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#21
Old 02-12-2011, 06:10 PM
BennyST
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Originally Posted by CarlosG815 View Post
I think Leonard was an awesome combination puncher with a ton of speed but I was referring to Duran at lightweight. He still struggled with Leonard and it was a very close fight, and we all know what happened when they fought a second time.
Ah, yep. I missed that bit.

BlackIrish: I can remember one fight in which he was cut from a headbutt. I think it might have even been against Sims. It was around that period though from memory or a bit later.

Or maybe it was against Camacho? Can't remember.
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#22
Old 02-12-2011, 11:41 PM
them_apples
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Originally Posted by BigStereotype View Post
Don't take this the wrong way. Duran is the greatest lightweight of all time bar none and is an excellent, legendary kind of fighter all around. But I've heard people describe him as "impossible" to hit. From what I've seen, this isn't really the case. Now he's coming forward and still doesn't get hit all that often, but you can drop a bomb on him if you set it up right. He's hard to hit in combination because he's not bothered by the punches so he sees the second and third ones coming. Still, I think that impossible to hit is a pretty big reach.
he was damn near impossible to hit CLEAN. but he was hitable. He often rolled with punches a lot though. Overated by some, underated by others. Good defense but not superb, he was an explosive brawler with fast head-movement first and foremost, he was more of a technical fighter later on in his career.

fighters with the best defense are generally going to have a lower workrate though, the less punches you throw the less openings you have.

See Mayweather, Clottey, Hopkins.

You have you exceptions though like James Toney, Mike Tyson and Whitaker who relied on good headmovement to avoid blows.

Last edited by them_apples; 02-12-2011 at 11:43 PM.
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#23
Old 02-13-2011, 12:51 AM
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Originally Posted by them_apples View Post
he was damn near impossible to hit CLEAN. but he was hitable. He often rolled with punches a lot though. Overated by some, underated by others. Good defense but not superb, he was an explosive brawler with fast head-movement first and foremost, he was more of a technical fighter later on in his career.

fighters with the best defense are generally going to have a lower workrate though, the less punches you throw the less openings you have.

See Mayweather, Clottey, Hopkins.

You have you exceptions though like James Toney, Mike Tyson and Whitaker who relied on good headmovement to avoid blows.
I'd have to agree with that about not getting hit clean. His defense was really more of a means for his offense if that makes sense. I really don't see him as a defensive specialist or anything but he did some really special things with his defense. The way he would through his head away from a punch to take away the force or some of the countering he would do of things like that was really rare and always is what i really enjoy about watching his fights. I cam see how it is hard to rate him defensively not that that really answers the question and also I know your talking about lightweight but I think some fans are using his hole career or different parts of it and that may also be why there is not a general consensus about him defensively.
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