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#1
Old 05-16-2011, 01:33 PM
Perfect Plex
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Default Was Julio Cesar Chavez Lucky Through Out His Career?

First of all I rate Chavez as one of the best ever and a true ATG. But I got thinking, would you class him as one of the luckiest ATG fighters?

Here's what am talking about.

Julio Cesar Chavez orginally lost his unbeaten record in Mexico after just 11 fights when he got DQ'd. But Chavez's manager at the time was also the part of the commission team and had the result overturned to a W.

Rocky Lockridge still claims he should of at least got a draw against Chavez when he lost on Majority Decision in Mexico.

Meldrick Taylor should been allowed to continue. By the time Chavez would of got over to Taylor and try to attack the TWO seconds would have been up. It's ruined Meldrick any way, so don't give me Chavez might of damaged him. Did Richard Steele do this because he was under Don King's payroll.

What if the shoe had been on the other foot and Chavez was leading on the cards with 2 seconds to go, would of Steel stopped Chavez? Not likely.

Chavez was invovled in one of the biggest robbries ever when he was CLEARLY outboxed over 12 one sided rounds by Pernell Whitaker. Whitaker won the fight without much trouble, but yet it was given draw.

Frankie Randall was starting to have his way with Chavez for a second time, but yet the fight was then stopped on a cut, when Randall clearly wanted to continue, and could of.

Miguel Angel Gonzalez also clearly beat Chavez over 12, but yet again they gave the fight a draw.

Now thats alot of luck to have in my opinion. Did Don King & Jose Suliman have referee's, judges, officials on the pay roll? To keep Chavez's record intact?

Julio Cesar Chavez is a ATG, but a very damn lucky one.

Last edited by Perfect Plex; 05-16-2011 at 01:37 PM.
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#2
Old 05-16-2011, 01:51 PM
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I don't think he's the top 50 ATG his fans would make him out to be but he was a pretty solid fighter. Although Taylor maybe could have survived but that was still damn impressive to comeback like that.

It seesm to run in the family though that they draw instead of lose hahaha still kinda rubs me the wrong way Whitaker got *****'d on when he obviously should have a world class fighter like Chavez on his resume.

He's a great fighter. He was pretty damn good but I don't think he's top 50 all time 25 fighter though.
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#3
Old 05-16-2011, 02:04 PM
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I must say from my experience the Julio Cesar Chavez fanbase were by far the most frustrating ones to deal with when he was the #1 guy.

That includes; Tyson, De La Hoya and later Mayweather and Pacquaio.

To me, it seems they really built the foundation of insane obsessive affection for a fighter and defensive feminine like nature if you didn't say he is the best fighter ever. It really was quite crazy, I had never seen anything that crazy from fans before. Now, It's a natural thing when fighters are on top. In the 90's Roy Jones was being compared to Robinson. Oscar was being called one of the best ever whilst he was undefeated, in 2007 Mayweather was being talked about as a Top 10 ATG by his obsessive fans, Pacquaio's obsessive fans are obviously a severe case today. I feel like the Chavez fanbase started this nonsense.

In terms of Chavez, he's a great fighter. No question about that.

But I agree, he was very very lucky at times and it's quite clear to me that Don King clearly had people paid off to make sure he won fights. I don't believe he did on all those examples but there was certainly something going on. I don't trust Don King alot of the time and some of those examples there was clearly something going on.
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#4
Old 05-16-2011, 02:12 PM
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Rocky Lockridge... really?

Meldrick Taylor didn't respond to Steele after the knockdown they say its cause he was talking to his trainer either way Steele was in his rights to stop it.

Pernell Whitaker that fight should of never went past the 9th round Pernell landed at least 7 clean and blatant punches to Chavez's crotch. That is an undisputed fact. Its just goes to show that Pernell was not nearly as good as most thought that he could only get a draw against him after all those punches to the crotch. Not to mention Chavez moved up in weight to fight Pernell another advantage he had and still could only get a draw.

Both Randall and Chavez exchanged headbuts Randall was unlucky his headbutt is the one that caused the cut the rule is the rule if Randall would of gotten cut then Chavez would of lost a point tough luck.

Chavez was way past his prime who cares what happened against Gonzalez

Even if you give Chavez losses against Pernell and Randall his resume is still strong enough that he is an undisputed top 20 ATG.
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#5
Old 05-16-2011, 02:26 PM
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I couldn't think of a fighter more consistently 'lucky' than him, nice shout on the Lockridge fight. I do consider him an ATG though and I respect his skills.
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#6
Old 05-16-2011, 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted by RubenSonny View Post
I couldn't think of a fighter more consistently 'lucky' than him, nice shout on the Lockridge fight. I do consider him an ATG though and I respect his skills.

As with all things you create your own luck. Also don't act like he didn't have some bad luck of his own no DQ in the lowblow fest vs Pernell Whitaker
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#7
Old 05-16-2011, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by SCtrojansbaby View Post
As with all things you create your own luck. Also don't act like he didn't have some bad luck of his own no DQ in the lowblow fest vs Pernell Whitaker



Whitaker retaliated with low blows after Chavez started hitting him in the hips and thighs. That's illegal if you didn't know that. The only difference is Whitaker didn't cry about it like Chavez always did when he got it back. Whitaker kept fighting and didn't complain..





I can post it for you to see for yourself to refresh your memory if you don't remember.
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#8
Old 05-16-2011, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by joseph5620 View Post
Whitaker retaliated with low blows after Chavez started hitting him in the hips and thighs. That's illegal if you didn't know that. The only difference is Whitaker didn't cry about it like Chavez always did when he got it back. Whitaker kept fighting and didn't complain..





I can post it for you to see for yourself to refresh your memory if you don't remember.

Chavez hit him on the thighs because Pernell likes to crouch real low to evade punches. If your going to crouch like that then you should expect to get hit on the thighs.

And there is a big difference between hitting the thighs and hitting the crotch. Crotch punches are infintely more debilitating.
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#9
Old 05-16-2011, 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by SCtrojansbaby View Post
Chavez hit him on the thighs because Pernell likes to crouch real low to evade punches. If your going to crouch like that then you should expect to get hit on the thighs.

And there is a big difference between hitting the thighs and hitting the crotch. Crotch punches are infintely more debilitating.



Last time I checked crouching in the ring is legal. Shots to the thighs are not. Shots to the thighs, hitting below the belt. Both are illegal. You can make all of the excuses for your boy Chavez that you want but Whitaker schooled him and bullied him.
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#10
Old 05-16-2011, 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by joseph5620 View Post

Last time I checked crouching in the ring is legal. Shots to the thighs are not. Shots to the thighs, hitting below the belt. Both are illegal. You can make all of the excuses for your boy Chavez that you want but Whitaker schooled him and bullied him.

My point is shots to the thighs are unavoidable though when a fighter like to crouch and as I said shots to the crotch are far more debilitating.

That said Pernell had Chavez just about completely debilitated by hitting him to the nuts and Chavez was coming up in weight to make the fight AND STILL all Pernell could pull off was a draw? Looks like your the one making excuses.
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