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#11
Old 04-13-2009, 05:44 PM
Stab Judah
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Originally Posted by Southpaw16bf View Post
Unless Johnson made another remark about it, but i belive Gene Tunney made the remark of Joe Louis not being a bright boy here's his exact words ''Not a very bright boy'' said Tunney
Could have been a misquote I heard it on either the Jack Johnson doc or the Joe Louis one.
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#12
Old 04-13-2009, 05:47 PM
Stab Judah
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Originally Posted by Southpaw16bf View Post
Some seem to be, but not all. George Foreman claims that Lennox Lewis is the best heavyweight of all time, and said this while Lennox was still a active fighter.
Yeah I didn't mean all of them.
That's why I like George he gives credit if deserved.
Holmes on the other hand I love as a boxer but I can't listen to anything he says.
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#13
Old 04-13-2009, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Southpaw16bf View Post
Some seem to be, but not all. George Foreman claims that Lennox Lewis is the best heavyweight of all time, and said this while Lennox was still a active fighter.
George has a different one every week.
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#14
Old 04-13-2009, 06:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Southpaw Stinger View Post
George has a different one every week.
Maybe, but i have heard Foreman say Lewis is the best on a good few occasions.
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#15
Old 04-13-2009, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Southpaw16bf View Post
Maybe, but i have heard Foreman say Lewis is the best on a good few occasions.
I've heard him say Louis, Lewis, Ali, Marciano ...

Depends who he's talking to I suppose.
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#16
Old 04-13-2009, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by RelliK View Post
Yeah I didn't mean all of them.
That's why I like George he gives credit if deserved.
Holmes on the other hand I love as a boxer but I can't listen to anything he says.
Yeah at times Holmes can be hard to listen to. In his book ''Agianst The Odds'' he says Mike Tyson cound't of been a sparring parthers for the fighters of the era he was involved in. Which is pretty silly, so Mike Tyson cound't of been a sparring parther for Earnie Shavers???

I think a prime ''trained'' Mike Tyson would of handled Shavers without much trouble to be onest.

But other than that his book is a real good read.

Last edited by Southpaw16bf; 04-13-2009 at 07:57 PM.
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#17
Old 04-13-2009, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by TheManchine View Post
Jack Johnson was the advisor of number 7 ranked heavyweight contender named Leroy Haynes who fought some of the best contenders in his time and twice knocked out former heavyweight champion Primo Carnera.
** Great images as always. JJ looks like some kind of eggheaded alien. He really went to pot pretty fast which contrasted the only part of his body that didn't shrink, his outsized noggin.

Some context with Primo. The Haynes fights were of the last 3 of his career, including his last one against a novice who'd never won a single fight, the only fight he ever won. Primo was the only name Haynes, who was a game journeyman, that was the sole shining moment in his career.

Primo had a kidney disease and was diabetic. He has a kidney removed two years after the Hayne's fights. He was fighting as a sick man after his manager ran off with all his dough. See Tony Tucker and Mike Tyson to see how that plays out.

As far as what Johnson thought about Joe, Joe was like everyone Johnson ever met. Johnson saw opportunity to get something out of Joe, either talk Joe into ousting Blackburn and hiring Johnson, or allowing Johnson a title shot.

The dismissal of Joe only came after Blackburn and Louis kicked Johnson out of Joe's training camp. He was quite jealous of the attention Joe got where in the past JJ belonged to an exclusive club.

As to Flaws, Joe has less flaws than did Johnson who fought very defensively to protect a glass jaw which reduced his win totals. The irony of Johnson's death, speeding and crashing his car on the way to the Louis/Conn rematch is telling as to how important Louis actually was to him.
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#18
Old 04-13-2009, 08:15 PM
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I'd see Louis knocking out Johnson quite early, speaking of technical flaws - Johnson had horrible punching technique. Louis on the other hand had nice short and sharp punches.
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#19
Old 04-13-2009, 09:04 PM
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Johnson may have weakness (Like all fighters do) But he had more natrual ability than other pre World War 2 Heavyweight. Johnson could pick off incoming flack from the air while placing his own blows, virtually in the same movement.

Johnson also had a amazing skill set, as well as a great boxing brain. He was also stronger than his comtemporaries, including the 227 Jim Jeffiries (Do Jeffries was past his prime) whom he outmuscled up close and outboxed at range.

He often carried opponets, but possessed underrated knockout power in both hands. Between 1901 and 1926 his only losses in 87 bouts were a DQ loss against Joe Jeannette(Whom he twice beat) a points loss to Marvin Hart (Certainly a thrown fight) and a 26 round stoppage to Jess Willard, when Johnson was 37 and well past his best. Ubeliveable Stat.

But like i said Johnson like all fighter's had weakness. Johnson was often a lazy trainer and never liked to train. And 5 stoppage defeats in 113 fights does suggest he never had the hardest chin. When Champ he also drew the colour line on his own race, as he felt to risky and not enough money to fights the likes of Langford again.

But in my mind, there is no taking away Jack Johnson was a specail fighter.
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#20
Old 04-13-2009, 09:09 PM
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I'd see Louis knocking out Johnson quite early, speaking of technical flaws - Johnson had horrible punching technique. Louis on the other hand had nice short and sharp punches.
You say Johnson had horrible punching technique. Johnson actually had great accuracy and timing. You probaly don't understand that Johnson came from a era of pre combination punching and and era of single blows and incessant clinching.

But we have to look at that era's style, and for Johnson's era his Technique was brillant.

When Joe Louis was about combinations punching had come around and techniques etc.
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