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#11
Old 04-16-2010, 07:44 PM
jrosales13
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Originally Posted by $partacus View Post
But how does someone become lineal champ, if the previous lineal champ retired as lineal champ?
A box off between the top two rated guys or in SOME instances the #1 guys vs the #3 guy.
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#12
Old 04-16-2010, 07:48 PM
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Originally Posted by jrosales13 View Post
A box off between the top two rated guys or in SOME instances the #1 guys vs the #3 guy.
That's the way the Ring champion is decided. So they are basically the same are they not?
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#13
Old 04-16-2010, 07:50 PM
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Originally Posted by jrosales13 View Post
No he was not the lineal champ, John Ruiz had the #2 spot and Vitaly had to beat him to be lineal champ.

Not every time a #1 fights a #3 is for the title. Just in CERTAIN instances...
The lineal title was definitely at stake when Vital beat Sanders mate. They only block the title from being rewarded in a 1 v 3 matchup if the #2 ranked man has unfinished business with 1 or 3. Pac-MAB 2 is an example of this. Draw with Pac, win over MAB, so Ring wouldn't allow the lineage to be reactivated. Not so with Ruiz at the time of Vitali-Sanders.
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#14
Old 04-16-2010, 07:54 PM
istmeno
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Originally Posted by jrosales13 View Post
A box off between the top two rated guys or in SOME instances the #1 guys vs the #3 guy.
actually that is the way the ring title is decided. to re establish lineage you need 3 of the four major belts
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#15
Old 04-16-2010, 08:00 PM
jrosales13
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Originally Posted by Clyde Barrow View Post
The lineal title was definitely at stake when Vital beat Sanders mate. They only block the title from being rewarded in a 1 v 3 matchup if the #2 ranked man has unfinished business with 1 or 3. Pac-MAB 2 is an example of this. Draw with Pac, win over MAB, so Ring wouldn't allow the lineage to be reactivated. Not so with Ruiz at the time of Vitali-Sanders.
The Ring does not decide lineage though, they decide ring champions. Sometimes they do get it right however sometimes they don't.

http://www.maxboxing.com/Cliff/Rold040908.asp

The coronation of big brother Vitali Klitschko as Heavyweight champion for his first win over a currently rated Ring top ten fighter, ever, against Corrie Sanders in 2004. Much as he was loathsome to watch, John Ruizís rebound from the Roy Jones loss with wins over Hasim Rahman and Fres Oquendo were more meritorious than anything Klitscko had actually finished when he entered the ring with Sanders.
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#16
Old 04-16-2010, 08:07 PM
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Originally Posted by jrosales13 View Post
The Ring does not decide lineage though, they decide ring champions. Sometimes they do get it right however sometimes they don't.

http://www.maxboxing.com/Cliff/Rold040908.asp

The coronation of big brother Vitali Klitschko as Heavyweight champion for his first win over a currently rated Ring top ten fighter, ever, against Corrie Sanders in 2004. Much as he was loathsome to watch, John Ruizís rebound from the Roy Jones loss with wins over Hasim Rahman and Fres Oquendo were more meritorious than anything Klitscko had actually finished when he entered the ring with Sanders.
It happens, but it's rare for the Ring and lineal titles to not be one and the same. Until late 08 I think, Ring titles could be awarded to a fighter who unified IBF/WBA/WBC titles in addition to passing from champ to champ and 1 vs 2/1 vs 3 boxoffs. Without the lineal champ actually being defeated, the Ring belt could still be awarded to an undisputed champion. This accounts for the breakup of some previous lineages away from the Ring beltholder.
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#17
Old 04-16-2010, 08:31 PM
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Originally Posted by istmeno View Post
actually that is the way the ring title is decided. to re establish lineage you need 3 of the four major belts
Yeah you're right as far as I know. If the lineage has been vacated due to retirement or a fighter moving to another weight division then the only way lineage can be reestablished is if someone becomes undisputed champ by picking up all of the ABC belts.
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#18
Old 04-16-2010, 08:34 PM
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I always thought it was "linear" champion.

anyway, I already knew this as Shannon Briggs was once the linear HW champ after he beat Foreman despite not having any belt
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#19
Old 04-16-2010, 08:40 PM
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and to confuse matters for some ppl even more go to the bottom of Briggs' wiki page and it says lineal HW champshionship who he suceeded and who suceeded him, but clicking on that link goes to the damn Ring Championship. sheesh!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shannon_Briggs
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#20
Old 04-16-2010, 08:40 PM
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Originally Posted by jrosales13 View Post
In some situations you're the lineal champion but are not the ring champion or vice versa.
the ring's champions are what THEY consider lineal champions.
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