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#131
Old 01-06-2011, 11:33 AM
CarlosG815
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Originally Posted by Holtol View Post
I don't really make p4p lists. I never really thought Williams was vastly superior to Margarito, Quintana, Cintron, Martinez.
Williams beat Margarito convincingly and after losing to Quintana came back to knock him out inside of a round...

Williams at the time was better than all the fighters you listed above. I do think he was losing to Cintron before Cintron did a nose dive into the crowd but that fight was too early to tell.

Paul Williams was legitimately a top 3 p4p guy at the time he was knocked out by Sergio.
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#132
Old 01-06-2011, 11:45 AM
Holtol
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Originally Posted by CarlosG815 View Post
Williams beat Margarito convincingly and after losing to Quintana came back to knock him out inside of a round...

Williams at the time was better than all the fighters you listed above. I do think he was losing to Cintron before Cintron did a nose dive into the crowd but that fight was too early to tell.

Paul Williams was legitimately a top 3 p4p guy at the time he was knocked out by Sergio.
It's been awile since I have seen the Margarito vs Williams fight I thought it was close to a draw.

I thought Quintana won Convincingly vs Williams. And then Williams kos Quintana the seconed fight. I don't see how them each winning a fight makes one better then the other.

I thought Sergio won the first fight vs Williams by 2 or 3 rounds.

I don't really make or pay much attention to p4p lists. Because I find it hard to rate boxers that don't fight each other. But you are right Williams was rated number 3 by Ring Magazine, If they don't give Martinez fighter of the year they are admiting that their p4p rankings are pure sh*t imo.

I don't see either fighter having much over each other this year.

Last edited by Holtol; 01-07-2011 at 12:45 AM.
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#133
Old 01-06-2011, 04:45 PM
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Originally Posted by CarlosG815 View Post
You guys are totally ignoring the fact that Martinez put Paul Williams, who was without question a top 3 p4p guy, into a 30 second coma. That win is without question the biggest shocker of the year and is worthy of much praise. I wanted Sergio to win but I honestly thought that Paul would outpoint him. I can't imagine many of you believed that Paul would go down so easily but Sergio was in control of the entire fight and all but decapitated Paul.

BennyST said it best in this post. There is nothing more to be said. Pacquiao did what was expected, anything less would have been shocking, yet Martinez shocked us all in his winning performances.
In effect, then, you want to punish Pacquiao for his past success? It was only expected he would win because he's been so brutally proficient in his last several bouts. By this measure, if Pacquiao had struggled to an unconvincing win over De La Hoya, & lost to Hatton & Cotto, but then went ahead & did exactly the same thing in 2010 as he actually did (completely walking over both Clottey & Margarito, the latter at 154lbs.) he would be looked at much more favourably because he wasn't such a favourite?

That's using a criteria which punishes Pacquiao for his past successes, which is hardly just.
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#134
Old 01-07-2011, 12:05 PM
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Well the two biggest fights that can be made for boxing in Mayweather vs Pacquiao & Haye vs Klitschko, don't look like there going to be made in 2011.

This really hurts the sport. It's a damn shame these fights can't happen, boxing fans deserve them. We don't want Wladamir vs a 14 fight novice, or Pacquiao vs a 40 year old washed up Shane Mosley.

We want the super fights. I also hear that 40 year old William Joppy, who hasn't won a fight since 2007 is getting a WBA 175lb title shot......

Last edited by Heavy Bag; 01-07-2011 at 04:44 PM.
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#135
Old 01-07-2011, 01:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heavy Bag View Post
Well the two biggest fights tha can be made for boxing in Mayweather vs Pacquiao & Haye vs Klitschko, don't look like there going to be made in 2011.

This really hurts the sport. It's a damn shame these fights can't happen, boxing fans deserve them. We don't want Wladamir vs a 14 fight novice, or Pacquiao vs a 40 year old washed up Shane Mosley.

We want the super fights. I also hear that 40 year old William Joppy, who hasn't won a fight since 2007 is getting a WBA 175lb title shot......
i agree with you, The sanctioning bodies are the ones we must blame.
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#136
Old 01-07-2011, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Wild Blue Yonda View Post
In effect, then, you want to punish Pacquiao for his past success? It was only expected he would win because he's been so brutally proficient in his last several bouts. By this measure, if Pacquiao had struggled to an unconvincing win over De La Hoya, & lost to Hatton & Cotto, but then went ahead & did exactly the same thing in 2010 as he actually did (completely walking over both Clottey & Margarito, the latter at 154lbs.) he would be looked at much more favourably because he wasn't such a favourite?

That's using a criteria which punishes Pacquiao for his past successes, which is hardly just.
No, it is not Pacquiaos past successes but the fact that the fighters he is taking on are shot in my opinion. Those are guys who shouldn't be fighting anymore. Any good fighter would dismantle those guys int he same fashion. Sergio Martinez would not only beat the two guys Pacquiao beat, but he would probably knock them both out.
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#137
Old 01-07-2011, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Blue Yonda View Post
In effect, then, you want to punish Pacquiao for his past success? It was only expected he would win because he's been so brutally proficient in his last several bouts. By this measure, if Pacquiao had struggled to an unconvincing win over De La Hoya, & lost to Hatton & Cotto, but then went ahead & did exactly the same thing in 2010 as he actually did (completely walking over both Clottey & Margarito, the latter at 154lbs.) he would be looked at much more favourably because he wasn't such a favourite?

That's using a criteria which punishes Pacquiao for his past successes, which is hardly just.
The fact is the Clottey and Margarito fight were foregone conclusions, and fights that no one particularly wanted or cared about before they were made.
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#138
Old 01-07-2011, 04:54 PM
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Some more great news for the sport. So ''Called'' World Champion Felix Sturm will next defend his title against Ronald Hearns.

Ronald has never beat a top 25 fighter. Nearly all of his wins have come against journyman & club fighters. The only time he did step up against sub par Harry Joe Yorgey he was knocked out in 9 for the IBA 154lb Title.

But now he he is going to challage for the WBA Middleweight Title?

While Sturm continues to dodge fighting the best in 160lb division. Ronald is most likely getting this due to his last name. Why dosen't Strum fight a deserving fighter like Gennady Golovkin?
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#139
Old 01-07-2011, 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Heavy Bag View Post
Some more great news for the sport. So ''Called'' World Champion Felix Sturm will next defend his title against Ronald Hearns.

Ronald has never beat a top 25 fighter. Nearly all of his wins have come against journyman & club fighters. The only time he did step up against sub par Harry Joe Yorgey he was knocked out in 9 for the IBA 154lb Title.

But now he he is going to challage for the WBA Middleweight Title?

While Sturm continues to dodge fighting the best in 160lb division. Ronald is most likely getting this due to his last name. Why dosen't Strum fight a deserving fighter like Gennady Golovkin?
Ronald Hearns is a pretty poor excuse for a title challenger.

On another note, is your avatar a pic from the Monzon-Briscoe rematch?
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#140
Old 01-07-2011, 06:01 PM
Heavy Bag
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Ronald Hearns is a pretty poor excuse for a title challenger.

On another note, is your avatar a pic from the Monzon-Briscoe rematch?
Yeah it from the second fight.

Amazing Monzon recovered, when he seemed to be completey out on his feet. Brsicoe was a devastating puncher.

I belive film is not known to exsit of there 1st fight. But you never know and wound't be shocked if it did, would love to see it.
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