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#21
Old 04-02-2011, 12:42 PM
BigStereotype
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It COULD happen. I COULD have crazy sex with Scarlett Johansson tomorrow. Not likely. But say it does happen. Still doesn't make him number one. He's set as number three, but there's nobody good enough today to make him number one, not even considering his age. He can't match Louis' dominance or Ali's unbelievable resume and all-around H2H dominance. When I do rankings, first I look at resume.
Then I look at "how good are you really?"
Then I take into account who would win if they fought.

Well Holyfield bests Louis' resume, I think, especially if he added the Klitschko brothers and Haye. But Louis is CLEARLY the "better" fighter and I don't think there is anything that Holyfield could do to beat Louis. That's one of the few fantasy fights where I say that Holyfield gets stopped by the eighth.

Ali beats Holyfield's resume, even with the Klits and Haye, is the better fighter and I think would win in the matchup. So there you have it.
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#22
Old 04-02-2011, 12:49 PM
IronDanHamza
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Originally Posted by jimmy1569 View Post
i AGREE.. that the cruiserweight is separate but it is a part of him & his story as a fighter & the guy would've faced every name there is..may not have won all of them... but the little engine that could applies here & so does the Rocky THeme... with Haye who's nearly 20 yrs younger than him.. that's just icing on the cake..sorry But I don't agree..ALTHOUGH DO UNDERstand your vantage point.
I understand where you're coming from, I do.

He would have one hell of a resume, that's for sure.

Maybe I'm being a tad old fashioned, but as great as his resume would be, I can't agree to him being ranked above Louis or Ali. Ali's resume would still be better and in my opinion so would Louis' including his 12 year/25 title defence reign.

To me Holyfield never beats that. However I would say he would have to be a top 5 HW considering his age to that.
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#23
Old 04-02-2011, 12:54 PM
IronDanHamza
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Originally Posted by LarryX2011 View Post
if he beats both klits and haye i dont see why not
I do.

Compare that to Ali's resume. It's still not better.

Compare that to Joe Louis' resume/Title reign. It's still not better.
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#24
Old 04-02-2011, 01:58 PM
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Originally Posted by jimmy1569 View Post
against all ODDS... Knocks out both Klitschko's in succession & takes all 4 belts from them. My question is... this the dealbreaker to put Holyfield as the number one heavyweight in boxing history & if you don't think so would Knocking Haye out as well for consolation convince you that The Real Deal is the best heavyweight of alltime?

I think it would be a knowbrainer... no heavyweight in history could top that resume. What say you guys & please keep the insults to a minimum & that i'm crazy for even thinking this...just answer the question posed.. is he or isn't he the best heavyweight in history & the reasoning behind it.. Thanks Guys.

Look, I really enjoyed his fight during his primes and he is a real warrior.
But 50??!! Is that in chronological age or the number of brain cells left in Holyfield's brain? Yeah it would be a REAL no-brainer (pun intended) if Holyfield continues to fight. It's a crime that he is still given license to fight. This is some sad sh*t.
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#25
Old 04-02-2011, 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by IronDanHamza View Post
I do.

Compare that to Ali's resume. It's still not better.

Compare that to Joe Louis' resume/Title reign. It's still not better.
louis had alot of title defenses but also fought alot of no worthy comp hence the bum of the month club
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#26
Old 04-02-2011, 02:35 PM
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Holyfield lost to Sultan Ibragimov.

Saying that, he would knock David Haye OUT.

I also wouldn't mind him fighting Vitali in June, but ya cant always get what ya want.
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#27
Old 04-03-2011, 01:31 AM
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Originally Posted by BigStereotype View Post
It COULD happen. I COULD have crazy sex with Scarlett Johansson tomorrow. Not likely. But say it does happen. Still doesn't make him number one. He's set as number three, but there's nobody good enough today to make him number one, not even considering his age. He can't match Louis' dominance or Ali's unbelievable resume and all-around H2H dominance. When I do rankings, first I look at resume.
Then I look at "how good are you really?"
Then I take into account who would win if they fought.

Well Holyfield bests Louis' resume, I think, especially if he added the Klitschko brothers and Haye. But Louis is CLEARLY the "better" fighter and I don't think there is anything that Holyfield could do to beat Louis. That's one of the few fantasy fights where I say that Holyfield gets stopped by the eighth.

