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#11
Old 05-26-2011, 08:53 PM
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Mayweather fans refuse to believe this and I am not trying to offend you, but the truth is Mayweather is and has been the most protected fighter and a win over the limited Corrales(RIP) does not mean greatness. Imagine if it had been a prime Julio C. Chavez in there instead of the overrated Jose Luis Castillo.
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#12
Old 05-26-2011, 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted by studentofthegam View Post
I dont know bruh. I think he destroys Arguello and bullies Pep.

since when has floyd been a destroyer or a bully?
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#13
Old 05-26-2011, 08:58 PM
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I dont know if you would consider Arguello as top 30, but if you do, I think Mayweather would beat him.

Arguello was a fantastic fighter, offensively one of the best ever, but Mayweather was flat out a terrible style matchup for him, based on Arguello's fights aganst Violmar Fernandez and Ernesto Marcel, who used a lot of defense and potshotting to annoy Arguello. Mayweather has those tools.

Arguello was also rangy and thin, and Mayweather in the past has done very well against those types of opponents. ie Corrales and Genaro Hernandez. no, Arguello is not a Corrales or Hernandez, but I have no doubt that Mayweather would be able to control distance well and decision Arguello in a 117-111 ish type of fight.
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#14
Old 05-26-2011, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by IronDanHamza View Post
I know you don't do new weight classes but for the sake of argument how do you see Mayweather Jr Vs Arguello going at 130 Lbs, Poet?
Mayweather was much more active at the lower weights than his is at Welter. Even so, I think he starts to run after the Arguello right clocks him. Think Rosario Vs Camacho. Put in judges from the 1970s who actually penalize you for those kind of tactics and I think Floyd runs and potshots his way to a decision loss. Arguello may find Floyd difficult to land on but given that I think Floyd's workrate is going to go in the tank after he gets hit it's not going to matter.

Poet
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#15
Old 05-26-2011, 09:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Steak View Post
I dont know if you would consider Arguello as top 30, but if you do, I think Mayweather would beat him.

Arguello was a fantastic fighter, offensively one of the best ever, but Mayweather was flat out a terrible style matchup for him, based on Arguello's fights aganst Violmar Fernandez and Ernesto Marcel, who used a lot of defense and potshotting to annoy Arguello. Mayweather has those tools.

Arguello was also rangy and thin, and Mayweather in the past has done very well against those types of opponents. ie Corrales and Genaro Hernandez. no, Arguello is not a Corrales or Hernandez, but I have no doubt that Mayweather would be able to control distance well and decision Arguello in a 117-111 ish type of fight.
Annoying and beating are two different things though. I can easily see Arguello being annoyed as hell by Willie Pep but I still see that as a pretty even fight.

I think, though, what it boils down to is we have differing views on just how much style matchups determine the outcome of a fight. As I see it, the better fighter usually wins regardless of the style matchup. He may have difficulties because of it (ie Holmes vs Norton), but he still usually ends up winning (as Holmes did). To my mind, style matchups that are determinitive are rare (short-armed swarmers against Foreman and Liston being the one that comes to mind).

Poet
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#16
Old 05-26-2011, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by poet682006 View Post
Mayweather was much more active at the lower weights than his is at Welter. Even so, I think he starts to run after the Arguello right clocks him. Think Rosario Vs Camacho. Put in judges from the 1970s who actually penalize you for those kind of tactics and I think Floyd runs and potshots his way to a decision loss. Arguello may find Floyd difficult to land on but given that I think Floyd's workrate is going to go in the tank after he gets hit it's not going to matter.

Poet
Like you (or so I presume) Arguello is one of my favourite fighters, infact, he is my favourite fighter. And I think he is trouble for ANYONE in that weight class and his right hand could decapitate anyone in that weight class.

But I think Mayweather will be a tough fight for Arguello. Mayweather has never tasted Arguello-like power and if he were to, who knows how he would react. But, he has handled power at that weight before so I guess that one we won't ever know.

Like you, I agree the better fighter usually wins. But, I personally won't dismiss the fact that some people outright struggle with a certain style. And I think Arguello would have alot of problems with Floyd Mayweather Jr at that weight.

For me it's 50/50. But that's just me.

I think Arguello and Floyd are a handful for a lot of fighters at that weight class (only if you count 130 as a weight class)
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#17
Old 05-26-2011, 09:40 PM
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Somebody said that Mayweather bullies Hearns in a fight, sh*t! Mayweather gets buried by Hearns at 147 and after the fight he is no longer able to pronuonce the words p.e.d drug testing........Rockin'
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#18
Old 05-27-2011, 12:05 AM
Steak
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Originally Posted by poet682006 View Post
Annoying and beating are two different things though. I can easily see Arguello being annoyed as hell by Willie Pep but I still see that as a pretty even fight.

I think, though, what it boils down to is we have differing views on just how much style matchups determine the outcome of a fight. As I see it, the better fighter usually wins regardless of the style matchup. He may have difficulties because of it (ie Holmes vs Norton), but he still usually ends up winning (as Holmes did). To my mind, style matchups that are determinitive are rare (short-armed swarmers against Foreman and Liston being the one that comes to mind).

Poet
perhaps, and its all speculation in the end.

but I saw Fernandez and Marcel not only annoy Arguello, but beat Arguello fighting defensively and potshotting. Mayweather is definitely better than both those fighters, not only in the above mentioned catagories but overall. So personally I would have Mayweather beating Arguello.

I put a lot of emphasis on style matchups. I know you dont, but I guess thats just different philosophies regarding boxing.
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Old 05-27-2011, 06:09 AM
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Originally Posted by studentofthegam View Post
I only say worthless because I think he beats a lot of them even at WW. I feel like a lot of the guys that peeps pick to destroy him like Hearns, Duran and Hagler couldnt make the proper adjustments to win. Duran probably stands the best chance because he could change it up some. Hagler I think would get picked off for 12 rounds. I see him attacking Hearns and not letting the length take over and Tommy doesnt exactly have an iron chin. When guys talk Chavez and prime Mosley's beating him I draw the line because its a tier down in ATG's. I think those are spankings.
Hearns couldn't make the proper adjustments? The guy was NEVER outboxed and had a combination of speed, size and power that Floyd has never had to deal with. He's the worst possible match up for Floyd.
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Old 05-27-2011, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by lazy View Post
Mayweather fans refuse to believe this and I am not trying to offend you, but the truth is Mayweather is and has been the most protected fighter and a win over the limited Corrales(RIP) does not mean greatness. Imagine if it had been a prime Julio C. Chavez in there instead of the overrated Jose Luis Castillo.
Im not offended. It was the whole point of the thread because I know the popular opinion. So who could he have a decent dance with. And who could or should he have fought in place of either of the two (Corrales,Castillo)?

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Originally Posted by New England View Post
since when has floyd been a destroyer or a bully?
He was pretty vicious at the lower weights. People always forget that. Sure he had rough time with Castillo but name the other close fight he had? I cant remember one. Definitely not below 140.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JAB5239 View Post
Hearns couldn't make the proper adjustments? The guy was NEVER outboxed and had a combination of speed, size and power that Floyd has never had to deal with. He's the worst possible match up for Floyd.
I think Floyd would force him to crank the action up by working in and out or potshotting as its called. Hearns seemed really vulnerable and tense when he got a little frustrated. Not to mention that beard of his was not the worst but questionable. If Floyd gets you frustrated then its a done deal.
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