Rashad evans

[BoxingGenius27]

LMAO how can rashad be better then machida when he lost to him? that guy is a clown

1. ELO proves everything for me. It's a non biased, no feelings, statistical based evaluator..

2. If you READ, you will know that this argument had nothing to do with Rashad being better than Machida. There you go, jumpin in **** and trolling again.

3. If you also READ, you would see that Harry Balls says wins over an opponent doesn't mean he's better. You're the real clown

[BoxingGenius27]

To discredit Rashad is one thing. But to discredit a non-opinionated machine only going off facts is showing obvious bias on your part.

[BoxingGenius27]

LMAO how can rashad be better then machida when he lost to him? that guy is a clown

We all know how STUPID Gucci Mane and Waka Flaka are. Here's a tip, just listen to the music. Stop being stupid like them.

[BoxingGenius27]

Thats really not my argument. Greatness does not necessarily rely on h2h results.

The fact that Machidas resume is better combined with him beating Rashad puts him over the top for me.

Here's my other point.

You discredit Rashad for losing in his first title defense. But you list Shogun and Machida as your ATG's when they did the exact same thing! Granite Machida won a controversial decision over Shogun, but he got KO'd in his very next bout. Same applies to Shogun. Not to mention Shogun really hasn't fought anyone since being in the UFC besides Machida.

But according to you, when Shogun loses it's because of his knee injury. But it's ok when he knocks Machida's head off... Oh no knee problems there. Of course not, it's only knee problems when he loses. See this is the biased stuff that I'm talking about...

We're not even going to talk about Jones. Yes jones is a very unique talent. But he hasn't defended the belt either and you're ranking him over Rashad.

See, this is why I refer to ELO. Fact based, non opinionated, and no personal feelings are involved. Point proven.

[BoxingGenius27]

Shogun had double knee surgeries and gassed in the second round to both coleman and forrest, two extremely mediocre fighters currently.

Here's something I wrote during the Shogun vs Evans Pre-fight hype:

Why is that when Shogun wins a fight, it's the greatest thing since sliced bread?
But when he loses a fight or doesn't live up to expectations, it's because he was injured (i.e Griffin/Coleman)?

I just need clarification because it seems like after Rashad beats Shogun (UD or TKO), the road has already been paved for a "Shogun was injured and had a long layoff" excuse. People will completely forget about the fact that Rashad hasn't fought in a year either.

NOTE: Last time I checked, MMA fighters fight injured all the time. When you see a fighter going into a fight with a black eye, I'm sure it's not because they woke up on the wrong side of the bed.


THIS JUST IN: You heard it from the horse's mouth. The man, the myth, Muricio 'Shogun' Rua himself:

Shogun Talks Loss To Griffin, Knee Surgery, More (There's an article link)


I was really very sad about the fight," said Rua. "It was the worse defeat of my career. I had never gassed as I gassed in this fight. But I have no excuses the error was mine. I did not train as well as I should have, I did not concentrate enough. I learned a lesson from this and now i will have to train to comeback stronger."

"In the fight, my goal was to strike with Griffin and look for the knockout, but in doing this I became very tired. As i gassed, I wanted to take the fight on the ground, in a top position. At the beginning, the objective was to fight standing and to win the fight there, but as the time went by I got very tired."


Now, what's the excuse?

[Barry Halls]

Here's my other point.

You discredit Rashad for losing in his first title defense. But you list Shogun and Machida as your ATG's when they did the exact same thing! Granite Machida won a controversial decision over Shogun, but he got KO'd in his very next bout. Same applies to Shogun. Not to mention Shogun really hasn't fought anyone since being in the UFC besides Machida.

But according to you, when Shogun loses it's because of his knee injury. But it's ok when he knocks Machida's head off... Oh no knee problems there. Of course not, it's only knee problems when he loses. See this is the biased stuff that I'm talking about...

We're not even going to talk about Jones. Yes jones is a very unique talent. But he hasn't defended the belt either and you're ranking him over Rashad.

See, this is why I refer to ELO. Fact based, non opinionated, and no personal feelings are involved. Point proven.

I'm gonna keep this extremely short and sweet. This is taking up more time, than i get enjoyment from it. I appreciate the debate, but It's just grown into mammoth size.

No, i do not rate them higher than Rashad based ONLY on defenses. But title defenses is an accomplishment when i rate someones greatness. It's hard to keep on to the title, fighting the highest rated competition.
It's only ONE factor.

Shoguns knee problems and subsequent surgeries is common knowledge, readily available on the internet.
Why does he gas in 1 rounds to coleman and forrest yet goes 5 rounds with Machida a year later and look completely healthy?
Double knee surgeries is no joke.

I don't rank Jones over Rashad in terms of ATG greatness. I rate him over Rashad in a current h2h ranking.
But if Jones manage to get about 2 more solid wins against Rampage and Rashad hes without a doubt higher ranked in ATG race than Rashad. Hes not CURRENTLY though.

I explained my reluctance to using elo-system in a previous post, and you should really see the flaws yourselfs when going through the rankings.

[BoxingGenius27]

I'm gonna keep this extremely short and sweet. This is taking up more time, than i get enjoyment from it. I appreciate the debate, but It's just grown into mammoth size.

No, i do not rate them higher than Rashad based ONLY on defenses. But title defenses is an accomplishment when i rate someones greatness. It's hard to keep on to the title, fighting the highest rated competition.
It's only ONE factor.

Shoguns knee problems and subsequent surgeries is common knowledge, readily available on the internet.
Why does he gas in 1 rounds to coleman and forrest yet goes 5 rounds with Machida a year later and look completely healthy?
Double knee surgeries is no joke.

I don't rank Jones over Rashad in terms of ATG greatness. I rate him over Rashad in a current h2h ranking.
But if Jones manage to get about 2 more solid wins against Rampage and Rashad hes without a doubt higher ranked in ATG race than Rashad. Hes not CURRENTLY though.

I explained my reluctance to using elo-system in a previous post, and you should really see the flaws yourselfs when going through the rankings.

I agree. Let's just agree to disagree on this one.....

[Barry Halls]

Agreed, good debate.

[Bacatit]

Watch they're first fight.

Evans had a tough time because Tito was a really good wrestler as well and made for a boring but interesting fight.

That being said Evans has improved and switched camps while Tito has been out for a while he is a legend in the UFC and had a great showing last time out !!!

I would say Evans wins because there is a bit of biased hope involved there and I like Tito so I wouldn't hate on the come back either way it goes.

[BoxingGenius27]

Rashad Evans, UFC Light Heavyweight GOAT!