Ali beats Holyfield's resume, even with the Klits and Haye, is the better fighter and I think would win in the matchup. So there you have it.
Nothing that I saw with Louis states that it's an automatic win & we both Know Holyfield could take a much better punch & was relentless. Ali & Holyfield would be interesting & to me a tossup. I disagree with your criteria or the inflation of the resume for ALI.. he was no Jordan in the ring (only in name & world wide fame)...many imperfections. Holyfield has taken on just about the same amount of great fighters Ali has without the dream scenario. He even took on better comp than Lewis as a whole in the 90's... maybe not as successful but Holy fought everyone & most of his losses have come towards the tail end of his career & the same time Ali started to lose in his late 30's. I also think that Holyfield has been involved in just as much epic fights & captured the imagination of the public. The ALI name should not be a factor.. as obviously he's made the most impact in boxing history..we're talking just ring here. To take out both Klits in succession where everyone's prediction beforehand would be Klits by murder in the first degree... to do it at 50 yrs old... & TAKE HAYE out as well for cruiserweight bragging right.

Have & retire with all 4 belts in his position.. old enough to be a grandfather.. i'm sorry but that dwarfs Ali's 2 best wins vs Foreman & Liston as everyone thought he'd get slaughtered but he wasn't doing it at 50 & Holyfield already shocked the world by completely destroying the Myth of Iron Mike once & for all...sorry but the resume would be slightly better & more spectacular.. Louis & Ali WOULD be fighting for runnerup..

Think about it.. the odds of beating one brother let alone 2.. combined would be the biggest upsets in boxing history BASED on peoples perception of Holyfield now...& please let's not say the brothers are garbage just to better the argument that it would'nt be that much of a didffic ult task... we've all read the comments over the past 5 years or so that if hOLYFIELD gets thrown in with the Klitschkos he's risking his life.. The K's are NOW at ther most dominant.. There you have my opinion on it. The odds of overcoming both of them would be greater than 42-1 & would be a 100-1 to slay both.
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#28
Old 04-03-2011, 01:49 AM
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Originally Posted by IronDanHamza View Post
I do.

Compare that to Ali's resume. It's still not better.

Compare that to Joe Louis' resume/Title reign. It's still not better.
Louis' competition first of all would be far inferior.. Holyfield would have more alltime greats on his resume than him & judging by all boxing fans here... they take comp into heavy consideration & that's why they bury the Klitschkos. As for Holyfield fighting those 3 titlists in a row.. i'd venture to say he'd have fought more world titlists & all time greats than Ali & would've outdone the Foreman & Liston fights where ALI was expected to get killed as well. The Tyson & Klitschko fights would surpass that for Shock value. He has his trilogy with Bowe similar to Frazier... he even fought 2 top 10 alltime greats that Ali fought. He'd also have won the titles or parts of it 5 different times.. yes ALI would hAVE 3 unified championships to Holy's 2.... but Holy once had 2/3 of the belts after he got revenge against Moorer & also when he rematched bOWE & won but Bowe through one of the belts in the trash to avoid Lewis & let;s not forget the the second LeWIS fight where many believe he had Lewis hurt & threw the harder more telling shots.. that was a makeup call.. he would've been unified & retired if he got the nod... that fight was scored on compubox & not on who did more damage as Lewis looked much more beaten up than Holyfield. Oh & last but not least.. he could've been a 5 belt holder on 2 different occasions of the judges weren't blind.. He outboxed Ruiz clearly in there 3rd fight & broke his jaw but walked out with a 50/50 split of there entire trilogy & let's not forget got robbed in Germany... would've already been the oldest Heavy of alltime. So as you see his resume is just as stacked with achievements & he's got the undefeated best of alltime cruiserweight career. To me it's a knowbrainer!
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#29
Old 04-03-2011, 02:00 AM
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Anybody who says Holyfield can do this needs serious help. Holyfield is FINISHED.
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#30
Old 04-03-2011, 02:29 AM
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Holyfield is 48, and hasnt beaten a non-francois botha fighter in 4 years.

Im so sick of Holyfield fanbois saying he deserves anything. He deserves nothing, he is less worthy of a title shot than Audley.

Since 1998, here is Holyfields record:

7 wins, 7 losses, 2 draws, an NC in a fight he was losing. Thats called a bum.

And Holyfield fans ***** and whine that he hasnt gotten a shot. IN HIS LAST 4 FIGHTS HE GOT 2 TITLE SHOTS... Since he lost 2 straight title shots, he beat Botha, and had a NC he was losing to Sherman Williams. He doesnt deserve anything. In the last 13 years he has a complete even record.

Holyfield has gotten way more than he ever deserved in terms of chances. The only fighter he has beat in the last 4 years was Francois Botha.

Holyfield needs to stop whining and either retire or work for his shot.

Oh and he cant beat a Klitschko, he has no KO power whatsoever, so yeah anything can happen in the ring, but no one is going to beat a Klitschko on the cards. That would never happen.
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