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#1
Old 08-05-2009, 02:11 PM
boxingbuff
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Default Roberto Duran vs SRR at Welterweight

The Roberto Duran of the 1st fight with SRL at welterweight vs SRR at welterweight who was 126-1?

I believe that was Roberto Duran's greatest fight of his career.

The Duuuuuran of that fight vs SRR at welterweight?
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#2
Old 08-05-2009, 03:16 PM
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Roberto Duran was alot harder to hit than most people think.SRL said so himself.

That being the case,and allowing Duran to put pressure on SRR I believe it would be a good fight.I believe Duran would be able to go to the body,and thus enable him to go to the head as well.Of course SRR would also be going to both the head and body.But Duran is as tough as they come.I see Duran going the distance,and putting up a better fight than most people think.

I see SRR winning a UD 8-6-1,9-6,and 9-6.

Any thoughts?
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#3
Old 08-05-2009, 03:27 PM
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I'll go with Ray, I think that he would have the discipline to avoid fighting the fight that Leonard did. Leonard was angered at Duran's insults to his wife and simply couldn't believe that a lightweight coming up to welterweight could possibly be as strong as himself. Thats why he fought Duran toe to toe, it was a close fight but Duran deserved it.

Robinson would start on his bike hitting and moving the moment he realised that he couldn't out muscle Duran. I doubt we'd see a 'no mas' as in Leonard 2 but I've got a feeling Robinson would clinch the decision by two or three rounds. Tough fight though, I rate Duran higher than La Motta.
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#4
Old 08-05-2009, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Sugarj View Post
I'll go with Ray, I think that he would have the discipline to avoid fighting the fight that Leonard did. Leonard was angered at Duran's insults to his wife and simply couldn't believe that a lightweight coming up to welterweight could possibly be as strong as himself. Thats why he fought Duran toe to toe, it was a close fight but Duran deserved it.

Robinson would start on his bike hitting and moving the moment he realised that he couldn't out muscle Duran. I doubt we'd see a 'no mas' as in Leonard 2 but I've got a feeling Robinson would clinch the decision by two or three rounds. Tough fight though, I rate Duran higher than La Motta.
Yeah,i remember Duran giving Ray's wife the finger and cussing her out.

Duran beat Carlos Palimino at welterweight before taking on SRL.He was no push over.

I don't believe it mattered how SRL fought Duran the 1st time.Duran wanted him BAD!! Duran just won the biggest fight of his life and.....It would take me to long to type everything i want to say about Duran,and THE 2ND FIGHT.I'm a very slow typer.I will try to post more on this later.

BTW- I rate Duran the 2nd best fighter of all-time pound for pound
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#5
Old 08-05-2009, 06:06 PM
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Originally Posted by boxingbuff View Post
I don't believe it mattered how SRL fought Duran the 1st time.Duran wanted him BAD!! Duran just won the biggest fight of his life and.....It would take me to long to type everything i want to say about Duran,and THE 2ND FIGHT.I'm a very slow typer.I will try to post more on this later.

BTW- I rate Duran the 2nd best fighter of all-time pound for pound
Of course it matters. He did better in the fight when he was on the balls of his feet. He got in trouble when he was flat footed. And I still had Leonard winning that fight despite the verdict. Some of the scores of that fight honestly gave Duran every remotely close round. There were quite a few of those... And since this was a topic a couple days ago, let's not forget Panama Lewis was in that corner that night.

Rating Duran #2 p4p is extreme. He stopped being a disciplined fighter after he left Lightweight. Ie, he was undisciplined most of his career, and it showed in the ring. His shortcomings cannot be over looked.
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#6
Old 08-05-2009, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Sugarj View Post
I'll go with Ray, I think that he would have the discipline to avoid fighting the fight that Leonard did. Leonard was angered at Duran's insults to his wife and simply couldn't believe that a lightweight coming up to welterweight could possibly be as strong as himself. Thats why he fought Duran toe to toe, it was a close fight but Duran deserved it.

Robinson would start on his bike hitting and moving the moment he realised that he couldn't out muscle Duran. I doubt we'd see a 'no mas' as in Leonard 2 but I've got a feeling Robinson would clinch the decision by two or three rounds. Tough fight though, I rate Duran higher than La Motta.
I do as well but LaMotta at 160 (or 170 as he came in at to his fights) may be a tougher task for Robinson than Duran at 147. LaMotta was a good inside technician himself, and absolutely relentless in his attack, he also had around 20 lbs on Robinson by fight time.

I doubt we would see a "no mas" because Robinson would come to fight as he always did. He could go to war but always had the fight in control under any circumstances.

"Bobo" Olson was another good inside fighter but Robinson seemed to handle him pretty well even in their toughest fight (the rematch):



Of course there was Fritzie Zivic who knew all the tricks, but Zivic went onto say that everything he ever did, Robinson did better.

Armstrong was not as shot as he is made out to have been in my view. He was of course nowhere near the Armstrong of old, but he was still the number 1 ranked WW contender with recent wins over Sammy Angott, Fritzie Zivic, Willie Joyce, Juan Zurita and Tippy Larkin.

Sammy Angott by the way was yet another great spoiler/inside fighter. Robinson dominated him in three fights.

