defence of the Big Bear.
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