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#1
Old 03-05-2010, 03:16 AM
Bacatit
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Default How do class rankings work ? (non biased thread)

I was just watching part 3 of the Mayweather Mosley Press Conference and I notice they called Floyd one of the greatest WW of all time. I also know Pac is considered one of the greatest WW's of all time.

My question is If a guy is constantly changing weight classes are the judge by where they end up or where they started off or somewhere in between ?

For instance B-Hop has been a MW champ forever if Pac or Floyd moved up to MW having won there next bouts (Clottey/Shane), then retire after winning the majority of 6/7 fights at MW how will they be classified. They can't honestly be compared to B-Hop at MW and neither would have put in much work at Jr. WW/WW.

The same can be said for Roy and B-Hop , Roy was one of the best MW boxers ever but spent less time at MW, however Roy went on become a HW champion before his demise. Who's the higher ranking MW and how will that be determined ?
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#2
Old 03-05-2010, 03:20 AM
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Pac isnt even close to being one of the greatest welters of all time. Fighting 3 guys in a division isnt exactly an intense body of work. Neither floyd nor pac right now are considered ATG in that particular division, its just an exaggeration.
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#3
Old 03-05-2010, 03:21 AM
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The way I judge it is where you did your best work at. Floyd IMO did his best work at 130. I rank him #2 at 130 of all time. I don't think neither Floyd or Pac are all time great WWs. I rank Hopkins as ATG at MW not at LHW. I don't rank Pac in any top 10 in any weight-class. Just cuz he never set up shop and put in work at one weight-class. Maybe he is top 10 at 130... Maybe...
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#4
Old 03-05-2010, 03:23 AM
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Originally Posted by El Jesus View Post
Pac isnt even close to being one of the greatest welters of all time. Fighting 3 guys in a division isnt exactly an intense body of work. Neither floyd nor pac right now are considered ATG in that particular division, its just an exaggeration.
You don't consider Floyd an ATG at 130? I agree about the rest of the weight-class. But, I thought Floyd has a tremendous body of work at 130... I only have Alexis Arguello ahead of Floyd at 130.
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#5
Old 03-05-2010, 03:23 AM
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Originally Posted by jrosales13 View Post
The way I judge it is where you did your best work at. Floyd IMO did his best work at 130. I rank him #2 at 130 of all time. I don't think neither Floyd or Pac are all time great WWs. I rank Hopkins as ATG at MW not at LHW. I don't rank Pac in any top 10 in any weight-class. Just cuz he never set up shop and put in work at one weight-class. Maybe he is top 10 at 130... Maybe...
What about Roy vs B-Hop MW ATG same scenario or does the fighter make a difference ?
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#6
Old 03-05-2010, 03:24 AM
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Originally Posted by jrosales13 View Post
You don't consider Floyd an ATG at 130? I agree about the rest of the weight-class. But, I thought Floyd has a tremendous body of work at 130... I only have Alexis Arguello ahead of Floyd at 130.
im talking about welterweight.
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#7
Old 03-05-2010, 03:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bacatit View Post
I was just watching part 3 of the Mayweather Mosley Press Conference and I notice they called Floyd one of the greatest WW of all time. I also know Pac is considered one of the greatest WW's of all time.

My question is If a guy is constantly changing weight classes are the judge by where they end up or where they started off or somewhere in between ?

For instance B-Hop has been a MW champ forever if Pac or Floyd moved up to MW having won there next bouts (Clottey/Shane), then retire after winning the majority of 6/7 fights at MW how will they be classified. They can't honestly be compared to B-Hop at MW and neither would have put in much work at Jr. WW/WW.

The same can be said for Roy and B-Hop , Roy was one of the best MW boxers ever but spent less time at MW, however Roy went on become a HW champion before his demise. Who's the higher ranking MW ?
Nobody considers Pacquiao one of the all-time greats at WW. I don't really think too many will rank Mayweather very highly all-time at WW either, at least not right now. People say a lot of things for promotional purposes.

Mayweather ranks high all-time at 130, but spent too little time at 135, 140, and 154 to be ranked highly all-time there, and needs to do more at 147 to go with the greats in a division with rich history.

On some rare occassions, I've seen people actually rank guys at one division because of what they did above that, but I don't agree. I think it's strictly what you did in that division. Michael Spinks is one of the great LHWs because of beating guys like Eddie Mustafa Muhammad, Dwight Qawi, Marvin Johnson, the Davis brothers, etc...and the ability he showed there. I don't think it matters at all that he beat Larry Holmes at HW, that's another division that has no place IMO on how he should be ranked at LHW.

Roy Jones usually doesn't rank very highly at MW all-time, however I've seen him ranked highly by some historians. I'm more of the belief that your body of work means more than mythical head-to-head matchups, surely those who rank Jones very highly at MW are taking into account H2H matchups. Jones beat B-Hop at 160 but other than that his body of work at 160 isn't very strong. Beating Toney, Ruiz, all those LHW contenders, etc...shouldn't matter regarding his ranking all-time at 160.
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#8
Old 03-05-2010, 03:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Bacatit View Post
What about Roy and B-Hop ?
B-hop is in the top 10 ATG MW but not at 175. Roy is tricky. Roy does not rank amongst the ATG's at 160 or 168... I think he does rank in the top 15 all time at 175
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Old 03-05-2010, 03:25 AM
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Floyd is the best Super Feather Weight ever IMO. Neither are ATG WW's.
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#10
Old 03-05-2010, 03:27 AM
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im talking about welterweight.
My bad, I misreaded... I thought it said in any particular division. But, it clearly says at that particular weight-class.
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