Last edited by TheGreatA; 08-05-2009 at 06:22 PM.
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#7
Old 08-05-2009, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Obama View Post
Of course it matters. He did better in the fight when he was on the balls of his feet. He got in trouble when he was flat footed. And I still had Leonard winning that fight despite the verdict. Some of the scores of that fight honestly gave Duran every remotely close round. There were quite a few of those... And since this was a topic a couple days ago, let's not forget Panama Lewis was in that corner that night.

Rating Duran #2 p4p is extreme. He stopped being a disciplined fighter after he left Lightweight. Ie, he was undisciplined most of his career, and it showed in the ring. His shortcomings cannot be over looked.
ray arcel was the main man in the corner tho, he wouldent have allowed panama to cheat, becaz arcel was a good man who had been training champion fighters 30 years pryor to duran.
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#8
Old 08-05-2009, 09:43 PM
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Duran fought a great fight against Leonard but Robinson was the greatest welter bar none. Now duran against any lightweight is a conversation.
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#9
Old 08-05-2009, 09:54 PM
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Didn't roberto duran get his backside handed to him by a welterweight in journeyman crackhead kirkland laing? I seem to recall such a bout but I may have just dreamt of such a spectacle,Or does roberto and his fans have an excuse for that night?

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And I still had Leonard winning that fight despite the verdict.
Spoken like a true dunce.Next time you take a bath(first time for everything) take the toaster with you.


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Now duran against any lightweight is a conversation.
I read on eas*s*deb*xing that Jose Louis Castillo would stop a prime duran.Is this true?

Last edited by princemanspoper; 08-05-2009 at 09:57 PM.
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#10
Old 08-05-2009, 09:57 PM
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Spoken like a true dunce.Next time you take a bath(first time for everything) take the toaster with you.
If you don't think that fight was close, you're the dunce. Plenty of people thought Leonard won. I have my scorecard here:

*Round 1: 10 ***8211; 10 Even
Not much to choose from this round. No one really deserved to win it. Leonard didn't do much, and Duran was mostly ineffective with what he did.

Round 2: 9 ***8211; 10 Duran
Big round for Duran, he buckles Leonard early and possibly hurts him once more later in the round. Leonard has his moments near the end, but didn't do enough.

Round 3: 9 ***8211; 10 Duran
Duran continues to beat Leonard's ass again this round, hurting him in the early going.

*Round 4: 9 ***8211; 10 Duran
Once again, early in the round Leonard is caught and hurt by Duran's big right hand. That's 3 rounds in a row that he hasn't been able to avoid it, not looking good for Leonard at all. Afterwards the two exchange good body work back and forth, edge Leonard. And at the end of the round, there are some flurries and big shots landed by both fighters. Leonard appeared to get the best of it here as well (barely). So, what started as a big round for Duran, ended up pretty damn close. ...But Duran still won.

Round 5: 10 ***8211; 9 Leonard
Even round until the end, where Leonard finally put a meaningful combination together that actually made Duran back up a little.

Round 6: 10 ***8211; 9 Leonard
Leonard tied Duran up pretty well the entire round, and put together some bull**** shoe shining punches along with a couple decent hooks that gave him this round clearly.

*Round 7: 10 ***8211; 9 Leonard
Leonard continues his tactics from the last round, but Duran is given more freedom to work in this round, most notably the second half. First half of the round was Leonard's, second half even.

*Round 8: 9 ***8211; 10 Duran
Close round. When Leonard uses his jab, he's in control and winning the round. Problem is, he isn't consistent. And when he stops using it, Duran closes the distance and lands his big bombs. Leonard is usually even with Duran on the inside, up until the end of the round. At the end, Duran clearly got the harder punches in (most notably that sucker right hand).

Round 9: 9 ***8211; 10 Duran
Leonard took a lot of this round off, and Duran just outworked him. Duran did a very job of slipping underneath of Leonard's punches this round.

Round 10: 10 ***8211; 9 Leonard
Competitive but clear round for Leonard. He utilized his boxing ability well and managed to not get caught with any huge punches, aside from a couple decent body shots.

Round 11: 10 ***8211; 9 Leonard
This round was all combinations. Aside from body positioning and head movement, defense was pretty much out the window. Leonard won it because he was busier.

*Round 12: 10 ***8211; 10 Even
I saw nothing to indicate either fighter really won this round.

*Round 13: 9 ***8211; 10 Duran
Wow. Not much in the first half of the round aside from a big left hook by Duran, but the second half? Bomb, after bomb, after bomb, after bomb. Leonard took a terrible amount of punishment in the second half of this round despite the back and forth action, YET, Leonard managed to finish stronger and even hurt Duran. But, it wasn't enough to steal the round. I'm actually rather baffled at how Leonard seemed to walk through all the big punches Duran hit him with this round.

Round 14: 10 ***8211; 9 Leonard
Leonard's determination from the end of the last round continued over into this one. Duran also seemingly took his foot off the gas this round. In response, Leonard put his signature on the round via ***8220;his***8221; famous bolo punch.

Round 15: 10 ***8211; 9 Leonard
Um, Duran apparently thought he was way ahead in this round, because he decided he didn't have to through any punches. Leonard won the round on activity alone.


Final Score: 7 ***8211; 6 ***8211; 2 Leonard (144 ***8211; 143)


Score Variances:
Scoring all the starred rounds to fighter 1: 12 ***8211; 3 Leonard
Scoring all the starred rounds even: 6 ***8211; 3 ***8211; 6 Leonard
Scoring all the starred rounds to fighter 2: 6 ***8211; 9 Duran
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